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Applying for Chase Credit Cards, 2017 onward

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Old Apr 24, 18, 9:43 am   -   Wikipost
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Please read this Wiki before posting questions in the thread.

Do not post offers or requests for referral links in this thread! The proper thread for referral offers is here.

This thread--a continuation of previous discussions through May 2015 and December 2016--focuses on general Chase policies & practices for new applications. For information on specific Chase cards and their bonuses/terms/benefits, see the following threads and their associated wikis:
Table of Contents
  1. Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?

  2. What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?

  3. Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?

  4. How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?

  5. How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?

  6. Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?

  7. Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?

  8. Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?

  9. I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?

  10. I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?

  11. I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?

  12. How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?

  13. Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?

  14. Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?

  15. Useful Chase telephone numbers

Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)

What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

For a few days in early September 2016, Chase included explicit language ("You will not be approved for this card if you have opened 5 or more bank cards in the past 24 months") on the application page for the Sapphire Reserve card--and then promptly removed it. The absence of this language on landing/application pages for the CSR or any other Chase card is not a reliable indicator of whether the 5/24 policy applies.

See the next section for co-branded cards exempt from the 5/24 policy, and the later section discussing potential ways around 5/24.

Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?
Previously the rule did not apply to applications for the Ink Plus business card or to co-branded cards such as United, Hyatt, IHG, etc. However, on May 22, 2016 Chase extended its 5/24 rule to cover Ink business cards and some co-branded cards. (Note that there were premature reports that Chase Ink Plus would be made subject to the rule in March 2016 (which did not happen), and that all co-branded cards would follow in April 2016 (also did not happen).)

Although we had numerous reports of applications prior to May 22 being denied for a United/Hyatt/IHG/WN card by a CSR citing the 5/24 rule, the available evidence strongly suggested that those applicants had other serious issues--multiple Chase applications in a short period; large existing Chase credit line--and that overzealous CSRs gratuitously (and erroneously) invoked the 5/24 rule in the past as an additional supposed justification for the denial. Thus, it is difficult to separate such false positives from any change in Chase policy.

Instead, the most useful data points are those where an applicant is approved for a Chase card despite being over 5/24. Since May 22, 2016, we have such reports for these co-branded cards (in order from oldest to newest for each card):
For a longer list of cards apparently not subject to 5/24, check this link:
http://www.doctorofcredit.com/chase-...ail-need-know/
Please follow discussion in the thread for current updates.

How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?
The 24-month count includes personal cards opened at other banks, and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user and not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <5 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user. You may need to escalate to the next level of customer service agent, as many front-line agents seem to be unable or unwilling to remove the authorized user accounts from the count.

Note:

How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?
In February 2017, a FTer reported a successful application a day or two after dropping from 5/24 to 4/24. However, because Chase sometimes approves applicants who are at 5/24 exactly (see above), this data point does not conclusively prove that Chase drops cards from its calculation on the exact 24-month anniversary of the previous bonus.

Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?
No. Chase uses the information from your credit report, and closing an account doesn't make it disappear.

Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?
As to targeted mailers, we have insufficient anecdotal evidence to reach any reliable conclusions. (Reports suggesting no exemption from 5/24 here and here.)

There have been reports of people with more than 5 cards opened in the last 24 months being successful if they are already pre-approved for the card in question. To find out if you are pre-approved, you can call or go into a branch to ask. Success stories appear to be connected to Chase Private Client (CPC) status and the rollout of the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. In-branch pre-approvals (showing a green screen on the banker's computer) result in automatic approvals. Some (but not all) CPC clients had success in recon calls[citation needed].

Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?
It depends. A Chase card may be "churned" when an entirely new version becomes available. For example, business cards are distinct from personal/consumer cards. Note that simple variations among bonus offers do not amount to new versions/products for purposes of this rule.

Beginning in 2014, Chase began including explicit language in most of its offers, such as the following from a standard Sapphire Preferred offer:
This new cardmember bonus offer is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this consumer credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this consumer credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this consumer credit card within the last 24 months.
There are four key considerations in determining whether you can churn a given card:
  • The 5/24 policy discussed in detail above.
  • The 24-month bonus waiting period is measured not from the date of your previous application (or approval date, if different), but instead from the date you received the signup-related bonus on the previous card, which may be 3-4 months later than the approval date. The same rule applies regardless of the type of signup bonus received (points, miles, or free-night certs); anniversary benefits unrelated to spending requirements, such as annual IHG & Marriott certs, do not count as signup bonuses.
  • If you still have your old card of the same type, you're ineligible.
  • Chase's policy does not indicate whether there is also a minimum waiting period between cancellation and reapplication, and there is not yet sufficient anecdotal evidence from FTers to draw firm conclusions. At a minimum, a prudent churner will wait at least a week or two after cancellation before reapplying so that all of Chase's systems fully reflect that closure. (See first bullet point above.) At least one FTer has reported re-applying successfully 14 days after canceling the previous card.

Finally, note that if you reapply too soon, Chase may still issue you the new card. (This differs from some other card issuers, which may deny such applications outright.) In this case, Chase typically notifies you by letter within a month or two after approval that, as a previous cardholder, you will not receive the bonus a second time.

I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?
No. Being an additional user on someone else's account poses no bar to applying for that same card & bonus, except insofar as such cards may count toward the 5/24 rule (as discussed above).

I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?
Yes.

In the past, the conventional wisdom among FTers was that you were more likely to hurt your chances by closing an account or reducing CL unilaterally. However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

Recent reports suggest that closing accounts and/or voluntarily reducing credit lines increases the odds of auto-approval or in-branch pre-approval. (You can do either by calling or simply sending a secure message through your Chase online account. You do not need to provide a reason for the request.) For best results, keep at least $5K-10K in excess credit; if your application is not approved, you can always contact the reconsideration department and offer to reallocate that portion of your existing credit line. Note: despite allowing credit line to be moved between personal and business accounts in the past, Chase is no longer permitting such reallocation in either direction.

With respect to timing, it is better to reduce any CL as soon as you can conveniently do so, e.g., after meeting the bonus spend on a card you do not plan to use regularly thereafter. (Do not reduce CL on a given card if it would increase your "credit utiilization"--that is, the ratio of outstanding balance to CL--above ~30%. A high credit utilization number is a red flag for banks and can adversely affect your credit score.) Waiting until one's next application to lower a CL is less than optimal, as the reduced CL is not immediately recognized by all of Chase's systems.

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.

I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?
It may be better to avoid calling Chase unless your application is denied. Many recent calls on pending applications led to denials, and many people report having success letting applications work their way through the system. Be patient. Time is on your side; increasingly, Chase CSRs are not.

If you do call, expect extensive and possibly hostile questioning. Be prepared to answer questions regarding the need for more credit, past credit apps for both Chase and other banks, income, business finances, etc. Know your CLs with Chase before you call so you know which card/s you are willing to decrease the CLs on. If the app is for a significant other who dislikes such calls, they can authorize you to speak on their behalf and hand the phone over to you.

How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?
Just send Chase a secure message (SM) through your online account. Although the deadline should in theory be N months from the date of approval (not the date of application or card activation)--where N is the number of months specified in the offer--Chase typically pads this period to account for the time required to fabricate and deliver physical cards. For example, a recent "3-month" deadline was in fact 114 days, as confirmed by Chase's SM confirmation.

Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?
Bonus points typically accrue at the close of the billing period in which you incur the corresponding charges. Points should appear in your hotel/airline account within a few days thereafter.

NOTE: If you complete your required spending in the last 7-10 days of the statement period, the bonus may not post until the following month's statement, even if the regular per-dollar points post on the first statement. This is normal behavior for Chase and is not worth a phone call.

Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?
See the discussion at

Useful Chase telephone numbers
(800) 432-3117 General Application Status Line, automated
(800) 436-7927 Alternative General Application Status Line, automated
(888) 609-7805 Alternative Personal Reconsideration line with live rep
(800) 453-9719 Business Credit Card Reconsideration Line with live rep
(800) 955-9900 General Card Services and Application status, automated
(888) 298-5623 Credit Reallocation Office (Personal cards)
(800) 453-9719 Credit Reallocation Office (Business cards)
(888) 622-7547 Executive Offices
(877) 470-9042 Personal Application Verification line with live rep
Twitter: @ChaseSupport
Note: In the past, automated telephone status reports stating that Chase would notify you in 2 weeks often resulted in an approval, whereas the "7-10 days" telephone recording often indicated imminent denial. In 2016, this pattern became increasingly unpredictable, with many applicants receiving approval despite an earlier "7-10 days" automated telephone message. As a result, automated telephone responses should not be regarded as reliable indicators of an application's likely outcome.
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Old Sep 27, 17, 4:34 pm
  #1126  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,178
Originally Posted by briang191 View Post
one sapphire card and bonus every 24months
Is it one UR card bonus (including Ink, Freedom) every 24 months, or just one Sapphire?
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Old Sep 27, 17, 6:48 pm
  #1127  
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Originally Posted by mareh View Post
I may be being thick, but I did read that and I don't see the answer. I know some people don't get approved at 5/24, but I wanted to know if the hard pull I received from Chase a few months ago will count against me. ....
Back to the wiki: Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

Since you were denied you never opened a new acct. Therefore, no effect.
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Old Sep 28, 17, 1:07 am
  #1128  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Originally Posted by beltway View Post
A question on 5/24, AU cards, and closed accounts:

Basically, what are the consequences of closing an account without first taking AUs off? Does closure automatically result in the card disappearing from the AU's credit report? If not, is there a means post-closure to get the AU's report cleaned up?

I'm familiar with the advice on how to get rid of AUs on an open account (and how to make sure that's translated into CR removal), and am asking a different question.

Thanks for any insights.
Closing an account won't remove it from any cardholder, whether primary or AU. It's a bit trickier to remove the AU after closing, as you'd need to look up relevant info to locate/identify it, like open/close date, account number, and/or CL. Whereas while open, can just identify the AU card in the secure message drop down menu
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Old Sep 28, 17, 1:08 am
  #1129  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 105
Originally Posted by DaveInLA View Post
Is it one UR card bonus (including Ink, Freedom) every 24 months, or just one Sapphire?
Just one Sapphire product -- CSR/CSP. Caveat being, plenty of folks have managed to do double dips for both on the same day. Uncertain if we've seen DP of both bonuses being rewarded...
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Old Sep 28, 17, 1:28 pm
  #1130  
 
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Originally Posted by philemer View Post
Back to the wiki: Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

Since you were denied you never opened a new acct. Therefore, no effect.
Thank you!
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Old Sep 28, 17, 6:30 pm
  #1131  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 7
2/30 and recon

I'm back to churning from a very long hiatus and I recently got a Barclays red AA card (my first card app in at least 2 years) to reach my mileage goal for my honeymoon tickets to Dubai. I then saw the chase SW deal popup and applied for the premiere card and got pending. I didn't apply for card 2 at the advice of some other people until I got approved for card 1.

I'm sure I'll get approved since I have an 800+ score, AAoC 8 years, 0 marks and 6 figure income, although Barclays gave me pending too, but instantly approved when called, but I'm concerned I won't be able to get 2nd card before it supposedly expires on 10/4 (not just cause I'm waiting for first to approve, but cause I got the Barclays card only a week ago).


Edit:
I got approved for the card just now via automated line. My question still stands below. Got approved with 23k limit.


My question is: if I apply for the 2nd card before promo ends and get denied 2 weeks from now, can I recon that same application after the 31st day from my first card and still get same promo of 60k? Missing out on companion pass would really suck.

Any input is greatly appreciated

Last edited by ezpzgg; Sep 28, 17 at 7:53 pm Reason: Got approved for Premiere
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Old Sep 28, 17, 10:20 pm
  #1132  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 7
Recon after a promo ends

If a card is applied for using during a specific promotion, but rejected. If you recon it later, after the promotion ends, would you still receive the bonus of the original?

Thanks!
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Old Sep 29, 17, 12:29 pm
  #1133  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
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When I call the automated status line, it does not give me any information about my application but instead tries to transfer me to a human. I have seen other reports about this, but are there enough datapoints to suggest what this means in terms of approval likelihood?
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Old Sep 29, 17, 5:11 pm
  #1134  
 
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Just a DP, my wife went under 5/24 ( 4/24) on 9/22/17 and was approved for a Southwest card today, 7 days after she dropped under 5/24.
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Old Sep 29, 17, 5:16 pm
  #1135  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
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Originally Posted by ezpzgg View Post
My question is: if I apply for the 2nd card before promo ends and get denied 2 weeks from now, can I recon that same application after the 31st day from my first card and still get same promo of 60k? Missing out on companion pass would really suck.

Any input is greatly appreciated
Assuming the rules for Companion Pass stay the same you would not miss out even if denied the 2nd card.

If you time it so that your first 60K post in 2018 you have almost a full year to get the other 50K CPQP.

I would be shocked if at some point in 2018 a 50K or even another 60K offer doesn't pop up plus don't forget there is also a SW Business card.

While your CP may be delayed a month or so I doubt you will miss out unless the rules change
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Old Sep 30, 17, 1:23 am
  #1136  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Originally Posted by lkar View Post
When I call the automated status line, it does not give me any information about my application but instead tries to transfer me to a human. I have seen other reports about this, but are there enough datapoints to suggest what this means in terms of approval likelihood?
Sure your application went through, or is within 30 days? Transfer to live rep usually means no active apps
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Old Oct 1, 17, 8:20 pm
  #1137  
 
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Originally Posted by prech View Post
Sure your application went through, or is within 30 days? Transfer to live rep usually means no active apps
I got a call this morning asking me to move credit and verifying details. So maybe that's what happens when they need info. Not sure.
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Old Oct 1, 17, 8:32 pm
  #1138  
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
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Chase Hyatt AU question on 5/24

I need to do a little research. I've read the Hyatt doesn't count towards 5/24. If I add my girlfriend as an AU on Hyatt (to get the extra 5K) will that count toward her 5/24? I understand calling the CSR can remove the ding. Still, I'd rather avoid her ding if "all" AU's count toward 5/24. Maybe find an aunt who's last card was in the Nixon administration.
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Old Oct 1, 17, 9:18 pm
  #1139  
 
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Originally Posted by pbjoe View Post
I need to do a little research. I've read the Hyatt doesn't count towards 5/24. If I add my girlfriend as an AU on Hyatt (to get the extra 5K) will that count toward her 5/24? I understand calling the CSR can remove the ding. Still, I'd rather avoid her ding if "all" AU's count toward 5/24. Maybe find an aunt who's last card was in the Nixon administration.
Hyatt will definitely count towards 5/24. It does not, however, have the 5/24 rule applied to its applications.

So all data points in this thread about AUs would apply here too.
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Old Oct 1, 17, 9:29 pm
  #1140  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Darn. I just got the letter in the mail from chase denied for the Ink Buiness preferred card.
I had though the IHG card doesn't count against 5/24. If I don't count IHG I should be at 4/24. But if I do count it I'm at 5/24.
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