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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   testing eye drops (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1355926-testing-eye-drops.html)

LtKernelPanic Jun 16, 2012 3:38 pm

Not a chance in Satan's realm would I let a TSO open my sealed meds let alone
stick something in it that could contaminate it. I would be screaming for a supervisor.


Originally Posted by T.J. Bender (Post 18763260)
I've never seen them randomly test people's drinks on the sterile side. I have, however, seen a TSO go ballistic on a poor, unsuspecting passenger who had their own water bottle filled during a gate check. Apparently the concept of filling your empty bottle at a water fountain is foreign to them, as they wanted to know how the bottle had made it through security before making the usual "I'll remember you" threat and confiscating the bottle.

For the record, it was a 32 oz. Nalgene. Very nice bottle. Makes you wonder if the TSO was going hiking that weekend.

I would have demaned a three striper before letting them take it. I always take one of my Camelbak bottles and have never had an issue. On my last flight the TSA was playing the gate check game (before boarding I only saw them pull aside a big chested blonde and a black Muslim guy. Imaging that :rolleyes:) and walked by three of them carrying my full bottle in plain sight without them even blinking. On another trip I asked one of them that was standing around (again imagine that) if there was a nearby fountain so I didn't have to walk all the back down by the restrooms to fill it. To my surprised he pointed one out that was semi-hidden that I had walked by and missed. Maybe I've just been lucky.

TSORon Jun 18, 2012 12:48 pm


Originally Posted by knwl9 (Post 18744053)
can they open medication like this and put something in them to test it, would not like to put the drops in my eyes after they have contaminated the drops with an unknown substance

Our test equipment does not require actually touching the liquid, so there is no reason to put a drop of it anywhere, it can remain in its container.

Just because you say it’s a medicine does not give it a free pass. Could be any kind of liquid in the bottle, and “factory seals” can be fakes. Testing is the best option available at the checkpoint.

Combat Medic Jun 18, 2012 1:04 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 18777454)
Our test equipment does not require actually touching the liquid, so there is no reason to put a drop of it anywhere, it can remain in its container.

Just because you say it’s a medicine does not give it a free pass. Could be any kind of liquid in the bottle, and “factory seals” can be fakes. Testing is the best option available at the checkpoint.

Even if the testing destroys the item being tested?

BubbaLoop Jun 18, 2012 2:26 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 18777454)
Our test equipment does not require actually touching the liquid, so there is no reason to put a drop of it anywhere, it can remain in its container.

I will repeat here what I have already stated: There is no test strip that can detect peroxides in the air above a liquid flask. Methodologically it is simply unavailable (and I state this as a professional).

ETD of swabs on the outside of a flask could detect peroxides, but not test strips waved in the air. That is pure security theater.

lovely15 Jun 18, 2012 2:34 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 18777454)
Could be any kind of liquid in the bottle, and “factory seals” can be fakes. Testing is the best option available at the checkpoint.

Yes, because 99.9999999% of people are carrying contraband aboard an aircraft. Can't wait until TSA kills a diabetic in-flight by ruining their insulin or something.

Does anyone in the TSA even have a risk-management background?

Caradoc Jun 18, 2012 2:38 pm


Originally Posted by lovely15 (Post 18778103)
Can't wait until TSA kills a diabetic in-flight by ruining their insulin or something.

Or just stealing it.

Wally Bird Jun 18, 2012 8:25 pm


Originally Posted by lovely15 (Post 18778103)
Does anyone in the TSA even have a risk-management background?

Or anything remotely relevant?

MaximumSisu Jun 21, 2012 9:52 am


Originally Posted by BubbaLoop (Post 18778064)
I will repeat here what I have already stated: There is no test strip that can detect peroxides in the air above a liquid flask. Methodologically it is simply unavailable (and I state this as a professional).

ETD of swabs on the outside of a flask could detect peroxides, but not test strips waved in the air. That is pure security theater.

Don't confuse TSO's with facts. It makes their heads hurt.

Caradoc Jun 21, 2012 10:52 am


Originally Posted by MaximumSisu (Post 18795601)
Don't confuse TSO's with facts. It makes their heads hurt.

Hardly. Facts don't bother them, because they simply deny reason.

Pesky Monkey Jun 21, 2012 9:07 pm


Originally Posted by BubbaLoop (Post 18778064)
I will repeat here what I have already stated: There is no test strip that can detect peroxides in the air above a liquid flask. Methodologically it is simply unavailable (and I state this as a professional).

ETD of swabs on the outside of a flask could detect peroxides, but not test strips waved in the air. That is pure security theater.


Pesky Monkey Jun 21, 2012 9:09 pm


Originally Posted by BubbaLoop (Post 18778064)
I will repeat here what I have already stated: There is no test strip that can detect peroxides in the air above a liquid flask. Methodologically it is simply unavailable (and I state this as a professional).

ETD of swabs on the outside of a flask could detect peroxides, but not test strips waved in the air. That is pure security theater.

Sorry, but you can't fight terrorism with facts and science. You need magic.

TSORon Jun 29, 2012 11:39 am


Originally Posted by Combat Medic (Post 18777548)
Even if the testing destroys the item being tested?

Such as?


Originally Posted by BubbaLoop (Post 18778064)
I will repeat here what I have already stated: There is no test strip that can detect peroxides in the air above a liquid flask. Methodologically it is simply unavailable (and I state this as a professional).

Believe what you like, no one here is going to stop you. I have used the strips and can say as a professional that they work just fine. Peroxides are the easiest to detect, some others not so much.

You might want to look over the link. I have used this one several times, its an interesting little device that worked but didn’t quite meet TSA’s needs.

Here is another one that is in use in many airports, read that link as well. Its always nice to have the facts available.

Here are some others:
http://www.plexsci.com/products/dete...ection/dropex/
http://spie.org/x86552.xml
http://www.xplosafe.com/national-security.html

And these are just a few, not a comprehensive list at all.


Originally Posted by BubbaLoop (Post 18778064)
ETD of swabs on the outside of a flask could detect peroxides, but not test strips waved in the air. That is pure security theater.

The proof has been provided for you. Its common technology that utilizes liquid vapors of the different chemicals. You “might” want to rethink your “professional opinion” just a bit and do some more research.

Mad_Max_Esq Jun 29, 2012 12:00 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 18843282)
Such as?



Believe what you like, no one here is going to stop you. I have used the strips and can say as a professional that they work just fine. Peroxides are the easiest to detect, some others not so much.

You might want to look over the link. I have used this one several times, its an interesting little device that worked but didn’t quite meet TSA’s needs.

Here is another one that is in use in many airports, read that link as well. Its always nice to have the facts available.

Here are some others:
http://www.plexsci.com/products/dete...ection/dropex/
http://spie.org/x86552.xml
http://www.xplosafe.com/national-security.html

And these are just a few, not a comprehensive list at all.



The proof has been provided for you. Its common technology that utilizes liquid vapors of the different chemicals. You “might” want to rethink your “professional opinion” just a bit and do some more research.

Did you read the information in the links you provided? The vapor detection, i.e., contactless, systems do not indicate that they can test for peroxide. The systems that can test for peroxide all describe dropping the liquid on a strip or other testing mechanism, i.e., contacting the liquid. So, what "proof" has been provided to show Bubba is incorrect?

Combat Medic Jun 29, 2012 12:08 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 18843282)
Such as?

Opening a factory sealed container will trigger a (usually) 30day expiration. If all of the containers are opened so that the test strips can be waived over them then those containers are on their way to being destroyed.

StanSimmons Jun 29, 2012 12:18 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 18843282)
Such as?



Believe what you like, no one here is going to stop you. I have used the strips and can say as a professional that they work just fine. Peroxides are the easiest to detect, some others not so much.

You might want to look over the link. I have used this one several times, its an interesting little device that worked but didn’t quite meet TSA’s needs.

Here is another one that is in use in many airports, read that link as well. Its always nice to have the facts available.

Here are some others:
http://www.plexsci.com/products/dete...ection/dropex/
http://spie.org/x86552.xml
http://www.xplosafe.com/national-security.html

And these are just a few, not a comprehensive list at all.



The proof has been provided for you. Its common technology that utilizes liquid vapors of the different chemicals. You “might” want to rethink your “professional opinion” just a bit and do some more research.

What are your professional credentials for chemical testing?


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