Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Credit, Debit and Prepaid Card Programs > Chase | Ultimate Rewards
Reload this Page >

Chase survey regarding possible changes when combining points.

Chase survey regarding possible changes when combining points.

Old Jul 15, 17, 10:26 pm
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: LAX, BUR
Programs: AS,AA,JB, HH Gold, Starriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Explorist, Global Entry
Posts: 1,780
Chase survey regarding possible changes when combining points.

http://www.doctorofcredit.com/chase-...l-redemptions/

"They wanted to know how users would feel about the following options:

“When you combine the Ultimate Rewards points on eligible Chase Cards they would retain their original redemption value – that is, when transferred the points would retain the redemption value of the product they were initially earned on. For example you would not earn a travel redemption bonus if your transfer from a no fee card to a Fee card.”
“You can only combine Ultimate Reward points between no-annual fee cards or between annual fee cards. You cannot combine Ultimate Rewards points between a no-annual fee card and an annual fee card.”
“You can combine Ultimate Rewards points on eligible Chase cards at a 3:2 conversion ratio. For example if you would like to transfer 15,000 points from your Freedom Unlimited card to your Sapphire Reserve account, your Sapphire Reserve would be credited with 10,000 points (a 3:2 ratio). The transferred points would be granted the redemption value and options of the account to which they are transferred into.”

All three of these options are terrible and significantly devalue the current value you can get from the Chase Freedom Unlimited (1.5x Chase UR on all purchases) and the Chase Freedom (5x Chase UR on rotating categories). If they made these changes I assume they would also affect your ability to transfer the points to Chase’s travel partners as well. Obviously this is just a preliminary survey to see how customers would feel about these changes, but it isn’t good to see Chase even considering these types of negative changes."
Chase must have lost a boatload of money on the CSR giveaway. And the renewals are not keeping pace.

Last edited by mia; Jul 16, 17 at 2:40 am Reason: Formatting
mhdena is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 12:14 am
  #2  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 240
That would be horrible!! I would probably stop using my freedom cards if that happens.
slm9555 is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 12:41 am
  #3  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SNA
Programs: UA Platinum
Posts: 1,533
I would cancel my Chase cards if this happens.
UnitedF1RST is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 2:24 am
  #4  
mia
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend, Moderator: American Express, Citi, Diners Club, Signatures
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; HH Gold
Posts: 41,231
Originally Posted by mhdena View Post
Chase must have lost a boatload of money on the CSR giveaway. And the renewals are not keeping pace.
Reserve is not yet a year old. There have been no renewals.
mia is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 2:29 am
  #5  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: HHonors, TrueBlue, Delta SkyMiles, Hyatt Discoverist, Starwood Preferred Guest, American Airlines.
Posts: 2,032
Originally Posted by mhdena View Post
Obviously this is just a preliminary survey to see how customers would feel about these changes...
Why would they even ask such a stupid group of questions?

"Would you like it if we made your points less valuable and threw restrictions into the program?"
mikesyr18 is online now  
Old Jul 16, 17, 2:54 am
  #6  
mia
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend, Moderator: American Express, Citi, Diners Club, Signatures
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; HH Gold
Posts: 41,231
Originally Posted by mikesyr18 View Post
Why would they even ask such a stupid group of questions?
Freedom, Freedom Unlimited and INK Cash are marketed as cash-back cards, but actually earn UR points. Many cardholders would not notice or care if the ability to combine points was removed or changed because they redeem the points as cash at $0.01. Survey helps Chase gauge how many would care.

Their competitors do not allow cash back rewards to be combined with other types of rewards.
mia is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 2:55 am
  #7  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: ZOA, SFO, HKG
Programs: UA 1K 0.9MM, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Hertz PC, SBux Gold, TSA Pre✓
Posts: 12,169
Originally Posted by mikesyr18 View Post
Why would they even ask such a stupid group of questions?
When a survey like this comes out, it means that Chase is serious about doing that.

Even you may believe that Chase is stupid for doing this, the purpose of the survey is to test the water and see how customers react.
garykung is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 5:21 am
  #8  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 7,068
Is there any reason not to combine all points onto CSR? Is there some reason having a high point balance in one account would draw attention? I don't think so, but just asking.
rrgg is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 6:54 am
  #9  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: BAY AREA
Posts: 881
Are they sending your survey to Random people or to everyone? I haven't received it yet. I think the majority of card holders just cash out their points. I guess we are in the minor group who use points efficiently. Other banks don't allow cash cards points combine with regular reward cards. For example, you can't combine BofA cash rewards points with BofA travel card. Maybe chase wants to try to do the same.
trikotret is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 7:22 am
  #10  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: US
Programs: (PM)AA UA DL SPG
Posts: 957
If Chase does this, an additional potential problem may exist for customers: If you merge, then later redeem for non-travel, and Chase programs the algorithm to take the 'more valuable' points first, it'll be a worse devaluation than on the face of it.

Possible example (conjecture):
CSR 125K UR points Freedom 20K ; starting balances before merge
CSR 125K+20K Freedom 0K ; account holder merges all pts to CSR
Redemption -20K # non-travel, could have used 'junior' UR points.
New balances with 'best points taken first'
CSR 105K+20K ; 105K 'better' points, 'junior' points balance unchanged.
If they are tweaking the plan around profitability, deductions done this way would be more profitable to Chase than leaving a customer with CSR 125K + 0K; Freedom 0K.

AX converts points to MRF if you upgrade to the 'senior' charge cards. Chase loses the competitive advantage over AX here. If the CSR with the 100K offer took market from AXP Platinum, Chase would feel they are in a safe position for a benefits downgrade.
reft is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 7:58 am
  #11  
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 1
So I stumbled upon this thread through a Google search. And what prompted me to search about the chase customer panel was due to a recent Reddit post that says there may be potential changes with how UR points are transferred.
https://www.reddit.com/r/churning/comments/6nibwt/chase_considering_change_to_how_ur_points_are/?st=J56SBYCX&sh=a5f1ba6d

Everyone should sign up for that customer survey. We may have a say in how our points are handled.
ftalk2017 is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 9:50 am
  #12  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 240
Originally Posted by mia View Post
Freedom, Freedom Unlimited and INK Cash are marketed as cash-back cards, but actually earn UR points. Many cardholders would not notice or care if the ability to combine points was removed or changed because they redeem the points as cash at $0.01. Survey helps Chase gauge how many would care.

Their competitors do not allow cash back rewards to be combined with other types of rewards.
While that is definitely true anyone who signs up to take a Chase survey is an enthusiast / power user and not your average consumer who could care less about this potential change.
slm9555 is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 11:04 am
  #13  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: LAX, BUR
Programs: AS,AA,JB, HH Gold, Starriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Explorist, Global Entry
Posts: 1,780
Originally Posted by mia View Post
Reserve is not yet a year old. There have been no renewals.
Chase admitted they lost $300 million with the CSR.

They see the future in fewer renewals coming percentage wise, similarly to why Amex reduced the Business Platinum redemption from 50% to 35%.
mhdena is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 1:51 pm
  #14  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 28,362
Originally Posted by garykung View Post
When a survey like this comes out, it means that Chase is serious about doing that.

Even you may believe that Chase is stupid for doing this, the purpose of the survey is to test the water and see how customers react.
Totally agree. It WILL be implement some version(s) of the tested ideas, just a matter of how soon.

It is a Test Balloon to figure WHICH of the options offer has the least objection although I imagine ALL 3 options would receive objections as they are all very bad propositions.

There is no other way to describe it other than this is to prepare for a devaluation of the program.

What is astonishing is, the CSR is not even a year old and we have seen 50% bonus cut, now the potential devaluation while not to CSR per se but to the whole UR ecosystem.

Citi did not devalue Prestige until 3 years after its revamping of the TYP program, and it gave a full year before the devaluation happened.
Happy is offline  
Old Jul 16, 17, 1:55 pm
  #15  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 28,362
Originally Posted by mhdena View Post
Chase admitted they lost $300 million with the CSR.

They see the future in fewer renewals coming percentage wise, similarly to why Amex reduced the Business Platinum redemption from 50% to 35%.
Chase cut the sign up bonus to 50K, and changed the definition of "annually".

AMEX raised the AF to $550.

Both trying to stem the bleeding.

However AMEX still wins in the depts of customer service primarily in how to handling claims of all covered benefits. - purchase protection, trip interruption, Med Evac which does not even need to use the AMEX Plat card to pay the initial travel, rental car coverage, and just the general disputes - far better than how Chase handles it as Chase outsources the functions completely while AMEX keeps at least the administration in house afaik last time we used such benefits.

Chase should stay with its own mid market level instead of trying to break in the high end cards market. The decision to incur huge acquisition cost has proved to be a costly mistake so far and it could not wait to make remedy. Some analysts estimate that it would take Chase 5 to 6 years to recoup that acquisition cost. A very large percentage of the new customers acquired probably would not renew anyway whether it devalue the UR program or not. Now with the inevitable devaluation of UR program it just adds MORE attrition to the CSR card, as well as the Freedom and Freedom Unlimited card because now a straight 2% cash rebate card looks a whole lot better. Even for the 1.5% CapOne QuickSilver due to it has no Forex Fee and CapOne does not add any Visa network fee to the transaction unlike with all Chase so-called 0 Forex fee cards actually still incur 1% Visa Network fee built in the exchange rates.

Last edited by Happy; Jul 16, 17 at 2:06 pm
Happy is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search Engine: