Jan 6, 2020, 8:19 pm
Last edit by: beltway
This is the 2020-2022 thread for weighing the relative merits
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.
Discussion from 2016 to 2019 can be found in this closed thread.
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.
Discussion from 2016 to 2019 can be found in this closed thread.
What's the main reason people product change (PC)?
The benefits offered by a particular card, might suit you better than the card you are holding. Many people, unable to qualify for a new Chase Sapphire Reserve application, upgraded from the Sapphire Preferred to the Sapphire Reserve, because the benefits of the CSR's cash reimbursements made the annual fee a nominal difference the first year. And vice versa- the onerous $450 yearly fee of the CSR makes an appealing case to downgrade to the Sapphire Preferred, and eventually to the no-fee Sapphire or a Freedom card.
Many people product change to avoid the annual fees on the premium versions of the card. Keeping the card open, via a product change, keeps the account open. This allows you to retain the seasoned account, and the banking relationship that the older card has established with Chase.
Why not just cancel the card and be done with it?
This may be the right choice for you, but others want some of the card benefits without having to reapply. Also, Chase has become very restrictive for new card applicants. For Chase cards, you must wait 24-48 months since the last time you received a bonus before reapplying. Please see the threads on the individual cards for updated overlay rules.
An additional (and more stringent) overlay is the infamous 5/24 rule, which Chase instituted in May 2016 as a counter-measure against churning, or, as they refer to it, "Serial Starters." The 5/24 rule is that you won't be eligible for most Chase card products if you've opened more than 5 credit cards in 24 months. For more on this and other application-related issues, see the current "Applying for Chase Credit Cards " Master thread.
If you downgrade a card to a lower- or no-fee alternative, you can always upgrade back to the original card type (paying the AF, of course) if you want to have the additional benefits again. Doing so does not have any effect on your */24 count; OTOH, applying for the card anew will increase your */24 count (always for personal cards & sometimes even for business cards). When you upgrade, you will receive a pro-rated refund of your current card’s annual fee (if any) and then be charged the full annual fee of the upgraded card, thus changing the account’s anniversary date.
Another reason to downgrade a card, if such an option exists, instead of canceling is that you’ll receive a pro rata refund of the AF no matter when you do it (vs. having only 30 days from the date of the statement with AF on it to get a refund if you cancel outright). This can be extremely useful if you need to use a premium card’s benefit—free checked bag, car rental insurance, PreCheck rebate, etc. etc.—more than 30 days after your AF statement. Simply keep the card until you’ve used the relevant benefit & then downgrade; you’ll get a proportional refund of the AF no matter how long this take place after your AF is billed.
Finally, canceling certain cards--those earning Chase Ultimate Rewards--may deprive you of the ability to exchange UR for miles/points in air & hotel programs. See Ultimate Rewards transfer partners, times & rules.
Is there any way I can keep a card without paying the annual fee?
See Chase Retention Bonuses: June 2015-Present
Are there any restrictions on product changes?
Product changes are only allowed within the same card "family," and are not permitted between business and personal cards. Also, Chase cites the federal CARD Act to deny product changes on any account less than one year old.
Will a product change count as a new card?
No, you will keep your same "opened on" date, credit line, automatic payment arrangements, etc. A product change does not count against Chase's 5/24 limitations on new cards.
Note: you will also keep your same account number except where the change is from a Visa to MC or vice versa (e.g., Sapphire Preferred to Freedom Flex) —but even in this limited case, the new card will inherit all the old card’s attributes on your credit report.
Will I get a signup bonus when I change?
No, product changes do not result in point bonuses. Signup bonuses are reserved for new applicants only. For the complete list of public sign up offers, check the Chase sitemap here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap
Is there a place I can look to compare cards?
Go here: https://creditcards.chase.com/credit...D=177087865887
Click: All cards
Place a checkmark in the Compare box for up to three cards.
Click: Compare cards...and you should see a side-by-side display.
I've figured out what I want to switch to. How do I product change my card?
Call the number on the back of your card.
Product changes for the Ultimate Reward Business and Personal Card Family
The UR family of cards includes the Chase Ink business cards, the Freedom Unlimited, the Freedom Card, and the Chase Sapphire Preferred, Reserve and Sapphire.
The Slate (personal) card is also available to downgrade to. It has no annual fee and does not earn any type of reward points. It offers a low fee (currently 0% for the first 60 days) balance transfers and APR.
Personal Cards
- Freedom: 5X points in rotating quarterly categories up to $1500 spend per quarter. If you max out the $1500 every quarter, it totals 7500 UR per quarter, or 30,000 UR per year.
- Freedom Unlimited: 3X on dining, 3x on drugstores, 1.5X for all other spending, no quarterly bonus categories. $20,000 in spend would net 30,000 UR per year.
- Freedom Flex: 5X points in rotating quarterly categories (same ones as for Freedom) up to $1500 spend per quarter, 3X on drugstores, 1x all other spend.
- Sapphire Reserve: $550 annual fee, $300 annual travel credit, 3X points for travel and dining. Books travel through the UR portal for 1.5 per dollar. Lounge access and other goodies. See the thread here for details.
- Sapphire Preferred: $95 annual fee, 2X points for travel & dining
- For discussion specific to the Sapphire Preferred Card, see Chase Sapphire Preferred - Keep, Downgrade, or Cancel?
- Sapphire: Not available to new applicants. Available as a product downgrade/change only, must tier down from the Sapphire Reserve to Sapphire Preferred to Sapphire or Freedom cards. No annual fee. Some Customer Service Reps are citing that the original product (i.e., the CSR), must be held for one year before downgrading. Please provide data points in the thread if this happens to you.
Business Cards
- Ink Plus: $95 annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and hotels
- Ink Preferred: $95 annual fee, 3x on travel, shipping, internet/phone/cable, & some online advertising.
- Ink Cash: No annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and restaurants
If you still have a legacy Ink Classic or Ink Bold business card, neither of which is available for new signups, you can product change to one of the other Ink cards.
Considerations for downgrading/upgrading UR cards
Can I combine my UR points?
Yes, UR can be combined freely across the cardholder's own personal and business accounts.
What about transfering my UR to another person's Chase UR account? To their air/hotel partner account?
With restrictions, UR from a personal card can be transferred to a person living at the same address. Business cards allow transfer to owners of the company listed as authorized users.
However, be warned that there are transfer restrictions. Unauthorized transfers have resulted in shut-downs. Review the Chase T&C for details before planning a transfer. For discussion, see http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...-accounts.html.
The Freedom cards, no-fee Ink Cash, and no-fee Sapphire cards do not allow UR transfer to airline/hotel partners. If you are downgrading from a premium UR card and will only have no-fee cards left, it may be prudent to transfer your points to the partner of your choice beforehand.
I know I can use UR to pay for travel directly (as opposed to transfering points into a travel partner program). Do the Chase UR cards differ on this?
Only the Sapphire Reserve books travel on the UR portal for 1.5. So you can stack your card bonus opportunities when your UR points are combined into your CSR account and used for booking travel. If, for instance, you earned 5x on your Ink Plus on your phone bill, and combine those 5x Ink earned points into your CSR's UR account, you'll now get an additional .5 in value when you redeem them on the travel portal.
Yes, UR can be combined freely across the cardholder's own personal and business accounts.
What about transfering my UR to another person's Chase UR account? To their air/hotel partner account?
With restrictions, UR from a personal card can be transferred to a person living at the same address. Business cards allow transfer to owners of the company listed as authorized users.
However, be warned that there are transfer restrictions. Unauthorized transfers have resulted in shut-downs. Review the Chase T&C for details before planning a transfer. For discussion, see http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...-accounts.html.
The Freedom cards, no-fee Ink Cash, and no-fee Sapphire cards do not allow UR transfer to airline/hotel partners. If you are downgrading from a premium UR card and will only have no-fee cards left, it may be prudent to transfer your points to the partner of your choice beforehand.
I know I can use UR to pay for travel directly (as opposed to transfering points into a travel partner program). Do the Chase UR cards differ on this?
Only the Sapphire Reserve books travel on the UR portal for 1.5. So you can stack your card bonus opportunities when your UR points are combined into your CSR account and used for booking travel. If, for instance, you earned 5x on your Ink Plus on your phone bill, and combine those 5x Ink earned points into your CSR's UR account, you'll now get an additional .5 in value when you redeem them on the travel portal.
There are options to downgrade or upgrade UA cards.
- United Mileage Plus Card- no annual fee, 1 UA mile per $2 in spend
- United Mileage Plus Explorer Card- $95 annual fee, 1 mile per dollar earning, additional award inventory on UA, free checked bag, 25% bonus on the shopping portal.
- United Club Infinite Card- $525 annual fee, 4 miles per $1 travel, 2 miles per $1 dining
- Business Cards for the Mileage Plus and Club Card give you a choice to upgrade or downgrade between those two.
There are three different IHG cards in the Chase portfolio:
- IHG Select: No longer available for new signups. For a $49 annual fee, cardholders get a free-night certificate (up to 40K points) every anniversary; a 10% rebate on award redemptions; and Platinum status. The consensus view on FT is that the low fee and automatic rebate on this make a product change undesirable.
- IHG Premier: $89 annual fee after the first year. Benefits include 40K anniversary free-night cert; Platinum status; Fourth Night Free on awards; and rebate on Global Entry ($100) or TSA PreCheck ($85) application/renewal fees.
- IHG Traveler: Gold status and Fourth Night Free benefit; no free-night cert.
- As of June 2021, downgrades to the Traveler card incur a $29 annual fee even though the current Traveler sign-up offer is for a no-fee card.
Southwest Airlines Cards
The difference here is a nominal $30/3000 points per year.
Personal cards
- Plus Card- $69 annual fee, 3000 bonus points upon renewal
- Premiere Card- $99 annual fee, 6000 bonus points upon renewal
Chase Product Change/Card Conversion: Downgrade, Upgrade, Keep or Cancel? 2020 - 2022
Sep 14, 2021, 2:43 pm
#556
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: NW Iowa
Programs: Hilton Gold, Marriott Gold Elite, Hyatt Explorist, IHG Platinum Elite, Delta Silver Medallion
Posts: 378
Sep 15, 2021, 8:01 am
#557
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 122
I've read in several places that you have to wait four days after converting/downgrading a Sapphire product to apply for a new Sapphire product, which appears to be true for online applications, but what is the rule of thumb for in-branch applications?
I downgraded my CSR to Chase Freedom last week and after five days had passed, I went to the branch this morning to apply for CSP and they told me that it wasn't showing as an option to me owing to my old CSR. Rep called Chase and they said I could apply online, but not in-branch yet. I'd like to apply in-branch as the AF is waived for CSP, but I also don't want to miss out on the current SUB. Anyone know how long before I'll be eligible to apply in-branch?
I downgraded my CSR to Chase Freedom last week and after five days had passed, I went to the branch this morning to apply for CSP and they told me that it wasn't showing as an option to me owing to my old CSR. Rep called Chase and they said I could apply online, but not in-branch yet. I'd like to apply in-branch as the AF is waived for CSP, but I also don't want to miss out on the current SUB. Anyone know how long before I'll be eligible to apply in-branch?
Sep 16, 2021, 7:59 am
#558
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,857
I've read in several places that you have to wait four days after converting/downgrading a Sapphire product to apply for a new Sapphire product, which appears to be true for online applications, but what is the rule of thumb for in-branch applications?
I downgraded my CSR to Chase Freedom last week and after five days had passed, I went to the branch this morning to apply for CSP and they told me that it wasn't showing as an option to me owing to my old CSR. Rep called Chase and they said I could apply online, but not in-branch yet. I'd like to apply in-branch as the AF is waived for CSP, but I also don't want to miss out on the current SUB. Anyone know how long before I'll be eligible to apply in-branch?
I downgraded my CSR to Chase Freedom last week and after five days had passed, I went to the branch this morning to apply for CSP and they told me that it wasn't showing as an option to me owing to my old CSR. Rep called Chase and they said I could apply online, but not in-branch yet. I'd like to apply in-branch as the AF is waived for CSP, but I also don't want to miss out on the current SUB. Anyone know how long before I'll be eligible to apply in-branch?
Sep 16, 2021, 9:27 pm
#559
Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 4
I want to downgrade my CSP after AF posted. I already have CF(old version) and CFU. Is CF(old version) still a downgrade option now? Or CF FLEX has replaced CF(old version) for the option? Thanks!
Sep 17, 2021, 8:49 am
#560
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,857
I had no issue downgrading to CF within the last couple months. Refer to it as "Freedom with Ultimate Rewards" when you call.
Sep 17, 2021, 2:58 pm
#561
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: SFO/SJC
Programs: UA Silver, Marriott Gold, Hilton Gold
Posts: 14,884
Getting toward CSR renewal time, and now that I have the Amex Plat, trying to figure out what to do. I definitely don't want to pay the full (new) AF, though I could probably be convinced to keep this if I get a decent retention offer. But most likely, I would cancel (this is my newest card besides the plat - have had this since a couple of months after it came out).
My other Chase cards are FF, FU, and then UA Select and Gateway. I'd likely get (or have my wife get) a CSP to get the bonus and have a place to transfer CSR points (and also keep ability to use transfer partners). Is there a big compelling reason to downgrade to something else, vs. just cancel? The only thing I wonder about is the credit line amount - is it possible to transfer to some of my other Chase cards prior to canceling?
My other Chase cards are FF, FU, and then UA Select and Gateway. I'd likely get (or have my wife get) a CSP to get the bonus and have a place to transfer CSR points (and also keep ability to use transfer partners). Is there a big compelling reason to downgrade to something else, vs. just cancel? The only thing I wonder about is the credit line amount - is it possible to transfer to some of my other Chase cards prior to canceling?
Sep 17, 2021, 5:04 pm
#562
Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 4
If "Freedom with Ultimate Rewards" is not the downgrade option, can I open a new CF Flex card before downgrade and then choose CF Flex as the downgrade option? In this way, I can earn the opening bonus for CF Flex.
Sep 18, 2021, 6:46 am
#563
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,857
This would work. Alternatively, you could downgrade to a second CFU so you could apply for the Flex at your leisure. All that said, the OG Freedom card should be an option.
Sep 19, 2021, 5:24 pm
#565
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 4
Hi everyone!
I'm leaning towards downgrading my Sapphire Reserve to Slate. My annual fee was charged in August and Chase mentioned I can get 100% of annual fee of $450 back within 41 business days from when my annual fee was posted. I haven't used all of my traveling credit yet however would buying points through Jetblue or Delta qualify as traveling credit? Or would buying a gift card to Jetblue to Delta be better? Thanks!!
I'm leaning towards downgrading my Sapphire Reserve to Slate. My annual fee was charged in August and Chase mentioned I can get 100% of annual fee of $450 back within 41 business days from when my annual fee was posted. I haven't used all of my traveling credit yet however would buying points through Jetblue or Delta qualify as traveling credit? Or would buying a gift card to Jetblue to Delta be better? Thanks!!
Sep 20, 2021, 8:23 am
#566
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 139
Apologies if this has already been asked but if I downgrade my CSR to a Freedom card so I can open a CSP, will I need to transfer my UR points on my CSR card to another one first?
I believe that once I open my CSP I can transfer the points from my CSR/now Freedom card over to CSP to use, correct? Just want to ensure there's no fault in my logic.
I believe that once I open my CSP I can transfer the points from my CSR/now Freedom card over to CSP to use, correct? Just want to ensure there's no fault in my logic.
Sep 20, 2021, 8:48 am
#567
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,954
No, the points will remain with the account when it is converted from Sapphire to Freedom. Later, you can Combine the Freedom points with the Sapphire Preferred points.
Sep 20, 2021, 11:06 am
#568
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 21
I just want to make sure what I am about to do is possible. I want to downgrade my CSR(opened Dec. 2016) to either a Freedom Unlimited or Freedom Flex(I have both of these cards currently, will Chase let me have more than 1 of the same card?) I currently have a decent stash of UR points on my CSR, if I downgrade they will remain in tact correct? Or would I be better shifting them to another card? Then I will wait a few days and apply for the CSP to get the 100k sign up bonus.
I'm pretty sure this should work out as planned, but just want some validation before pulling the trigger and possibly messing something up. Thanks!
I'm pretty sure this should work out as planned, but just want some validation before pulling the trigger and possibly messing something up. Thanks!
Sep 20, 2021, 1:05 pm
#569
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,857
I just want to make sure what I am about to do is possible. I want to downgrade my CSR(opened Dec. 2016) to either a Freedom Unlimited or Freedom Flex(I have both of these cards currently, will Chase let me have more than 1 of the same card? YES) I currently have a decent stash of UR points on my CSR, if I downgrade they will remain in tact correct? CORRECT Or would I be better shifting them to another card? NOT NECESSARY Then I will wait a few days and apply for the CSP to get the 100k sign up bonus.
I'm pretty sure this should work out as planned, but just want some validation before pulling the trigger and possibly messing something up. Thanks!
I'm pretty sure this should work out as planned, but just want some validation before pulling the trigger and possibly messing something up. Thanks!
Sep 21, 2021, 7:31 am
#570
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: flyover country
Posts: 2,435
pallhedge has answered the question; this is a comment. If there is a benefit to having more than one Freedom Unlimited, I am unaware of it and would appreciate being educated. I would suggest you PC to a Freedom or another Freedom Flex.