100 Nude-O-Scope images leaked

Old Nov 16, 2010, 9:50 am
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: MSN
Programs: AA ExPlat, 1MM; HHonors Gold; SPG Gold
Posts: 226
100 Nude-O-Scope images leaked

Link to an article just on Drudge...images are from machines used in an Orlando courthouse, and the resolution of the scans is pretty low, but this flies in the face of the "images can't be saved" excuse that's been used by the TSA...

http://gizmodo.com/5690749/
WNLuvr is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 9:55 am
  #2  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: PEK
Programs: UA Premier Silver, SPG Gold
Posts: 128
This is a red herring and is only likely to discredit opponents of the scanners. The video is from a US Marshals scanner at a Federal courthouse in Florida. Anyone can dismiss this by pointing out that it wasn't the TSA.

I'm with you on opposing the NOS -- I just don't think this will be a very effective propaganda piece for the anti-scanner/anti-grope crowd.
ORDinaryPax is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 9:56 am
  #3  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Programs: WN A++, Marriott Plat, Avis 1
Posts: 217
Originally Posted by WNLuvr
Link to an article just on Drudge...images are from machines used in an Orlando courthouse, and the resolution of the scans is pretty low, but this flies in the face of the "images can't be saved" excuse that's been used by the TSA...

http://gizmodo.com/5690749/
The images have been out for quite some time, you can see them over at EPIC. They're early generation millimeter wave stuff that were pretty much worthless at detecting anything. They're not the types of detailed images that are currently gathered at airports. I'm worried that people will see those blocky images and believe that's what TSOs see today at the airport, and decide it's not so bad after all...
VegasCableGuy is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 9:57 am
  #4  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: United States
Programs: UA, AA, DL, Amtrak
Posts: 4,647
Originally Posted by WNLuvr
this flies in the face of the "images can't be saved" excuse that's been used by the TSA...
The TSA doesn't operate security at the Orlando federal courthouse, so I'm not sure that's a relevant argument here. The TSA can easily say that their machines are not programmed to do that, and there's nothing here to prove them wrong. Plus, these images are so blurry and non-offensive compared to the airport NOS that many people will see this and say "So THAT'S what the fuss is about?", which could actually be counterproductive.
fairviewroad is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 10:06 am
  #5  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: MSN
Programs: AA ExPlat, 1MM; HHonors Gold; SPG Gold
Posts: 226
The title of the headline on Drudge is somewhat misleading too: "TSA XXX: NAKED BODY SCANS LEAK ONLINE"
WNLuvr is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 10:26 am
  #6  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Nashville, TN - BNA
Programs: Hilton Gold, WN RR
Posts: 1,818
Agreed that the bad image quality won't help us, but I don't think arguing the machines can save images is a bad thing. That fact has popped up in countless news articles this week alone.

Frankly, I think the onus is on TSA to prove that the machines have been disabled. According to the manufacturer* of the machines that made/saved the courthouse pictures, they come standard with USB and Ethernet ports.

(*You want the 'Gen 2 Product Sheet' link.)
divemistressofthedark is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 10:38 am
  #7  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: MLB, MCO
Programs: Delta Plat, IHG Plat, Marriott Silver
Posts: 1,315
Different agencies have different requirements. I don't believe the US Marshalls ever claimed that they weren't saving images.

I don't doubt that the TSA machines are capable from a hardware standpoint of saving images. I doubt they're lying though when they say that they don't save images. They were most likely delivered with that functionality disabled.
realjd is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 10:42 am
  #8  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 321
Originally Posted by realjd
Different agencies have different requirements. I don't believe the US Marshalls ever claimed that they weren't saving images.
the TSA has / still does.

Originally Posted by realjd
I don't doubt that the TSA machines are capable from a hardware standpoint of saving images. I doubt they're lying though when they say that they don't save images. .
Basic logical deduction [regarding the use of the body imaging, airport security] makes me doubtful - and who knows - without any code - what really goes on in the software level.
Travelsonic is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 10:50 am
  #9  
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: SEA/YVR/BLI
Programs: UA "Lifetime" Gold, AS MVPG100K, OW Emerald, HH Lifetime Diamond, IC Plat, Marriott Gold, Hertz Gold
Posts: 9,483
What individuals deduce, infer, or conclude will vary depending on the extent to which they generally trust government, and specifically trust a government to have any priorities higher than its own self-preservation.
Fredd is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 11:17 am
  #10  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: MLB, MCO
Programs: Delta Plat, IHG Plat, Marriott Silver
Posts: 1,315
From the L3 MMW website:
http://www.sds.l-3com.com/products/mmwave.htm
"Privacy Protection: ProVision offers multiple levels of privacy protection that can be customized to support customer-specific operational procedures."

It's not so much that I trust the TSA. I do trust L3 though to deliver scanners with saving disabled, provided that actually was one of the TSA's requirements. And L3 is perfectly up front about the fact that they can be configured for various levels of privacy.

As incompetent as the TSA is, how often have they flat-out lied about something? Knowing government agencies, if they DID save images and TSA didn't want us to know about it, they'd just tell us that the functionality of the machines is classified.
realjd is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 11:25 am
  #11  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Riverside County, CA
Posts: 277
Originally Posted by realjd
From the L3 MMW website:
http://www.sds.l-3com.com/products/mmwave.htm
"Privacy Protection: ProVision offers multiple levels of privacy protection that can be customized to support customer-specific operational procedures."

It's not so much that I trust the TSA. I do trust L3 though to deliver scanners with saving disabled, provided that actually was one of the TSA's requirements. And L3 is perfectly up front about the fact that they can be configured for various levels of privacy.

As incompetent as the TSA is, how often have they flat-out lied about something? Knowing government agencies, if they DID save images and TSA didn't want us to know about it, they'd just tell us that the functionality of the machines is classified.
The machine used in the pics and the video is a passive MMW machine. It uses no radiation.

If you notice on the floor, you'll see there's a circle. You have to spin around to get an image. Airports aren't like that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_EENmY0VNw This is a similar system.
Deinonychus is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 11:44 am
  #12  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: MLB, MCO
Programs: Delta Plat, IHG Plat, Marriott Silver
Posts: 1,315
Originally Posted by Deinonychus
The machine used in the pics and the video is a passive MMW machine. It uses no radiation.

If you notice on the floor, you'll see there's a circle. You have to spin around to get an image. Airports aren't like that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_EENmY0VNw This is a similar system.
The L3 system I linked to IS the one that TSA is using. So the Marshalls were using different equipment, from a completely different brand? How is that applicable to the TSA then?

What I don't get though is why the TSA insists on using the machines that display nude images instead of the ones with automatic threat detection:
http://www.sds.l-3com.com/advancedim...ovision-at.htm

Ignoring the radiation issue, I would have less qualms about going through the one that doesn't let someone look at my junk.
realjd is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 12:08 pm
  #13  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Riverside County, CA
Posts: 277
Originally Posted by realjd
The L3 system I linked to IS the one that TSA is using. So the Marshalls were using different equipment, from a completely different brand? How is that applicable to the TSA then?

What I don't get though is why the TSA insists on using the machines that display nude images instead of the ones with automatic threat detection:
http://www.sds.l-3com.com/advancedim...ovision-at.htm

Ignoring the radiation issue, I would have less qualms about going through the one that doesn't let someone look at my junk.
Crap, sorry. I misread your post.

However, you're right. Why are they using those L3 machines when they can instead use those that protect privacy better, and perhaps, be much less harmful?
Deinonychus is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 1:34 pm
  #14  
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Easton, CT, USA
Programs: ua prem exec, Former hilton diamond
Posts: 31,801
The TSA had their information already prepared it seems:

... Transportation Safety Administration would also be saving (and therefore potentially leaking) naked images of random passengers from airport screening lines across the country.

Not true, says a TSA spokesman.

"The (body image scanning) technology is sent to the airports without the ability to save, transmit or print the images," said Greg Soule, TSA spokesman, in an interview with CBSNews.com. "At airports, the images are examined by a security officer in a remote location, and, once the image is cleared, they're deleted."

The confusion over whether the TSA will be saving basically naked body images taken in airport security lines is based on the fact that some other police agencies -- like the U.S. Marshalls for example -- have saved body scan images. Soule insists, however, that the TSA does not, nor will they ever, do so.

...

Soule says EPIC makes that claim because the imaging machines used in the TSA Atlantic City testing lab are designed to store images for training purposes, but that those are the only machines that can do so.


From CBS - http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/...n7060608.shtml
cordelli is offline  
Old Nov 16, 2010, 8:28 pm
  #15  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: EWR
Programs: UA .5M, Vistana 1-Star owner
Posts: 992
I just read One Hundred Naked Citizens: One Hundred Leaked Body Scans as a friend recommended & I'm amazed that the continual lambasting of the TSA system as a bunch of lies to do anything it wishes with the quick self-justification of "security". So much for not being able to save those images; of course the government vendor did just what their client asked for. In this case, it's to save the images. I'm amazed the TSA's formal reply is able to somehow replace reality.
Richard Chen is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.