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Old Jan 19, 2017, 8:44 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: StartinSanDiego
Please read this Wiki before posting questions in the thread.

Do not post offers or requests for referral links in this thread! The proper thread for referral offers is here.
All Chase issued cards are here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap

This thread--a continuation of previous discussions through May 2015 and December 2016--focuses on general Chase policies & practices for new applications. For information on specific Chase cards and their bonuses/terms/benefits, see the following threads and their associated wikis: Table of Contents
  1. Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?

  2. What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?

  3. Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?

  4. How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?

  5. How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?

  6. Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?

  7. Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?

  8. Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?

  9. I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?

  10. I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?

  11. I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?

  12. How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?

  13. Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?

  14. Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?

  15. Useful Chase telephone numbers

Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)

What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

For a few days in early September 2016, Chase included explicit language ("You will not be approved for this card if you have opened 5 or more bank cards in the past 24 months") on the application page for the Sapphire Reserve card--and then promptly removed it. The absence of this language on landing/application pages for the CSR or any other Chase card is not a reliable indicator of whether the 5/24 policy applies.

See the next section for co-branded cards exempt from the 5/24 policy, and the later section discussing potential ways around 5/24.

Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?
Previously the rule did not apply to applications for the Ink Plus business card or to co-branded cards such as United, Hyatt, IHG, etc. However, on May 22, 2016 Chase extended its 5/24 rule to cover Ink business cards and some co-branded cards. (Note that there were premature reports that Chase Ink Plus would be made subject to the rule in March 2016 (which did not happen), and that all co-branded cards would follow in April 2016 (also did not happen).)

Although we had numerous reports of applications prior to May 22 being denied for a United/Hyatt/IHG/WN card by a CSR citing the 5/24 rule, the available evidence strongly suggested that those applicants had other serious issues--multiple Chase applications in a short period; large existing Chase credit line--and that overzealous CSRs gratuitously (and erroneously) invoked the 5/24 rule in the past as an additional supposed justification for the denial. Thus, it is difficult to separate such false positives from any change in Chase policy.

Instead, the most useful data points are those where an applicant is approved for a Chase card despite being over 5/24. Since May 22, 2016, we have such reports for these co-branded cards (in order from oldest to newest for each card):
For a longer list of cards apparently not subject to 5/24, check this link:
In November 2018, Chase seems to have possibly expanded 5/24 to more cards, possibly including some mentioned above. See this link:
Please follow discussion in the thread for current updates.

How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?
The 24-month count includes personal cards opened at other banks, and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user and not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <5 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user. You may need to escalate to the next level of customer service agent, as many front-line agents seem to be unable or unwilling to remove the authorized user accounts from the count.

Note:

How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?
In February 2017, a FTer reported a successful application a day or two after dropping from 5/24 to 4/24. However, because Chase sometimes approves applicants who are at 5/24 exactly (see above), this data point does not conclusively prove that Chase drops cards from its calculation on the exact 24-month anniversary of the previous bonus.

Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?
No. Chase uses the information from your credit report, and closing an account doesn't make it disappear.

Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?
As to targeted mailers, we have insufficient anecdotal evidence to reach any reliable conclusions. (Reports suggesting no exemption from 5/24 here and here.)

There have been reports of people with more than 5 cards opened in the last 24 months being successful if they are already pre-approved for the card in question. To find out if you are pre-approved, you can call or go into a branch to ask. Success stories appear to be connected to Chase Private Client (CPC) status and the rollout of the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. In-branch pre-approvals (showing a green screen on the banker's computer) result in automatic approvals. Some (but not all) CPC clients had success in recon calls[[I]citation needed].

Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?
It depends. A Chase card may be "churned" when an entirely new version becomes available. For example, business cards are distinct from personal/consumer cards. Note that simple variations among bonus offers do not amount to new versions/products for purposes of this rule.

Beginning in 2014, Chase began including explicit language in most of its offers, such as the following:
This new cardmember bonus offer is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this consumer credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this consumer credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this consumer credit card within the last 24 months.
Effective August 2018, Chase imposed stringent additional restrictions on receiving the signup bonus for any version of the Sapphire card. See Sapphire (CSR & CSP) 48 months between bonuses, August 2018 and the master threads for each card (listed above) for details and discussion.

There are four key considerations in determining whether you can churn a given card:
  • The 5/24 policy discussed in detail above.
  • The 24-month bonus waiting period--in the case of Sapphire cards, the collective 48-month period--is measured not from the date of your previous application (or approval date, if different), but instead from the date you received the signup-related bonus on the previous card, which may be 3-4 months later than the approval date. The same rule applies regardless of the type of signup bonus received (points, miles, or free-night certs); anniversary benefits unrelated to spending requirements, such as annual IHG & Marriott certs, do not count as signup bonuses.
  • If you still have your old card of the same type, you're ineligible.
  • Chase's policy does not indicate whether there is also a minimum waiting period between cancellation and reapplication, and there is not yet sufficient anecdotal evidence from FTers to draw firm conclusions. At a minimum, a prudent churner will wait at least a week or two after cancellation before reapplying so that all of Chase's systems fully reflect that closure. (See first bullet point above.) At least one FTer has reported re-applying successfully 14 days after canceling the previous card.
Finally, note that if you reapply too soon, Chase may still issue you the new card. (This differs from some other card issuers, which may deny such applications outright.) In this case, Chase typically notifies you by letter within a month or two after approval that, as a previous cardholder, you will not receive the bonus a second time.

I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?
No. Being an additional user on someone else's account poses no bar to applying for that same card & bonus, except insofar as such cards may count toward the 5/24 rule (as discussed above).

I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?
Yes.

In the past, the conventional wisdom among FTers was that you were more likely to hurt your chances by closing an account or reducing CL unilaterally. However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

Recent reports suggest that closing accounts and/or voluntarily reducing credit lines increases the odds of auto-approval or in-branch pre-approval. (You can do either by calling or simply sending a secure message through your Chase online account. You do not need to provide a reason for the request.) For best results, keep at least $5K-10K in excess credit; if your application is not approved, you can always contact the reconsideration department and offer to reallocate that portion of your existing credit line. Note: despite allowing credit line to be moved between personal and business accounts in the past, Chase is no longer permitting such reallocation in either direction.

With respect to timing, it is better to reduce any CL as soon as you can conveniently do so, e.g., after meeting the bonus spend on a card you do not plan to use regularly thereafter. (Do not reduce CL on a given card if it would increase your "credit utiilization"--that is, the ratio of outstanding balance to CL--above ~30%. A high credit utilization number is a red flag for banks and can adversely affect your credit score.) Waiting until one's next application to lower a CL is less than optimal, as the reduced CL is not immediately recognized by all of Chase's systems.

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.

I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?
It may be better to avoid calling Chase unless your application is denied. Many recent calls on pending applications led to denials, and many people report having success letting applications work their way through the system. Be patient. Time is on your side; increasingly, Chase CSRs are not.

If you do call, expect extensive and possibly hostile questioning. Be prepared to answer questions regarding the need for more credit, past credit apps for both Chase and other banks, income, business finances, etc. Know your CLs with Chase before you call so you know which card/s you are willing to decrease the CLs on. If the app is for a significant other who dislikes such calls, they can authorize you to speak on their behalf and hand the phone over to you.

How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?
Just send Chase a secure message (SM) through your online account. Although the deadline should in theory be N months from the date of approval (not the date of application or card activation)--where N is the number of months specified in the offer--Chase typically pads this period to account for the time required to fabricate and deliver physical cards. For example, a recent "3-month" deadline was in fact 114 days, as confirmed by Chase's SM confirmation.

Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?
Bonus points typically accrue at the close of the billing period in which you incur the corresponding charges. Points should appear in your hotel/airline account within a few days thereafter.

NOTE: If you complete your required spending in the last 7-10 days of the statement period, the bonus may not post until the following month's statement, even if the regular per-dollar points post on the first statement. This is normal behavior for Chase and is not worth a phone call.

Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?
Useful Chase telephone numbers
(800) 432-3117 – General Application Status Line, automated
(800) 436-7927 – Alternative General Application Status Line, automated
(888) 609-7805 – Alternative Personal Reconsideration line with live rep
(888) 269-8690 - Business Credit Card Application Status Line, automated
(800) 453-9719 – Business Credit Card Reconsideration Line with live rep
(800) 955-9900 – General Card Services and Application status, automated
(888) 298-5623 – Credit Reallocation Office (Personal cards)
(800) 453-9719 – Credit Reallocation Office (Business cards)
(888) 622-7547 – Executive Offices
(877) 470-9042 – Personal Application Verification line with live rep
Twitter: @ChaseSupport
Note: In the past, automated telephone status reports stating that Chase would notify you in 2 weeks often resulted in an approval, whereas the "7-10 days" telephone recording often indicated imminent denial. In 2016, this pattern became increasingly unpredictable, with many applicants receiving approval despite an earlier "7-10 days" automated telephone message. As a result, automated telephone responses should not be regarded as reliable indicators of an application's likely outcome.
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Applying for Chase Credit Cards, 2017-2019

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Old Aug 29, 2019, 5:22 am
  #2866  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 354
Originally Posted by nwflyboy
The wiki states this above:



Is this "collective wisdom" up-to-date, and is there anything like a consensus around this?

I do indeed have quite a few Chase cards, and with a fairly large total combined credit line (in fact, around the upper end of the range referenced in the wiki). I'm very tempted to open a new card (I have not opened a Chase card in more than 2 years, I'm currently at 4/24). I have a card I'm not using much which has a fairly large CL, I'm thinking about closing that card or (more likely) reducing the CL substantially (by maybe $10K to 15K) or perhaps doing a product change later. But I'd like to open a new card first. My hope is to get auto-approval for the new card, and looking to optimize my chances of that...so pondering reducing that lightly-used card's CL first.

Any recent experiences to suggest that lowering another cards CL is a good way (or not) to help set up approval? Thanks.
Yes, the wisdom on CL is current.
808traveler is offline  
Old Aug 29, 2019, 6:21 am
  #2867  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, MLife Gold, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Caesars Diamond, Amex Plat
Posts: 5,937
Originally Posted by nwflyboy
The wiki states this above:



Is this "collective wisdom" up-to-date, and is there anything like a consensus around this?

I do indeed have quite a few Chase cards, and with a fairly large total combined credit line (in fact, around the upper end of the range referenced in the wiki). I'm very tempted to open a new card (I have not opened a Chase card in more than 2 years, I'm currently at 4/24). I have a card I'm not using much which has a fairly large CL, I'm thinking about closing that card or (more likely) reducing the CL substantially (by maybe $10K to 15K) or perhaps doing a product change later. But I'd like to open a new card first. My hope is to get auto-approval for the new card, and looking to optimize my chances of that...so pondering reducing that lightly-used card's CL first.

Any recent experiences to suggest that lowering another cards CL is a good way (or not) to help set up approval? Thanks.
I too have quite a few Chase cards, as does spouse. We always lower CL to reasonable limit. Sometimes soon after card opening, sometimes days before new app. Did this two weeks ago and both of us got instant approvals on biz apps, which at least for me rarely happens. Don’t know if it was bc lower CL, but I’ve never had an app denied.
Stgermainparis is offline  
Old Aug 29, 2019, 6:34 am
  #2868  
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,857
Originally Posted by nwflyboy
Is this "collective wisdom" up-to-date, and is there anything like a consensus around this?
I personally would not agree with that $45-$60k range. If your stated income is $50k and you have 1 year of credit history, the right range for total CL from Chase could be $10k-$20k. If your stated income is $300k and you have 25 years of history, particularly with Chase, the number could approach or possibly exceed 6 figures.
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Old Aug 29, 2019, 11:06 am
  #2869  
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Programs: Northwest, United
Posts: 3,256
Originally Posted by pallhedge
I personally would not agree with that $45-$60k range. If your stated income is $50k and you have 1 year of credit history, the right range for total CL from Chase could be $10k-$20k. If your stated income is $300k and you have 25 years of history, particularly with Chase, the number could approach or possibly exceed 6 figures.
In my case, it's definitely the latter (which I've underlined for clarity) - in fact, while you probably just pulled those numbers from thin air, they are actually quite close to my real-world numbers (how did you know that ?). Chase customer for 30 years, they hold our mortgage (almost paid off, with a mountain of equity), FICO 830-850, "never a late or missed payment", lengthy AAOA, modest (but not tiny) credit utilization, the whole shebang. Only non-optimal value is that I do have a large number of cards (most of them with Chase). If that doesn't spook them, they should be very happy with me.

Heck, with just a $50K income and 1 year of credit history, I wouldn't expect to be approved for any credit card! I am always amazed when I hear about folks with that kind of a credit profile getting approved for a stack of cards.

Originally Posted by Stgermainparis
I too have quite a few Chase cards, as does spouse. We always lower CL to reasonable limit. Sometimes soon after card opening, sometimes days before new app. Did this two weeks ago and both of us got instant approvals on biz apps, which at least for me rarely happens. Don’t know if it was bc lower CL, but I’ve never had an app denied.
Good to know (and in fact I'm eyeing a business card, too). Thanks all!
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Last edited by nwflyboy; Aug 29, 2019 at 11:14 am
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Old Aug 30, 2019, 9:23 am
  #2870  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Dreamland
Posts: 927
Employee card vs AU?

I'm wondering... does having an employee card on a Business Amex card (its basically authorized user, but called employee card on their Biz/OPEN products) even need to be considered? Is it like being the primary on Amex Biz cards... meaning, blind to 5/24?
levilevi is offline  
Old Aug 30, 2019, 10:27 am
  #2871  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Programs: HHonors Diamond, IHG Plat, Club Carlson Gold, SPG Gold, Marriott Gold
Posts: 316
Black Star Just for You offer

Is this a preapproved offer only if the APR is fixed for someone who is over 5/24? We have a CIP black star offer with 80K bonus but the quoted APR is not a fixed percentage.
Namaste1 is offline  
Old Aug 30, 2019, 10:38 am
  #2872  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 354
Originally Posted by Namaste1
Is this a preapproved offer only if the APR is fixed for someone who is over 5/24? We have a CIP black star offer with 80K bonus but the quoted APR is not a fixed percentage.
Correct. If a single number isn't given (aka 'fixed') then it isn't an offer that will bypass 5/24
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808traveler is offline  
Old Aug 30, 2019, 10:39 am
  #2873  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 354
Originally Posted by levilevi
I'm wondering... does having an employee card on a Business Amex card (its basically authorized user, but called employee card on their Biz/OPEN products) even need to be considered? Is it like being the primary on Amex Biz cards... meaning, blind to 5/24?
Amex biz card AUs shouldn't be on a personal credit report unless for some reason the account gets negative activity, such as delinquency.
808traveler is offline  
Old Aug 30, 2019, 11:06 am
  #2874  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, MLife Gold, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Caesars Diamond, Amex Plat
Posts: 5,937
The current public offer on the Freedom Unl is 20k after $500 spend (and no 3x points): https://creditcards.chase.com/cash-b...edom-unlimited

My referral offer to family member is for the 3x points but no 20k. Any way to generate a referral for 20k instead of 3x points?
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Old Sep 2, 2019, 9:11 pm
  #2875  
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: NYC
Programs: DL Platinum, AA Plat Pro, Bonvoy Lifetime Platinum, JetBlue Mosaic 3, Amtrak Select
Posts: 966
I fell to 4/24 and literally three days after that was targeted on the Cardmatch.com offer for 100k with Amex Platinum. That ruined my chance to get a Chase Ink.

I had to wait a few more months to get back under 5/24 again... that happened in July. In August, I started getting "just for you" offers on Chase for the Ink Business Preferred for 80k. It's my 6th Chase Card and I was able to get it approved after calling recon to verify some personal details (all happened within an hour of the application)

Hope these tips help someone else

Last edited by uppereastsider; Sep 3, 2019 at 8:03 am Reason: Change to Ink Business Preferred
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Old Sep 2, 2019, 11:57 pm
  #2876  
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 5
Ink Unlimited? Is this a common targeted offer? Anyone else get this?

Originally Posted by uppereastsider
I fell to 4/24 and literally three days after that was targeted on the Cardmatch.com offer for 100k with Amex Platinum. That ruined my chance to get a Chase Ink.

I had to wait a few more months to get back under 5/24 again... that happened in July. In August, I started getting "just for you" offers on Chase for the Ink Business Unlimited for 80k. It's my 6th Chase Card and I was able to get it approved after calling recon to verify some personal details (all happened within an hour of the application)

Hope these tips help someone else
Bluntschli is offline  
Old Sep 3, 2019, 8:03 am
  #2877  
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: NYC
Programs: DL Platinum, AA Plat Pro, Bonvoy Lifetime Platinum, JetBlue Mosaic 3, Amtrak Select
Posts: 966
Originally Posted by Bluntschli
Ink Unlimited? Is this a common targeted offer? Anyone else get this?
Thanks for pointing this out. I meant to type Ink Business Preferred. Post edited
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Old Sep 4, 2019, 9:29 pm
  #2878  
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 34
-dele

-dele

Last edited by cchang4; Jan 5, 2020 at 5:53 pm
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Old Sep 4, 2019, 9:44 pm
  #2879  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: ZOA, SFO, HKG
Programs: UA 1K 0.9MM, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Hertz PC, SBux Gold, TSA Pre✓
Posts: 13,811
I would have to say so.
garykung is offline  
Old Sep 4, 2019, 9:54 pm
  #2880  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 845
Yes, self referral works absolutely fine. Many DPs about it working for business cards when applying using SSN once and EIN another time for the same card.
B747forever is offline  


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