Community
Wiki Posts
Search
Old Jan 19, 2017, 8:44 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: StartinSanDiego
Please read this Wiki before posting questions in the thread.

Do not post offers or requests for referral links in this thread! The proper thread for referral offers is here.
All Chase issued cards are here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap

This thread--a continuation of previous discussions through May 2015 and December 2016--focuses on general Chase policies & practices for new applications. For information on specific Chase cards and their bonuses/terms/benefits, see the following threads and their associated wikis: Table of Contents
  1. Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?

  2. What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?

  3. Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?

  4. How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?

  5. How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?

  6. Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?

  7. Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?

  8. Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?

  9. I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?

  10. I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?

  11. I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?

  12. How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?

  13. Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?

  14. Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?

  15. Useful Chase telephone numbers

Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)

What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

For a few days in early September 2016, Chase included explicit language ("You will not be approved for this card if you have opened 5 or more bank cards in the past 24 months") on the application page for the Sapphire Reserve card--and then promptly removed it. The absence of this language on landing/application pages for the CSR or any other Chase card is not a reliable indicator of whether the 5/24 policy applies.

See the next section for co-branded cards exempt from the 5/24 policy, and the later section discussing potential ways around 5/24.

Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?
Previously the rule did not apply to applications for the Ink Plus business card or to co-branded cards such as United, Hyatt, IHG, etc. However, on May 22, 2016 Chase extended its 5/24 rule to cover Ink business cards and some co-branded cards. (Note that there were premature reports that Chase Ink Plus would be made subject to the rule in March 2016 (which did not happen), and that all co-branded cards would follow in April 2016 (also did not happen).)

Although we had numerous reports of applications prior to May 22 being denied for a United/Hyatt/IHG/WN card by a CSR citing the 5/24 rule, the available evidence strongly suggested that those applicants had other serious issues--multiple Chase applications in a short period; large existing Chase credit line--and that overzealous CSRs gratuitously (and erroneously) invoked the 5/24 rule in the past as an additional supposed justification for the denial. Thus, it is difficult to separate such false positives from any change in Chase policy.

Instead, the most useful data points are those where an applicant is approved for a Chase card despite being over 5/24. Since May 22, 2016, we have such reports for these co-branded cards (in order from oldest to newest for each card):
For a longer list of cards apparently not subject to 5/24, check this link:
In November 2018, Chase seems to have possibly expanded 5/24 to more cards, possibly including some mentioned above. See this link:
Please follow discussion in the thread for current updates.

How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?
The 24-month count includes personal cards opened at other banks, and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user and not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <5 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user. You may need to escalate to the next level of customer service agent, as many front-line agents seem to be unable or unwilling to remove the authorized user accounts from the count.

Note:

How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?
In February 2017, a FTer reported a successful application a day or two after dropping from 5/24 to 4/24. However, because Chase sometimes approves applicants who are at 5/24 exactly (see above), this data point does not conclusively prove that Chase drops cards from its calculation on the exact 24-month anniversary of the previous bonus.

Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?
No. Chase uses the information from your credit report, and closing an account doesn't make it disappear.

Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?
As to targeted mailers, we have insufficient anecdotal evidence to reach any reliable conclusions. (Reports suggesting no exemption from 5/24 here and here.)

There have been reports of people with more than 5 cards opened in the last 24 months being successful if they are already pre-approved for the card in question. To find out if you are pre-approved, you can call or go into a branch to ask. Success stories appear to be connected to Chase Private Client (CPC) status and the rollout of the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. In-branch pre-approvals (showing a green screen on the banker's computer) result in automatic approvals. Some (but not all) CPC clients had success in recon calls[[I]citation needed].

Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?
It depends. A Chase card may be "churned" when an entirely new version becomes available. For example, business cards are distinct from personal/consumer cards. Note that simple variations among bonus offers do not amount to new versions/products for purposes of this rule.

Beginning in 2014, Chase began including explicit language in most of its offers, such as the following:
This new cardmember bonus offer is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this consumer credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this consumer credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this consumer credit card within the last 24 months.
Effective August 2018, Chase imposed stringent additional restrictions on receiving the signup bonus for any version of the Sapphire card. See Sapphire (CSR & CSP) 48 months between bonuses, August 2018 and the master threads for each card (listed above) for details and discussion.

There are four key considerations in determining whether you can churn a given card:
  • The 5/24 policy discussed in detail above.
  • The 24-month bonus waiting period--in the case of Sapphire cards, the collective 48-month period--is measured not from the date of your previous application (or approval date, if different), but instead from the date you received the signup-related bonus on the previous card, which may be 3-4 months later than the approval date. The same rule applies regardless of the type of signup bonus received (points, miles, or free-night certs); anniversary benefits unrelated to spending requirements, such as annual IHG & Marriott certs, do not count as signup bonuses.
  • If you still have your old card of the same type, you're ineligible.
  • Chase's policy does not indicate whether there is also a minimum waiting period between cancellation and reapplication, and there is not yet sufficient anecdotal evidence from FTers to draw firm conclusions. At a minimum, a prudent churner will wait at least a week or two after cancellation before reapplying so that all of Chase's systems fully reflect that closure. (See first bullet point above.) At least one FTer has reported re-applying successfully 14 days after canceling the previous card.
Finally, note that if you reapply too soon, Chase may still issue you the new card. (This differs from some other card issuers, which may deny such applications outright.) In this case, Chase typically notifies you by letter within a month or two after approval that, as a previous cardholder, you will not receive the bonus a second time.

I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?
No. Being an additional user on someone else's account poses no bar to applying for that same card & bonus, except insofar as such cards may count toward the 5/24 rule (as discussed above).

I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?
Yes.

In the past, the conventional wisdom among FTers was that you were more likely to hurt your chances by closing an account or reducing CL unilaterally. However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

Recent reports suggest that closing accounts and/or voluntarily reducing credit lines increases the odds of auto-approval or in-branch pre-approval. (You can do either by calling or simply sending a secure message through your Chase online account. You do not need to provide a reason for the request.) For best results, keep at least $5K-10K in excess credit; if your application is not approved, you can always contact the reconsideration department and offer to reallocate that portion of your existing credit line. Note: despite allowing credit line to be moved between personal and business accounts in the past, Chase is no longer permitting such reallocation in either direction.

With respect to timing, it is better to reduce any CL as soon as you can conveniently do so, e.g., after meeting the bonus spend on a card you do not plan to use regularly thereafter. (Do not reduce CL on a given card if it would increase your "credit utiilization"--that is, the ratio of outstanding balance to CL--above ~30%. A high credit utilization number is a red flag for banks and can adversely affect your credit score.) Waiting until one's next application to lower a CL is less than optimal, as the reduced CL is not immediately recognized by all of Chase's systems.

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.

I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?
It may be better to avoid calling Chase unless your application is denied. Many recent calls on pending applications led to denials, and many people report having success letting applications work their way through the system. Be patient. Time is on your side; increasingly, Chase CSRs are not.

If you do call, expect extensive and possibly hostile questioning. Be prepared to answer questions regarding the need for more credit, past credit apps for both Chase and other banks, income, business finances, etc. Know your CLs with Chase before you call so you know which card/s you are willing to decrease the CLs on. If the app is for a significant other who dislikes such calls, they can authorize you to speak on their behalf and hand the phone over to you.

How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?
Just send Chase a secure message (SM) through your online account. Although the deadline should in theory be N months from the date of approval (not the date of application or card activation)--where N is the number of months specified in the offer--Chase typically pads this period to account for the time required to fabricate and deliver physical cards. For example, a recent "3-month" deadline was in fact 114 days, as confirmed by Chase's SM confirmation.

Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?
Bonus points typically accrue at the close of the billing period in which you incur the corresponding charges. Points should appear in your hotel/airline account within a few days thereafter.

NOTE: If you complete your required spending in the last 7-10 days of the statement period, the bonus may not post until the following month's statement, even if the regular per-dollar points post on the first statement. This is normal behavior for Chase and is not worth a phone call.

Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?
Useful Chase telephone numbers
(800) 432-3117 – General Application Status Line, automated
(800) 436-7927 – Alternative General Application Status Line, automated
(888) 609-7805 – Alternative Personal Reconsideration line with live rep
(888) 269-8690 - Business Credit Card Application Status Line, automated
(800) 453-9719 – Business Credit Card Reconsideration Line with live rep
(800) 955-9900 – General Card Services and Application status, automated
(888) 298-5623 – Credit Reallocation Office (Personal cards)
(800) 453-9719 – Credit Reallocation Office (Business cards)
(888) 622-7547 – Executive Offices
(877) 470-9042 – Personal Application Verification line with live rep
Twitter: @ChaseSupport
Note: In the past, automated telephone status reports stating that Chase would notify you in 2 weeks often resulted in an approval, whereas the "7-10 days" telephone recording often indicated imminent denial. In 2016, this pattern became increasingly unpredictable, with many applicants receiving approval despite an earlier "7-10 days" automated telephone message. As a result, automated telephone responses should not be regarded as reliable indicators of an application's likely outcome.
Print Wikipost

Applying for Chase Credit Cards, 2017-2019

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Oct 1, 2017, 9:41 pm
  #1141  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,431
Originally Posted by RedElmo
Darn. I just got the letter in the mail from chase denied for the Ink Buiness preferred card.
I had though the IHG card doesn't count against 5/24. If I don't count IHG I should be at 4/24. But if I do count it I'm at 5/24.
Every personal credit card counts against 5/24. But if you're over 5/24, you can still get the IHG card.
DaveInLA is offline  
Old Oct 1, 2017, 9:43 pm
  #1142  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: California
Programs: American, SWA, United, IHG,Hilton, Hyatt, Marriott
Posts: 1,843
Originally Posted by DaveInLA
Every personal credit card counts against 5/24. But if you're over 5/24, you can still get the IHG card.
Thanks. I guess I thought it was the case both ways. I should have applied for the Ink first THEN IHG. Then I would have been ok.

But I didn't know that before. Lesson learned.
RedElmo is offline  
Old Oct 1, 2017, 11:09 pm
  #1143  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,431
My wife just dropped from 5/24 to 4/24 today (10/1), and applied for the Chase Southwest Plus and then Premier personal, back to back. Approved for both. I really expected the 2nd application (Premier) to go to pending and require a phone call, but they were both auto-approved and showing in her account now! And for just 1 hard pull!
DaveInLA is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 1:44 am
  #1144  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: MSP
Programs: UR, RR, MileagePLus, Dividend Miles (R.I.P), AAdvantage, HHonors, IHG, Skymiles
Posts: 108
From the wiki:
However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.
I'm really embarrassed to have made such a mistake, but I forgot to lower my wife's CL on her two personal Chase accounts before she applied for the Ink Preferred a couple days ago. She has high limits on these, totaling $63k.

As expected, she got the 30-day pending notice. Although she applied as a sole proprietorship, the wiki states that reducing CL on a personal card for the sake of a business card is no longer done by Chase reps. Does anyone have any data one way or the other, or opinions as to whether reducing her CL on personal cards now could have any impact on her current Ink app?

If not we'll probably just have to accept the denial if it comes and try again in a few weeks after lowering her personal CLs. Our only other hope is that they would extend her some new credit based on an increased reported annual income since her last Chase card was opened.
valuetactics is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 7:34 am
  #1145  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: PHX
Posts: 4,787
Originally Posted by RedElmo
Darn. I just got the letter in the mail from chase denied for the Ink Buiness preferred card.
I had though the IHG card doesn't count against 5/24. If I don't count IHG I should be at 4/24. But if I do count it I'm at 5/24.
Yeah, this has been a pet peeve of mine. Many, especially blogs, report cards as "not subject to 5/24" without fully explaining what that means.
lkar is online now  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 8:27 am
  #1146  
IHG Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: NJ (EWR) - USA
Programs: UA Silver - IHG Spire AMB - Hilton Gold - Choice Hotels Platinum - Hertz Gold FiveStar
Posts: 396
Originally Posted by lkar
Yeah, this has been a pet peeve of mine. Many, especially blogs, report cards as "not subject to 5/24" without fully explaining what that means.
Very True.

Example 1) You are at 4/25 and apply for IHG card, and approved, you will now be at 5/24 until your oldest app drops off.

Example 2) You are at 5/25 and apply for IHG card, and approved (because it is not limited be Chase) you will now be at 6/24 until your oldest app drops off.

Any off the "non-5/24" Chase cards still count towards your total app count if approved and will continue to push you further into the red for any of the premium Chase card app opportunities.
Tony300S is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 8:55 am
  #1147  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: MSP
Programs: UR, RR, MileagePLus, Dividend Miles (R.I.P), AAdvantage, HHonors, IHG, Skymiles
Posts: 108
Originally Posted by lkar
Yeah, this has been a pet peeve of mine. Many, especially blogs, report cards as "not subject to 5/24" without fully explaining what that means.
Whenever I talk or write about this, I never use the phrase "subject to 5/24." I either say a card "does not contribute to 5/24" or "applying for this card (e.g. IHG) does not require you to be under 5/24."

Is this clear enough?
jjmiller69 likes this.
valuetactics is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 9:01 am
  #1148  
IHG Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: NJ (EWR) - USA
Programs: UA Silver - IHG Spire AMB - Hilton Gold - Choice Hotels Platinum - Hertz Gold FiveStar
Posts: 396
Originally Posted by valuetactics
Whenever I talk or write about this, I never use the phrase "subject to 5/24." I either say a card "does not contribute to 5/24" or "applying for this card (e.g. IHG) does not require you to be under 5/24."

Is this clear enough?
What card does not contribute to 5/24? As far as I've read, ALL revolving credit cards count in Chase's eyes.
Tony300S is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 9:16 am
  #1149  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: MSP
Programs: UR, RR, MileagePLus, Dividend Miles (R.I.P), AAdvantage, HHonors, IHG, Skymiles
Posts: 108
Sorry I can't provide sources, as I'm about to go afk, but as I understand it, non-Chase business credit cards or charge cards do not "show up" in your Chase 5/24 calculation.
valuetactics is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 10:42 am
  #1150  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: On strike
Posts: 8,135
Originally Posted by lkar
Yeah, this has been a pet peeve of mine. Many, especially blogs, report cards as "not subject to 5/24" without fully explaining what that means.
Although even a casual reading of this thread's wiki should dispel any confusion on that point.
Diplomatico and jjmiller69 like this.
beltway is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 3:54 pm
  #1151  
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 78
Originally Posted by Tony300S
What card does not contribute to 5/24? As far as I've read, ALL revolving credit cards count in Chase's eyes.
non-Chase business cards that do not report to personal credit bureaus do not count

For example, the Starwood Amex Business card or the Citi AA Business card will not count towards 5/24 since Chase has no way of knowing that they exist

Additionally, there are some reports that Chase's OWN business cards may not count. Personally, I had a Chase rep not reference an Ink card when recon'ing for a CSR

For example, last year I was at 6/24 when I applied for the CSR 100,000 bonus (if CIP included)
I called and had them list off the cards that they had for me- they listed 5 and did not include the CIP- I then had an AU card removed and was approved over the phone.

As always YMMV, it could just be that I got lucky with a rep who was not thorough
btk2333 is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 6:02 pm
  #1152  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: PHX
Posts: 4,787
Originally Posted by valuetactics
Whenever I talk or write about this, I never use the phrase "subject to 5/24." I either say a card "does not contribute to 5/24" or "applying for this card (e.g. IHG) does not require you to be under 5/24."

Is this clear enough?
I'm just one guy with an opinion, but if people are writing about it and also linking to an application I think there is an obligation to be clear on what it all means, which may mean actually having to include two sentences: One that says the card can be obtained even for those over 5/24 but also one that notes that the card will count toward the 5 for purposes of applications toward cards that are subject to 5/24.

Again, just one man's opinion, and I am not familiar with your writings on the subject. It's definitely an area where there is some confusion. In end, though, anyone making financial decisions like applying for credit has the obligation to know what they are doing.

Originally Posted by beltway
Although even a casual reading of this thread's wiki should dispel any confusion on that point.
Yeah, no doubt.
lkar is online now  
Old Oct 2, 2017, 6:19 pm
  #1153  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Carolina Beach, NC
Programs: Hiltonhonors gold, Priority Club platimum, Club Carlson gold, Marriott gold
Posts: 108
Question

moved

Last edited by beggsmoore; Oct 3, 2017 at 8:20 am
beggsmoore is offline  
Old Oct 3, 2017, 8:15 am
  #1154  
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 2
Interesting DP

Applied for the Ink Pref in branch when opened biz checking account. Banker said I was pre approved for it. Got denial. Called reconsideration and was told that I am 18/24 and they do not see any pre approval notes on my application.

My wife had absolutely the same story, but she applied with another banker.
kekus is offline  
Old Oct 3, 2017, 9:07 am
  #1155  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,784
Originally Posted by kekus
Interesting DP

Applied for the Ink Pref in branch when opened biz checking account. Banker said I was pre approved for it. Got denial. Called reconsideration and was told that I am 18/24 and they do not see any pre approval notes on my application.

My wife had absolutely the same story, but she applied with another banker.
That's rotten of course, but just how rotten depends on: did they pull your credit, or just deny the apps without any HPs?
RobertHanson is offline  


Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.