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Old Jan 19, 2017, 8:44 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: StartinSanDiego
Please read this Wiki before posting questions in the thread.

Do not post offers or requests for referral links in this thread! The proper thread for referral offers is here.
All Chase issued cards are here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap

This thread--a continuation of previous discussions through May 2015 and December 2016--focuses on general Chase policies & practices for new applications. For information on specific Chase cards and their bonuses/terms/benefits, see the following threads and their associated wikis: Table of Contents
  1. Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?

  2. What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?

  3. Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?

  4. How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?

  5. How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?

  6. Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?

  7. Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?

  8. Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?

  9. I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?

  10. I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?

  11. I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?

  12. How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?

  13. Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?

  14. Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?

  15. Useful Chase telephone numbers

Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)

What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

For a few days in early September 2016, Chase included explicit language ("You will not be approved for this card if you have opened 5 or more bank cards in the past 24 months") on the application page for the Sapphire Reserve card--and then promptly removed it. The absence of this language on landing/application pages for the CSR or any other Chase card is not a reliable indicator of whether the 5/24 policy applies.

See the next section for co-branded cards exempt from the 5/24 policy, and the later section discussing potential ways around 5/24.

Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?
Previously the rule did not apply to applications for the Ink Plus business card or to co-branded cards such as United, Hyatt, IHG, etc. However, on May 22, 2016 Chase extended its 5/24 rule to cover Ink business cards and some co-branded cards. (Note that there were premature reports that Chase Ink Plus would be made subject to the rule in March 2016 (which did not happen), and that all co-branded cards would follow in April 2016 (also did not happen).)

Although we had numerous reports of applications prior to May 22 being denied for a United/Hyatt/IHG/WN card by a CSR citing the 5/24 rule, the available evidence strongly suggested that those applicants had other serious issues--multiple Chase applications in a short period; large existing Chase credit line--and that overzealous CSRs gratuitously (and erroneously) invoked the 5/24 rule in the past as an additional supposed justification for the denial. Thus, it is difficult to separate such false positives from any change in Chase policy.

Instead, the most useful data points are those where an applicant is approved for a Chase card despite being over 5/24. Since May 22, 2016, we have such reports for these co-branded cards (in order from oldest to newest for each card):
For a longer list of cards apparently not subject to 5/24, check this link:
In November 2018, Chase seems to have possibly expanded 5/24 to more cards, possibly including some mentioned above. See this link:
Please follow discussion in the thread for current updates.

How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?
The 24-month count includes personal cards opened at other banks, and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user and not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <5 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user. You may need to escalate to the next level of customer service agent, as many front-line agents seem to be unable or unwilling to remove the authorized user accounts from the count.

Note:

How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?
In February 2017, a FTer reported a successful application a day or two after dropping from 5/24 to 4/24. However, because Chase sometimes approves applicants who are at 5/24 exactly (see above), this data point does not conclusively prove that Chase drops cards from its calculation on the exact 24-month anniversary of the previous bonus.

Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?
No. Chase uses the information from your credit report, and closing an account doesn't make it disappear.

Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?
As to targeted mailers, we have insufficient anecdotal evidence to reach any reliable conclusions. (Reports suggesting no exemption from 5/24 here and here.)

There have been reports of people with more than 5 cards opened in the last 24 months being successful if they are already pre-approved for the card in question. To find out if you are pre-approved, you can call or go into a branch to ask. Success stories appear to be connected to Chase Private Client (CPC) status and the rollout of the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. In-branch pre-approvals (showing a green screen on the banker's computer) result in automatic approvals. Some (but not all) CPC clients had success in recon calls[[I]citation needed].

Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?
It depends. A Chase card may be "churned" when an entirely new version becomes available. For example, business cards are distinct from personal/consumer cards. Note that simple variations among bonus offers do not amount to new versions/products for purposes of this rule.

Beginning in 2014, Chase began including explicit language in most of its offers, such as the following:
This new cardmember bonus offer is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this consumer credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this consumer credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this consumer credit card within the last 24 months.
Effective August 2018, Chase imposed stringent additional restrictions on receiving the signup bonus for any version of the Sapphire card. See Sapphire (CSR & CSP) 48 months between bonuses, August 2018 and the master threads for each card (listed above) for details and discussion.

There are four key considerations in determining whether you can churn a given card:
  • The 5/24 policy discussed in detail above.
  • The 24-month bonus waiting period--in the case of Sapphire cards, the collective 48-month period--is measured not from the date of your previous application (or approval date, if different), but instead from the date you received the signup-related bonus on the previous card, which may be 3-4 months later than the approval date. The same rule applies regardless of the type of signup bonus received (points, miles, or free-night certs); anniversary benefits unrelated to spending requirements, such as annual IHG & Marriott certs, do not count as signup bonuses.
  • If you still have your old card of the same type, you're ineligible.
  • Chase's policy does not indicate whether there is also a minimum waiting period between cancellation and reapplication, and there is not yet sufficient anecdotal evidence from FTers to draw firm conclusions. At a minimum, a prudent churner will wait at least a week or two after cancellation before reapplying so that all of Chase's systems fully reflect that closure. (See first bullet point above.) At least one FTer has reported re-applying successfully 14 days after canceling the previous card.
Finally, note that if you reapply too soon, Chase may still issue you the new card. (This differs from some other card issuers, which may deny such applications outright.) In this case, Chase typically notifies you by letter within a month or two after approval that, as a previous cardholder, you will not receive the bonus a second time.

I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?
No. Being an additional user on someone else's account poses no bar to applying for that same card & bonus, except insofar as such cards may count toward the 5/24 rule (as discussed above).

I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?
Yes.

In the past, the conventional wisdom among FTers was that you were more likely to hurt your chances by closing an account or reducing CL unilaterally. However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

Recent reports suggest that closing accounts and/or voluntarily reducing credit lines increases the odds of auto-approval or in-branch pre-approval. (You can do either by calling or simply sending a secure message through your Chase online account. You do not need to provide a reason for the request.) For best results, keep at least $5K-10K in excess credit; if your application is not approved, you can always contact the reconsideration department and offer to reallocate that portion of your existing credit line. Note: despite allowing credit line to be moved between personal and business accounts in the past, Chase is no longer permitting such reallocation in either direction.

With respect to timing, it is better to reduce any CL as soon as you can conveniently do so, e.g., after meeting the bonus spend on a card you do not plan to use regularly thereafter. (Do not reduce CL on a given card if it would increase your "credit utiilization"--that is, the ratio of outstanding balance to CL--above ~30%. A high credit utilization number is a red flag for banks and can adversely affect your credit score.) Waiting until one's next application to lower a CL is less than optimal, as the reduced CL is not immediately recognized by all of Chase's systems.

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.

I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?
It may be better to avoid calling Chase unless your application is denied. Many recent calls on pending applications led to denials, and many people report having success letting applications work their way through the system. Be patient. Time is on your side; increasingly, Chase CSRs are not.

If you do call, expect extensive and possibly hostile questioning. Be prepared to answer questions regarding the need for more credit, past credit apps for both Chase and other banks, income, business finances, etc. Know your CLs with Chase before you call so you know which card/s you are willing to decrease the CLs on. If the app is for a significant other who dislikes such calls, they can authorize you to speak on their behalf and hand the phone over to you.

How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?
Just send Chase a secure message (SM) through your online account. Although the deadline should in theory be N months from the date of approval (not the date of application or card activation)--where N is the number of months specified in the offer--Chase typically pads this period to account for the time required to fabricate and deliver physical cards. For example, a recent "3-month" deadline was in fact 114 days, as confirmed by Chase's SM confirmation.

Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?
Bonus points typically accrue at the close of the billing period in which you incur the corresponding charges. Points should appear in your hotel/airline account within a few days thereafter.

NOTE: If you complete your required spending in the last 7-10 days of the statement period, the bonus may not post until the following month's statement, even if the regular per-dollar points post on the first statement. This is normal behavior for Chase and is not worth a phone call.

Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?
Useful Chase telephone numbers
(800) 432-3117 – General Application Status Line, automated
(800) 436-7927 – Alternative General Application Status Line, automated
(888) 609-7805 – Alternative Personal Reconsideration line with live rep
(888) 269-8690 - Business Credit Card Application Status Line, automated
(800) 453-9719 – Business Credit Card Reconsideration Line with live rep
(800) 955-9900 – General Card Services and Application status, automated
(888) 298-5623 – Credit Reallocation Office (Personal cards)
(800) 453-9719 – Credit Reallocation Office (Business cards)
(888) 622-7547 – Executive Offices
(877) 470-9042 – Personal Application Verification line with live rep
Twitter: @ChaseSupport
Note: In the past, automated telephone status reports stating that Chase would notify you in 2 weeks often resulted in an approval, whereas the "7-10 days" telephone recording often indicated imminent denial. In 2016, this pattern became increasingly unpredictable, with many applicants receiving approval despite an earlier "7-10 days" automated telephone message. As a result, automated telephone responses should not be regarded as reliable indicators of an application's likely outcome.
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Applying for Chase Credit Cards, 2017-2019

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Old Jul 16, 2018, 4:26 pm
  #1831  
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Originally Posted by fliesdelta
Just a general rule I have, that's all. My last one is from nearly a year ago, I just don't get that many new cards.
Even the strictest bank I can think of (that issues cards with airline miles and/or hotel points and/or transferable points) doesn't care if you apply for 2 cards in one year as opposed to only 1 card a year. Chase does care if open more than 4 cards in 24 months, but at 4 or less they don't care. And they count actual card accounts showing on your credit report, not pulls on your credit report. (They don't have a problem with somewhat more pulls than 4 in 24 months, they only have a problem with 5 or more accounts showing as opened in the past 24 months on your credit report.)

So you may want to re-evaluate your "general" rule, because it may too general, perhaps, and it may be worrying about the wrong thing (pulls as opposed to new personal card accounts showing on your credit report)..
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Old Jul 19, 2018, 1:55 pm
  #1832  
 
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So I'm getting back into the miles and points game after a couple of years off and have a plan now after reading some of the new rules. The last couple of years I have gone from being single to being married with a wife, kid, and a mortgage. I have just been using my Discover and Bank of America travel rewards card to just rack up rewards for ongoing spending and I will be keeping both card since they have no annual fee, but then always have a 3rd card in my wallet for purposes of chasing signup bonuses. The hotel and airline miles I will use to help fund both family vacations and my usual solo trips as with a wife and kids I dont have as much cash to spend on travel as I used to.

I figure if I rotate around between United/Southwest/American/Hyatt/Marriott/IHG every 6 months that keeps me under the 5/24 rule as I would only be opening 4 cards every 24 months, and by the time it comes around to get the same signup bonus again I am already past the 24 months after account closure to be eligible again. Just follow a simple rule of opening one card every 6 months.

Only real question I have is it possible to cancel a Chase card online without speaking to anybody? I'd rather not have to come up with a little white lie every 6 months when calling a CSR trying to explain why I am cancelling the card. lol
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Old Jul 19, 2018, 10:49 pm
  #1833  
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
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So I applied for the new Marriott card almost a month ago. I call the status line on a regular basis, but it always says it is "being reviewed" and "I will receive a letter in 7-10 business days after their decision".

Anyone else ever get this? Should I call recon? I'm well under 5/24, but I've got 4 Chase cards and my current credit lines with them are probably around 30-40% of my income. Total credit lines are probably under 50% of salary. I actively use my Reserve card for general use, but carry very low overall credit utilization.
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Old Jul 20, 2018, 3:09 am
  #1834  
 
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Originally Posted by Dadaluma83
So I'm getting back into the miles and points game after a couple of years off and have a plan now after reading some of the new rules. The last couple of years I have gone from being single to being married with a wife, kid, and a mortgage. I have just been using my Discover and Bank of America travel rewards card to just rack up rewards for ongoing spending and I will be keeping both card since they have no annual fee, but then always have a 3rd card in my wallet for purposes of chasing signup bonuses. The hotel and airline miles I will use to help fund both family vacations and my usual solo trips as with a wife and kids I dont have as much cash to spend on travel as I used to.

I figure if I rotate around between United/Southwest/American/Hyatt/Marriott/IHG every 6 months that keeps me under the 5/24 rule as I would only be opening 4 cards every 24 months, and by the time it comes around to get the same signup bonus again I am already past the 24 months after account closure to be eligible again. Just follow a simple rule of opening one card every 6 months.

Only real question I have is it possible to cancel a Chase card online without speaking to anybody? I'd rather not have to come up with a little white lie every 6 months when calling a CSR trying to explain why I am cancelling the card. lol
you can use the chase messaging system to write a PM to them and normally 24h later the account is closed
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Old Jul 20, 2018, 6:47 am
  #1835  
 
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Is there any point trying to get authorized user accounts removed from credit report before applying? IIRC, this is generally difficult to begin with.
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Old Jul 20, 2018, 8:56 am
  #1836  
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Originally Posted by trouble747
Is there any point trying to get authorized user accounts removed from credit report before applying? IIRC, this is generally difficult to begin with.
Of course there is, and it's easy too.

Example: I was at 6/24 recently (May 2018) with Chase because I was an AU on my wife's United Mileage Plus CC. I was planning to apply for the Ink Cash (Business Card) and a CSP in June when one of my own apps would be dropping off, still leaving me at 5/24 AKA "No Fly Zone", so back in May I canceled my AU MP card, then logged into my FREE Experian account to dispute the account showing on my credit profile. There ws even an option under dispute type to select "No longer responsible / Primary account holder" something of that nature...anyways within days it was removed from my reports and once June hit I was now sitting at 4/24 and ready to apply at will.

Applied for the Ink Cash first to stay under the Chase radar, was auto approved and later in the day applied for the CSP and was approved after calling in to the recon line. ^

NOTE: I was hit with 2 hard pulls/inquires because business and personal pulls are apparently NOT combined unlike 2 personal pulls would be. News to me so figured I would share the tip. At least with both approvals it was worth it.
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Old Jul 21, 2018, 8:38 am
  #1837  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
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Originally Posted by Tony300S

.... so back in May I canceled my AU MP card, then logged into my FREE Experian account to dispute the account showing on my credit profile. There ws even an option under dispute type to select "No longer responsible / Primary account holder" something of that nature...anyways within days it was removed from my reports ....
Question -- Was it removed completely or moved to the closed accounts section? I've never been clear on what is supposed to happen with these.
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Old Jul 21, 2018, 9:11 am
  #1838  
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Originally Posted by trouble747
Is there any point trying to get authorized user accounts removed from credit report before applying? IIRC, this is generally difficult to begin with.
Sure. I did it once with a short SM online. Easy.
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Old Jul 24, 2018, 3:50 pm
  #1839  
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Orlando, FL
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My wife had Sapphire Preferred and cancelled it more than 2 years ago.
Last year, she received and cancelled the Chase Sapphire Reserve.
She is under 5/24.

Does her having the CSR affect her application for CSP again?
Should she be able to get the CSP bonus now if approved?

Thank you.
TravelMutt is offline  
Old Jul 24, 2018, 9:29 pm
  #1840  
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
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Posts: 557
Originally Posted by TravelMutt
My wife had Sapphire Preferred and cancelled it more than 2 years ago.
Last year, she received and cancelled the Chase Sapphire Reserve.
She is under 5/24.

Does her having the CSR affect her application for CSP again?
Should she be able to get the CSP bonus now if approved?

Thank you.
The current rules to be approved are that you can only have one Sapphire card (of any variant) and that you must not have received any other Sapphire card signup bonus in the past 24 months.

Since she received a signup bonus for the CSR, she will be unable to receive the CSP (at all) until 24 months after she received the CSR signup bonus.
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Old Jul 25, 2018, 1:39 pm
  #1841  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,303
Can I move credit line around from say a non proprietary card like Hyatt to the Sapphire Preferred ( I need $10k line to PC to Reserve and only have $8k)?
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Old Jul 25, 2018, 2:48 pm
  #1842  
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: NYC
Posts: 557
Originally Posted by DeltaNeutral28
Can I move credit line around from say a non proprietary card like Hyatt to the Sapphire Preferred ( I need $10k line to PC to Reserve and only have $8k)?
Yes, this is not a problem.
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Old Jul 25, 2018, 4:22 pm
  #1843  
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,012
Originally Posted by Tony300S
Of course there is, and it's easy too.

Example: I was at 6/24 recently (May 2018) with Chase because I was an AU on my wife's United Mileage Plus CC. I was planning to apply for the Ink Cash (Business Card) and a CSP in June when one of my own apps would be dropping off, still leaving me at 5/24 AKA "No Fly Zone", so back in May I canceled my AU MP card, then logged into my FREE Experian account to dispute the account showing on my credit profile. There ws even an option under dispute type to select "No longer responsible / Primary account holder" something of that nature...anyways within days it was removed from my reports and once June hit I was now sitting at 4/24 and ready to apply at will.
Thanks for the help!
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trouble747 is offline  
Old Jul 27, 2018, 9:47 am
  #1844  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
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What Credit score is needed for the new Ink Unlimited? I'm at 4/24 on personal cards and have several Chase Business cards as well - United, Ink Cash, Marriott. Usually my credit score is right around 800, but I just bought a new house and had to refi the HELOC on the old home 3 months back, so those loan apps are on both credit reports. Transunion shows 10 hard pulls while equifax shows only 3. Also, the credit utilization on my HHonors personal Amex was about 80% as I was buying stuff for the move, but it will be paid off on the due dates. My credit age average is 5.2 years with oldest card at 19 years. Perfect payment history and 0 derogatory remarks.

In short my Transunion has dropped to 711 on Credit Karma, while Equifax shows 768. Am I likely to be approved or should I wait a bit?
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Old Jul 27, 2018, 10:49 am
  #1845  
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 196
Originally Posted by NYCFlyer10001
The current rules to be approved are that you can only have one Sapphire card (of any variant) and that you must not have received any other Sapphire card signup bonus in the past 24 months.

Since she received a signup bonus for the CSR, she will be unable to receive the CSP (at all) until 24 months after she received the CSR signup bonus.
Freedom doesn't fall under the same category as Sapphire, right? So I could get a Freedom variant for my wife.

I need to accrue as many points as possible before a trip to the Maldives next year.
TravelMutt is offline  


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