Feb 6, 2021, 10:30 pm
Last edit by: RNE
In early Feb-2021, Chase sent email to credit card holders about the changes to the section of "Cash-like" Transaction of the Cardmember Agreement. The changes take effect 4/7/2021.
4. Important Definitions
• The "Cash-like Transactions" section within the Important Definitions section of your Cardmember Agreement is replaced to clarify and expand the definition as follows:
WHAT IT MEANS: Cash-like transactions will be treated as cash advances. Cash-like transactions include, but are not limited to, the following transactions to the extent they are accepted:
• purchasing travelers checks, foreign currency, money orders, wire transfers, cryptocurrency, other similar digital or virtual currency and other similar transactions;
• purchasing lottery tickets, casino gaming chips, race track wagers, and similar offline and online betting transactions;
• person-to-person money transfers and account-funding transactions that transfer currency; and
• making a payment using a third party service including bill payment transactions not made directly with the merchant or their service provider.
Data Point of Chase charging cash advance fees on any transactions (before and after 4/7/2021)
•
•
•
Data Point of any credit card banks that charge cash advance fees on popular payment systems (Paypal, Plastiq, Venmo etc)
• Cash advance at bank branch, from credit card
• Bond or bail posted at court and police station
•
Word to the Wise: It may be advisable to contact Chase ahead of time to reduce your cash advance limit to a minimum on the card you intend to use.
4. Important Definitions
• The "Cash-like Transactions" section within the Important Definitions section of your Cardmember Agreement is replaced to clarify and expand the definition as follows:
WHAT IT MEANS: Cash-like transactions will be treated as cash advances. Cash-like transactions include, but are not limited to, the following transactions to the extent they are accepted:
• purchasing travelers checks, foreign currency, money orders, wire transfers, cryptocurrency, other similar digital or virtual currency and other similar transactions;
• purchasing lottery tickets, casino gaming chips, race track wagers, and similar offline and online betting transactions;
• person-to-person money transfers and account-funding transactions that transfer currency; and
• making a payment using a third party service including bill payment transactions not made directly with the merchant or their service provider.
Data Point of Chase charging cash advance fees on any transactions (before and after 4/7/2021)
•
•
•
Data Point of any credit card banks that charge cash advance fees on popular payment systems (Paypal, Plastiq, Venmo etc)
• Cash advance at bank branch, from credit card
• Bond or bail posted at court and police station
•
Word to the Wise: It may be advisable to contact Chase ahead of time to reduce your cash advance limit to a minimum on the card you intend to use.
New Chase 'cash-like' terms March 31, 2021
Feb 2, 2021, 3:13 pm
#16
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: SEA
Programs: DL DM
Posts: 289
One suggestion I saw was to call Chase and ask to manually reduce the Cash Advance limit on a card. At least for me, the only reason I would have a cash advance transaction would be on accident. So if you set your cash advance limit at $1000, and they consider pay1040 a cash advance transaction, the charge will not go through.
Feb 2, 2021, 3:21 pm
#17
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AA EXP, IHG Diamond, IC Amb
Posts: 5,510
I hope they don’t change this.
Feb 3, 2021, 9:59 am
#18
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: JZRO
Posts: 9,169
Feb 3, 2021, 10:07 am
#19
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 539
I believe tax payments should be fine based on the language as long as you use the IRS' official service providers for cc payments (PayUSAtax, Pay1040, or ACI Payments). I think you would run into trouble if you push your tax payment to the IRS via another provider such as Plastiq.
Feb 3, 2021, 10:20 am
#20
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: JZRO
Posts: 9,169
I believe tax payments should be fine based on the language as long as you use the IRS' official service providers for cc payments (PayUSAtax, Pay1040, or ACI Payments). I think you would run into trouble if you push your tax payment to the IRS via another provider such as Plastiq.
Feb 3, 2021, 10:26 am
#21
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Pacific Northwest
Programs: UA Gold 1MM, AS 75k, AA Plat, Bonvoyed Gold, Honors Dia, Hyatt Explorer, IHG Plat, ...
Posts: 16,846
I’ll send Chase a SM later today to ask for clarification about the tax payment providers.
Feb 3, 2021, 5:33 pm
#22
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: PDX|AKL|AMS|GVA|AGP|CPT - or somewhere in between
Programs: DL DM; 2MM
Posts: 2,418
These letters to my business accounts really got me worried.
Anyone else sending large business payments by means of Plastiq ?
My Plastiq payments - regardless of the fee hikes - came to > 7 figures per business credit card last year.
Perhaps make a move to Mastercard ?
Anyone else sending large business payments by means of Plastiq ?
My Plastiq payments - regardless of the fee hikes - came to > 7 figures per business credit card last year.
Perhaps make a move to Mastercard ?
Last edited by Travelomania; Feb 3, 2021 at 5:39 pm
Feb 3, 2021, 5:44 pm
#23
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,954
In response to my inquiry Chase sent an email repeating the contents of the email, and adding "We regret that we are unable to provide the list of all the third party services." I have replied.
Feb 3, 2021, 5:51 pm
#24
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: PDX|AKL|AMS|GVA|AGP|CPT - or somewhere in between
Programs: DL DM; 2MM
Posts: 2,418
Feb 4, 2021, 8:33 am
#25
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: TPA/DFW/K15
Programs: AA EXP, Mar AMB, HH LT DIA
Posts: 1,652
Feb 4, 2021, 8:36 am
#26
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: TPA/DFW/K15
Programs: AA EXP, Mar AMB, HH LT DIA
Posts: 1,652
How is that possible? Here's a new rule, but we can't tell you how we're going to apply it? How would the IT department flag the transactions. They have the list.
Feb 4, 2021, 8:54 am
#27
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Pacific Northwest
Programs: UA Gold 1MM, AS 75k, AA Plat, Bonvoyed Gold, Honors Dia, Hyatt Explorer, IHG Plat, ...
Posts: 16,846
Right. I named in my message specifically the three tax payment processors and asked if they are considered cash-like payments. No reply yet, but I expect a generic wishy-washy response. Which seems utterly unfair, but frankly I personally am not going to do anything about it for $4k in quarterly spend.
Feb 4, 2021, 9:10 am
#28
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,535
Am I the only one who also thinks that this:
purchasing travelers checks, foreign currency, money orders, wire transfers, cryptocurrency, other similar digital or virtual currency and other similar transactions;
Can also apply to any sort of Gift card purchases?
purchasing travelers checks, foreign currency, money orders, wire transfers, cryptocurrency, other similar digital or virtual currency and other similar transactions;
Can also apply to any sort of Gift card purchases?
Feb 4, 2021, 9:37 am
#29
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 539
You can pay by internet, phone, or mobile device whether you e-file, paper file or are responding to a bill or notice. It's safe and secure - the IRS uses standard service providers and business/commercial card networks, and your information is used solely to process your payment.
I agree with others that have posted the suggestion to lower cash advance limits as an additional safety mechanism to be sure, but I believe that Chase is probably zeroing in on plastiq and tools like PayPal key, and people sending payments to P2 via PayPal for Freedom bonuses or to meet spend.