websteth

There are some private banks that waive the AF for clients. I know HSBC and Merril Lynch do

joelfreak

That, of course, was the idea. Not a fee for no reason.

AAdmiral

My point was to make the card more exclusive and inline with the Centurion Card by Amex. If there are between 3k-10k card holders of the JPM Reserve but some are not Private Bank Clients and some are CPC Chase members then let’s try to weed out the membership. Like I said earlier change the fees to the below as the basic annual amount charged with obviously the discretion of the Private Bank Bankers to waive or lower the $2,500 fee depending on the relationship and level of assets held at JPM PB. I’m sure they could negotiate with current co-branded partners to offer top tier levels. Remember when you use your card, the issuer receives a majority of the swipe fee. Sure most JPM Reserve Card holders pay the bill off at the end of the month but the bank receives revenue from the swipe fees. If say you spend $100,000 a year at 2% they would receive $2,000 in fees. I primary use my JPM Reserve followed by my Amex Centurion. I would just like to see more out of the JPM card.

$5000 regular member with no JPM relationship
$4000 fee with Chase Private Client relationship
$2500 fee with JP Morgan Private Bank relationship and includes additional card holder.

747FC

If I recall correctly, you have been advocating this position for years. And, I think, advocating against your own interests: How does JPM benefit (and increase benefits for any card holder), if they reduce the ranks of JPMR cardholders who are spending $100k+ a year, regardless of their banking relationship?

AAdmiral

The airlines and hotels have changed to cater to the customers who spend larger amounts of money and are profitable. Quality over quantity. I’m talking about solidifying the big picture relationship with a different product from the retail banking side not a one size fits all card that’s the same in benefits but just issued in a heavier metal card. United might be willing to offer 1K or Platinum to 3k members versus 30k. Look at Delta with the Centurion and offering Platinum. JPM could offer Hyatt or IHG top elite status with a smaller number that wouldn’t dilute their own members. Just like flying, you pay more for 1st Class versus Business Class but you also get more benefits.

comptalk

If they did that, I would leave the JPM Private Bank, and I know many others would as well. With Schwab now swallowing TD Ameritrade, JPM cannot risk losing any clients due to them. Really dumb idea.... I mean, really.

JFKLAX321

I don't see how there is any serious risk of JP Morgan Private Bank clients defecting to Schwab after its merger with TD Ameritrade. Neither Schwab nor TD Ameritrade compared to or competed with JP Morgan Private Bank before, why would the new entity?

JFKLAX321

I think AAdmiral has a decent point. It seems like there's a market for a more benefit rich version of the card.

747FC -- do you really think that if JPM converted former JPM Reserve Card holders to CSR if they weren't willing to pay the annual fee that they would refuse to use the CSR and/or other Chase cards? The only difference would be the lack of flashiness associated with the JPM Reserve. What would they switch to with similar benefits on travel and dining? The super flashy Amex Green or Gold cards? Or the Citi Prestige? (That's sarcasm; none of those cards are flashy.) They could use an Amex Platinum and earn way less points, I suppose. But that seems like an unreasonable choice, and I doubt most consumers at this or any other level are motivated entirely by a desire to thrown down a flashy card. Also, while JPM/Chase should not aim to lose customers, even if you assume that a substantial increase in benefits and the annual fee resulted in loss of 10,000 customers spending $150,000 a year, that's just $15 million a year. A decent amount, for sure, but a rounding error when you consider that JPM reported 2018 net income of $32 billion.

Boraxo

Agree. $4k AF is a nonstarter for most people, myself included. At that price you would have to provide equivalent value which I have yet to see on any credit card. Think 1K status + Marriott Titanium + Disney private guide - and even then query whether that would attract frequent travelers who already have earned it or who have lifetime status.

IMHO the Private Client bankers need more ammo - not less - to retain clients in light of all the portfolio management tools offered by Schwab, Wealthfront,, Vanguard, Fidelity etc. Chase PC charges a scaled fee starting at 1.3% for a cookie cutter index fund portfolio management that offers little value over the competition (to be fair there are many financial advisors that charge 2% or more for high fee products that line their pockets).

I agree there is a market but it makes no sense to offend your existing client base by relegating them to an inferior product (CSR) which doesn't include the UC lounges. At that point we will likely flee to Amex which at least offers the Amex lounges in addition to PP plus 5x airfare points.

The problem is that bank, airline and hotel executives are cheap - they want to drive business but they don't want to provide meaningful benefits that increase their expenses. But most of their top customers (putting aside athletes and celebs) are too savvy to fall for marketing hype that doesn't deliver the goods. As reported by WSJ today, just about any Joe can get a shiny metal CapOne savor card, and Chase took some heat for downgrading the Marriott cards.

As for your math, I think it's off. If customers are spending $150k a year on JPM cards they probably have high incomes with millions under management. Those are the cream of the crop that everyone wants and brokerage firms used to pay millions to lure brokers with that type of client base. It's not about the interchange fees and the vig on money sitting in checking accounts.

747FC

My point is not that JPM is going to loose customers, but there is no benefit to the company to kick out good customers so that a few can feel a greater sense of exclusivity. This is a company-centric view. It really is not a zero-sum experience for a few more people to have a card. No one is loosing anything of value.

AAdmiral and some others espouse a customer-centric view, and are benefit and/or eclusivity aspirants (nothing wrong with that) who seem to think that benefits will increase if fewer cardholders are in a spending pool. And, there is a belief that having a lot of money in the bank should make one desirable to market to vendors like airlines and hotels. I would think that rather than money in the bank, yearly spend on airlines and hotels is marketable, and there may be little or no correlation between spend and bank account balance once a certain level of disposable income is obtained. Of course, the Centurion card operates on a "spend model," and if you follow that forum, there are not a lot of people raving about the benefits received, and there are many more Centurion card holders (selected primarily by their spend) than JPMR holders. As others have previously opined, having more desirable cardholders in a pool can lead to greater benefits.

As I've mentioned on various fora when others have hoped for better service for increased annual fees, many services like concierges can be puchased directly for much less than what some people would be willing to pay as an increase in their Centurion or JMPR fees. And, buying F tickets or hotel suites really obviates the benefits of having high status in airline or hotel programs.

I'm awaiting the happy day that I am sitting at a bar and meet another JPMR holder as we both plunk down our cards at the same time. I'm sure that we will enjoy a chat. However, since there are so few of us, random meetings are unlikely to happen.

schalliol

Despite removing a bunch of features recently without lowering the fee, it's still the best card out there, but it would be fantastic if they decided to make it a JPM "Quadfecta."

• Existing travel and food benefits/points
• Upgrade base spending to Freedom Unlimited's 1.5x
• Upgrade office/utility spending to Chase Ink Business Cash's 5x and gas spending on that card to 2x
• Upgrade rotating to Freedom 5x Categories

This is actually not an unreasonable thing to do because there's NO fee on the FU, F, and CIBC. How awesome would it be to ditch those cards and have one mega-card that puts them no worse off?

JFKLAX321

We're on the same page. JPM knows what it's doing. If it felt that there were a considerable market for a true Centurion competitor it would probably have introduced such a card. And it's hard to imagine the membership criteria would be asset based; it would likely be based, as you mentioned, on spend.

I see the JPM Reserve relatively frequently in LA and NY.

JFKLAX321

You're right. People with millions in management at JPM Private Bank are going to leave in droves because the shiny metal card they had was taken away from them (or the price of it increased). Makes perfect sense; that's obviously the only compelling reason to keep assets with JPM. Sorry for the confusion. Now this all makes sense.

comptalk

Charles Schwab stated on CNBC that he wants to have a big push into private banking after the merger was announced.

JFKLAX321

I feel like their whole platform has always been, "we don't charge fees and we have cheap index funds" so I wish them the best of luck with the private banking endeavor. From where I am standing, Not a Private Bank + Not a Private Bank does not make a Private Bank.