Whole Body Scanners Opt Out Stories [merged]
Nov 7, 2010, 4:17 pm
#558
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Northeast Kansas | Colorado Native
Programs: Amex Gold/Plat, UA *G, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott LT Gold, NEXUS, TSA Disparager Unobtanium
Posts: 21,603
For an answer, I'd rather be felt up than get cancer from trying to fly within my country.
Nov 7, 2010, 4:31 pm
#559
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 861
Nov 7, 2010, 4:33 pm
#560
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: BOS
Posts: 814
Here's part of an article that explains the radiation:
There are two types of machines -- millimeter wavelength imaging and backscatter X-ray scanners. Both are used to see under clothes and identify unusual objects.
Only one -- backscatter X-ray machines -- expose individuals to ionizing radiation such as that used in common medical X-rays.
But the radiation levels are well below the threshold that could be considered a risk to an individual's health, said Dr. James Thrall of the American College of Radiology and chief of radiology at Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston.
"All of the concerns that we have about the medical use of X-rays really don't apply to these devices," Thrall said in a telephone interview.
"The exposure is extremely low and the energy of the X-rays is also very, very low," he said.
"When X-rays are used for medical imaging purposes, they have to be energetic enough to get through the human body. The X-rays used in the backscatter machines in airports have such low energy that they literally bounce off the skin. That is what backscatter implies," Thrall said.
Only one -- backscatter X-ray machines -- expose individuals to ionizing radiation such as that used in common medical X-rays.
But the radiation levels are well below the threshold that could be considered a risk to an individual's health, said Dr. James Thrall of the American College of Radiology and chief of radiology at Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston.
"All of the concerns that we have about the medical use of X-rays really don't apply to these devices," Thrall said in a telephone interview.
"The exposure is extremely low and the energy of the X-rays is also very, very low," he said.
"When X-rays are used for medical imaging purposes, they have to be energetic enough to get through the human body. The X-rays used in the backscatter machines in airports have such low energy that they literally bounce off the skin. That is what backscatter implies," Thrall said.
Last edited by xSTRIKEx6864; Nov 7, 2010 at 4:40 pm
Nov 7, 2010, 4:49 pm
#561
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chicago
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 11,956
Nov 7, 2010, 5:48 pm
#562
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 69
I don't need to explain to you or to the TSA why I want to avoid going through the scanner.
For what it's worth, I was glad in a way to get the "pat-down" in public so others would see how ridiculous we've gotten. I also wasn't about to let my laptop leave my sight or control.
Nov 7, 2010, 7:12 pm
#563
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: MSP
Programs: Fallen Plats, ex-WN CP, DYKWIW; still a Hilton Diamond & Club Cholula™ R.I.P. Super Plats
Posts: 25,415
The "ignore" feature is our friend -- judicially applied it greatly reduces the noise-to-signal ratio.
Nov 7, 2010, 7:14 pm
#564
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 464
Nov 7, 2010, 7:23 pm
#565
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SEA
Posts: 2,556
"Bouncing off" indicates that it propels outward to somewhere. To where?
Nov 7, 2010, 8:56 pm
#567
Join Date: Dec 2004
Programs: HP/US Gold, Hilton Gold, Starwood Gold
Posts: 711
Nov 8, 2010, 2:23 am
#568
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,444
Seeing you are new around here, please read this letter (pdf) written by members of the National Academy of Scientists regarding the safety of these scanners.
Also, I have to say that personally, given two really bad options, I would rather be groped by a person in front of me than seen naked by a person I am not allowed to see. The seediness of having a person look at my electronically stripped body in an "undisclosed location" really bothers me.
Nov 8, 2010, 4:14 am
#569
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 66
What DOES Israel Do?
I've been lurking, but it's gone too far: too many Americans are being sold LIES by the TSA. I can see clearly, from these Golani hills (well, not in Golan now lol), that things have a much more sinister Intent than just 'security'. I do fear that the US is conditioning people for awful austerity measures coming in a few years, as the US is totally bankrupt and may need martial law for some time.
But that is another story!
Here's how it's done in Israel:
1) Profile them walking
2) Profile them talking
3) Profile them standing around
4) PROFILE!!!
I insist that EVERY American come to Israel, not just for fun, but also to see how it's done. There is NO TIME and NOT ENOUGH MONEY for ........ like the TSA. In Israel, here's a typical airport scene (say flying domestically, within Israel, which is like a 20 min flight
)
1) enter airport
2) security man asks you basic questions. He actually has an IQ > 110, and so there is none of this brain-dead commando-.... you get in the US, with the obnoxious "sir's" which are anything but!
3) if you trigger something during the interview, he gets more detailed. If not, you move on, scan the .... out of your luggage, and walk through the METAL detector WITH your shoes on.
4) There are dogs sniffing about... they are good at it... dogs >>> machines for sniffing!
5) Pat-downs are EXTREMELY -- EXTREMELY rare -- and if you trigger a grope, it's already too late by Israeli standards -- booooommm!
A friend of mine was on the flight with the shoe bomber: the shoe bomber was a complete meshugener, pacing around before the flight, REJECTED the first time for being so irascible and nuts, and then finally let aboard. HELLO??!! What is it with Anglo-Saxons and their determination to destroy themselves???
Americans need to defend their rights... very sad to see nation get broken like this.
edit: I know about austerity as I am a commodity trader for a living, and I've done the math: the US WILL -- WITH CERTAINTY -- IMPOSE AWFUL AUSTERITY ON ITS PEOPLE.
edit2: The TSA donkeys here would be mopping the floor, not protecting the people, in Israel. The US gov't doesn't value the lives of their own people. It's very sad.
But that is another story!
Here's how it's done in Israel:
1) Profile them walking
2) Profile them talking
3) Profile them standing around
4) PROFILE!!!
I insist that EVERY American come to Israel, not just for fun, but also to see how it's done. There is NO TIME and NOT ENOUGH MONEY for ........ like the TSA. In Israel, here's a typical airport scene (say flying domestically, within Israel, which is like a 20 min flight
)1) enter airport
2) security man asks you basic questions. He actually has an IQ > 110, and so there is none of this brain-dead commando-.... you get in the US, with the obnoxious "sir's" which are anything but!
3) if you trigger something during the interview, he gets more detailed. If not, you move on, scan the .... out of your luggage, and walk through the METAL detector WITH your shoes on.
4) There are dogs sniffing about... they are good at it... dogs >>> machines for sniffing!
5) Pat-downs are EXTREMELY -- EXTREMELY rare -- and if you trigger a grope, it's already too late by Israeli standards -- booooommm!
A friend of mine was on the flight with the shoe bomber: the shoe bomber was a complete meshugener, pacing around before the flight, REJECTED the first time for being so irascible and nuts, and then finally let aboard. HELLO??!! What is it with Anglo-Saxons and their determination to destroy themselves???
Americans need to defend their rights... very sad to see nation get broken like this.
edit: I know about austerity as I am a commodity trader for a living, and I've done the math: the US WILL -- WITH CERTAINTY -- IMPOSE AWFUL AUSTERITY ON ITS PEOPLE.
edit2: The TSA donkeys here would be mopping the floor, not protecting the people, in Israel. The US gov't doesn't value the lives of their own people. It's very sad.
Nov 8, 2010, 5:47 am
#570
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Colorado
Programs: Frontier EarlyReturns
Posts: 82
As pointed out by Dr. John Sedat, Dr. David Agard, Dr. Marc Shuman and Dr. Robert Stroud of UCSF, the problem is that the dose of radiation from the X-ray scanners is concentrated at the skin and adjacent tissue, while the radiation you get on a plane at high altitude is distributed through the volume of the entire body, so it's an extremely misleading comparison.