May 15, 2014, 8:16 am
Last edit by: StartinSanDiego
This thread is now archived. Please follow the topic here: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase-ultimate-rewards/1986148-chase-closed-my-credit-card-account-s-tales-speculation-2019-thread.html
If you feel your account has been unfairly closed, consider filing a complaint with the Consumer Protection Financial Bureau:
CFPB's complaint form: http://www.consumerfinance.gov/complaint/
When someone reports an account closure here, a lot of the same questions get asked. It might be useful to answer some questions in advance. This could help figure out what happened or how to proceed:
2013.9
2013.12 2014.6
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...ta-points.html
On 1/4/15, LivelyFL noted that 34 posts have referenced account closures (updated 1/25/15):
1, 55, 80, 108, 117, 129, 146, 165, 182, 212, 221, 222, 232, 235, 262, 272, 281, 326, 364, 410, 411, 428, 475, 477, 482, 513, 552, 586, 620, 648, 656, 662, 714, 718, 784 and 815.
Mortgasm provided more detail as follows:
001 - moarmiles little explaination - 'inconsistent spending'
055 - brettskyg chase gift cards tiny ms
080 - Artemk checking chase gift card, tiny MS, international wires, wall-mart BP
108 - TTnc4me (105 actually) no info
117 - rodsren
129 - Kybosh chase gift card checking
146 - mintcilantro - checking 6k/month MS, BB payments from another ss#, some MO/AP, 7new cards in 90days, short cycling
165 - newcomr - checking
182 - thehawk75 - heavy MSw/other banks,
212 - LRD - 2x spend of 20k /month (on two cards), checking
221 - iceman 77_7, no info
222 - jk2 no info
232 - hitman1420 checking , heavy MS activity (no number)
235 - clearlyanewb checking, MS activity (10k AGC and more), light credit history, 10 recent inquiries
262 - brc01 - shortcycling, some MS (18k/month over a few cards), 1
272 - rambo - 70% MS on 5 cards, WM BP of 16k/month on 5 cards
281 - prestonv - heavy MS - 20k/month on multiple chase cards, heavy WMBP (ink stayed open)
326 - pacupgo - false alarm, no shutdown
364 - edh101985 - tiny MS (bonus only) , 4 chase cards in 6 months,
410 - msetr - lots of freedom/ink ms
411 - standaman360 - international wires (business), million dollar balances,
428 - queensgambit - gambling transactions, UR point transfer from SO, 5 chase apps 3 new chase cc in 45 days, Blogger points coach
475 - dogloverjb - checking, international wires,
477 - ftomasz - 14 inquiries in 8 months, 5 chase, minimal MS, rapid upswing in credit, paying from multiple accounts
482 - liw5215 - Heavy MS, re-entered after 13 months
513 - thegasguru - checking, $3k/month MO to checking, NO MS, AP,
552 - LAXtoWorld - 3 cards in 30 days
586 - adavydov7 checking, $1k APs,
648 - CMHFlyerOH - checking, MO, 3k gift cards
656 - I can see for miles - Maxed UR 5x rewards on Freedom and Ink cards. Chased closed all accounts. Was approved for Ritz Carlton card 14 months later and did nothing unusual with it, other than lower CL from 30K to 10K to free up CL for possible approvals. Two subsequent Chase apps (Chase Ink and Marriott Rewards), on separate dates 3+ months later, were declined for a "previous unsatisfactory relationship ..."
662 - frogdog51 - Chase VGCs (Reapproved in 12 months)
677 - Subdawg - closed for piggybacking
714 - Mamibear - 'abuse' redcard MS
718 - maxswanson - MS, 11 chase cards, traded UR, (reapproved after 12 months)
752 - peaser - "reputational risk" associated with the business (decision reversed later)
757 - uncommonsensical checking, 3 Cashier's Check deposits with quick w/d (the w/d were to pay CHASE credit cards! ridiculous 'loss prevention' dept. gods). All CC's closed 2 days later. Tried EX Office- they seem to have zero power once the Mullah in loss prevention has issued a fatwa (my guess: some 27 year old with a god complex).
762 - knopfler - checking closed (all credit cards closed in both mine and Mrs. Knopflers accounts about three weeks after checking closure)
771 - milemonkey - 'reputational Risk" connected to Attorney General lawsuit
784 - unstable one: 2 cash deposits over 10k to chase checking
815 - dukerau - one time UR point sale, 77% spending is 5x,
If you feel your account has been unfairly closed, consider filing a complaint with the Consumer Protection Financial Bureau:
CFPB's complaint form: http://www.consumerfinance.gov/complaint/
When someone reports an account closure here, a lot of the same questions get asked. It might be useful to answer some questions in advance. This could help figure out what happened or how to proceed:
- Did you transfer UR points to someone with a different address? Different last name?
- Did you sell UR points to someone?
- Approximately what percentage of your charges earned less than 5x points in the past 12 months?
- Did a Chase or non-Chase bank recently close one of your credit cards?
- Are you using up a large percentage of your credit line on all Chase and non-Chase credit cards?
- Is your total credit line with Chase much higher than with other banks?
- Did you apply for many credit cards or other forms of credit in the past 2 months? ("Many" may be hard to define.)
- If you have a Chase checking account how much did you typically deposit in money orders per month, if any?
- Did you recently start spending a lot more with Chase than in typical months?
- Is your monthly balance frequently close to your credit limit?
- Approximately what percentage of spending was on gift cards this year?
- How much of your bill do you typically pay using WM or KMart bill payment if any?
- Do you have a Chase mortgage or other account that might be profitable to Chase?
- Has your credit score or credit profile changed recently? As in: significantly more debt, more open credit lines, or a large drop in your credit score?
2013.9
2013.12 2014.6
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...ta-points.html
On 1/4/15, LivelyFL noted that 34 posts have referenced account closures (updated 1/25/15):
1, 55, 80, 108, 117, 129, 146, 165, 182, 212, 221, 222, 232, 235, 262, 272, 281, 326, 364, 410, 411, 428, 475, 477, 482, 513, 552, 586, 620, 648, 656, 662, 714, 718, 784 and 815.
Mortgasm provided more detail as follows:
001 - moarmiles little explaination - 'inconsistent spending'
055 - brettskyg chase gift cards tiny ms
080 - Artemk checking chase gift card, tiny MS, international wires, wall-mart BP
108 - TTnc4me (105 actually) no info
117 - rodsren
129 - Kybosh chase gift card checking
146 - mintcilantro - checking 6k/month MS, BB payments from another ss#, some MO/AP, 7new cards in 90days, short cycling
165 - newcomr - checking
182 - thehawk75 - heavy MSw/other banks,
212 - LRD - 2x spend of 20k /month (on two cards), checking
221 - iceman 77_7, no info
222 - jk2 no info
232 - hitman1420 checking , heavy MS activity (no number)
235 - clearlyanewb checking, MS activity (10k AGC and more), light credit history, 10 recent inquiries
262 - brc01 - shortcycling, some MS (18k/month over a few cards), 1
272 - rambo - 70% MS on 5 cards, WM BP of 16k/month on 5 cards
281 - prestonv - heavy MS - 20k/month on multiple chase cards, heavy WMBP (ink stayed open)
326 - pacupgo - false alarm, no shutdown
364 - edh101985 - tiny MS (bonus only) , 4 chase cards in 6 months,
410 - msetr - lots of freedom/ink ms
411 - standaman360 - international wires (business), million dollar balances,
428 - queensgambit - gambling transactions, UR point transfer from SO, 5 chase apps 3 new chase cc in 45 days, Blogger points coach
475 - dogloverjb - checking, international wires,
477 - ftomasz - 14 inquiries in 8 months, 5 chase, minimal MS, rapid upswing in credit, paying from multiple accounts
482 - liw5215 - Heavy MS, re-entered after 13 months
513 - thegasguru - checking, $3k/month MO to checking, NO MS, AP,
552 - LAXtoWorld - 3 cards in 30 days
586 - adavydov7 checking, $1k APs,
648 - CMHFlyerOH - checking, MO, 3k gift cards
656 - I can see for miles - Maxed UR 5x rewards on Freedom and Ink cards. Chased closed all accounts. Was approved for Ritz Carlton card 14 months later and did nothing unusual with it, other than lower CL from 30K to 10K to free up CL for possible approvals. Two subsequent Chase apps (Chase Ink and Marriott Rewards), on separate dates 3+ months later, were declined for a "previous unsatisfactory relationship ..."
662 - frogdog51 - Chase VGCs (Reapproved in 12 months)
677 - Subdawg - closed for piggybacking
714 - Mamibear - 'abuse' redcard MS
718 - maxswanson - MS, 11 chase cards, traded UR, (reapproved after 12 months)
752 - peaser - "reputational risk" associated with the business (decision reversed later)
757 - uncommonsensical checking, 3 Cashier's Check deposits with quick w/d (the w/d were to pay CHASE credit cards! ridiculous 'loss prevention' dept. gods). All CC's closed 2 days later. Tried EX Office- they seem to have zero power once the Mullah in loss prevention has issued a fatwa (my guess: some 27 year old with a god complex).
762 - knopfler - checking closed (all credit cards closed in both mine and Mrs. Knopflers accounts about three weeks after checking closure)
771 - milemonkey - 'reputational Risk" connected to Attorney General lawsuit
784 - unstable one: 2 cash deposits over 10k to chase checking
815 - dukerau - one time UR point sale, 77% spending is 5x,
Chase closed my credit card account(s) [Archived 2013-mid 2019]
May 9, 2015, 7:16 am
#886
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 404
......I suppose the one time sale could do it, it just seems a LONG time ago. I never hid that from you guys when explaining my situation. I thought many times chase was closing the individual account that was making sales/prohibited transactions?
May 9, 2015, 11:16 am
#887
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: JZRO
Posts: 9,169
RNE, not stating or implying that the OP did anything wrong, merely opining how things may appear to a bank.
May 9, 2015, 11:17 am
#888
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 265
Another thing I learned here is that if they close one account, all of them will follow. It is a bad situation, and some won't share because they are shamed for it. I commend those who share and help other learn from their experience.
May 10, 2015, 8:21 am
#889
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 41
Anyone know of a case where this type of transfer led to a Chase shutdown ?
May 10, 2015, 9:07 am
#890
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: JZRO
Posts: 9,169
We may never know why Chase did what it did. Sometimes the reason(s) are obvious, other times not so much. But let's dispell the notion that Chase would act without what it considers just cause. Therefore, if/when this happens to you, take a long, thorough look at anything and everything that could be actionable by Chase. Whatever you find, that's probably why it happened. Tell us and then we'll all learn.
May 10, 2015, 11:29 am
#891
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 119
My Freedom and CSP are working fine today but I still don't have access to my online account. Hopefully just a false alarm. I want to get back in and transfer the rest of my points out ASAP.
May 10, 2015, 11:40 am
#892
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Midwest
Programs: Southwest CP, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Platinum, Club Carlson Gold
Posts: 69
Is the line re: "not consistent with personal, family, or household use" recognizable to others in this thread? Yes, I did a bunch of MS. What triggered their internal review, I think, was using up one card's limit, paying down and then reusing limit during the same statement cycle.
May 10, 2015, 11:59 am
#893
Join Date: Sep 2005
Programs: Northwest, United
Posts: 3,256
Yes, I know that many MSers here do this - regularly, and gleefully - but it just seems sooooo suspicious to me and I don't extend credit to millions of strangers. Think about it: Chase extends you a CL of, say, $25K (that's based on your stated income of, let's say $125K - I'm just pulling numbers from my arse...). Every month you charge up $20K, pay off $20K, then repeat within the same statement cycle. After a single month, you have churned more than your CL. After a few months, you have churned more than your annual income. There are very few justifications for this kind of activity that Chase (or anyone looking to protect their interests) can really imagine. Anyone that looks like that is going to look like a serious risk, and they don't like risks. There are plenty of non-risky customers and potential customers out there that they would rather have.
Yes, I know lots of people here play this short-cycling game. I am amazed at how long they get away with it. YMMV, but that kind of game seems to me like a great way to get blacklisted. I value my relationship with Chase way too much to go there.
May 10, 2015, 3:48 pm
#894
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Upper Sternistan
Posts: 10,034
This practice - running your balance up and paying it down, multiple times during a statement cycle - seems like an invitation to shutdown.
Yes, I know that many MSers here do this - regularly, and gleefully - but it just seems sooooo suspicious to me and I don't extend credit to millions of strangers. Think about it: Chase extends you a CL of, say, $25K (that's based on your stated income of, let's say $125K - I'm just pulling numbers from my arse...). Every month you charge up $20K, pay off $20K, then repeat within the same statement cycle. After a single month, you have churned more than your CL. After a few months, you have churned more than your annual income. There are very few justifications for this kind of activity that Chase (or anyone looking to protect their interests) can really imagine. Anyone that looks like that is going to look like a serious risk, and they don't like risks. There are plenty of non-risky customers and potential customers out there that they would rather have.
Yes, I know lots of people here play this short-cycling game. I am amazed at how long they get away with it. YMMV, but that kind of game seems to me like a great way to get blacklisted. I value my relationship with Chase way too much to go there.
Yes, I know that many MSers here do this - regularly, and gleefully - but it just seems sooooo suspicious to me and I don't extend credit to millions of strangers. Think about it: Chase extends you a CL of, say, $25K (that's based on your stated income of, let's say $125K - I'm just pulling numbers from my arse...). Every month you charge up $20K, pay off $20K, then repeat within the same statement cycle. After a single month, you have churned more than your CL. After a few months, you have churned more than your annual income. There are very few justifications for this kind of activity that Chase (or anyone looking to protect their interests) can really imagine. Anyone that looks like that is going to look like a serious risk, and they don't like risks. There are plenty of non-risky customers and potential customers out there that they would rather have.
Yes, I know lots of people here play this short-cycling game. I am amazed at how long they get away with it. YMMV, but that kind of game seems to me like a great way to get blacklisted. I value my relationship with Chase way too much to go there.
But is Chase really taking on more risk? Their exposure is still the $25K CL.
I guess the chances of a default might be higher, but their exposure is no greater.
May 10, 2015, 8:16 pm
#895
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 404
Is the line re: "not consistent with personal, family, or household use" recognizable to others in this thread? Yes, I did a bunch of MS. What triggered their internal review, I think, was using up one card's limit, paying down and then reusing limit during the same statement cycle.
May 11, 2015, 1:52 am
#896
Suspended
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 8,460
This practice - running your balance up and paying it down, multiple times during a statement cycle - seems like an invitation to shutdown.
Yes, I know that many MSers here do this - regularly, and gleefully - but it just seems sooooo suspicious to me and I don't extend credit to millions of strangers. Think about it: Chase extends you a CL of, say, $25K (that's based on your stated income of, let's say $125K - I'm just pulling numbers from my arse...). Every month you charge up $20K, pay off $20K, then repeat within the same statement cycle. After a single month, you have churned more than your CL. After a few months, you have churned more than your annual income. There are very few justifications for this kind of activity that Chase (or anyone looking to protect their interests) can really imagine. Anyone that looks like that is going to look like a serious risk, and they don't like risks. There are plenty of non-risky customers and potential customers out there that they would rather have.
Yes, I know lots of people here play this short-cycling game. I am amazed at how long they get away with it. YMMV, but that kind of game seems to me like a great way to get blacklisted. I value my relationship with Chase way too much to go there.
Yes, I know that many MSers here do this - regularly, and gleefully - but it just seems sooooo suspicious to me and I don't extend credit to millions of strangers. Think about it: Chase extends you a CL of, say, $25K (that's based on your stated income of, let's say $125K - I'm just pulling numbers from my arse...). Every month you charge up $20K, pay off $20K, then repeat within the same statement cycle. After a single month, you have churned more than your CL. After a few months, you have churned more than your annual income. There are very few justifications for this kind of activity that Chase (or anyone looking to protect their interests) can really imagine. Anyone that looks like that is going to look like a serious risk, and they don't like risks. There are plenty of non-risky customers and potential customers out there that they would rather have.
Yes, I know lots of people here play this short-cycling game. I am amazed at how long they get away with it. YMMV, but that kind of game seems to me like a great way to get blacklisted. I value my relationship with Chase way too much to go there.
May 11, 2015, 9:24 am
#897
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,303
Because by default you are riskier to them when you reported an income of 100k and MS'd (I mean spent) 200K for the year on the card. Plenty of folks have business expenses they get reimbursed for, but it could potentially raise a red flag within Chase. Often times they'd rather just end a relationship and find someone else they know is no trouble and profitable to them rather than have to wonder if someone is trouble down the road. Spending more than your credit limit with chase month after month and paying it off intra-month to clear more space is something I'd avoid. All they have to do is request your receipts from vendors and about ten minutes later they'd have all they need to know to send you your pink slip on a guy making 100k spending 200k for the year.
May 11, 2015, 11:00 am
#898
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: JZRO
Posts: 9,169
RNE, repeatedly advising one and all to stay on Chase's good side.
May 11, 2015, 11:58 am
#899
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: ORD, LAS
Programs: AA-EXP, BAEC Silver, Hyatt-Globalist, Hilton-gold, SPG-gold
Posts: 855
I am not sure who you sold to, but I did meet someone who told me that they had their American Airlines account shut down when American identified a broker they sold to and traced back the source of all the miles. In this case it could take awhile before irregular activity is identified.
May 12, 2015, 11:39 am
#900
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 544
So, I'm relatively new to FT, and this Chase closing accounts stuff has me spooked! I have a bunch of cards, which I use sparingly and (to my mind) appropriately. I.e., using a Marriott card for Marriott stays, United card for United flights, IHG card for IHG stays, etc. My Sapphire Preferred and Freedom are my usual go to cards. I have about 250k points (from my own monthly spend plus transfers from my wife's account). I know I'm probably going to eventually use the points for United, but don't have any redemptions now. I'd like to keep the points in UR for now, in case I want to use them for something else (I've gotten good value on an Amtrak sleeper car in the past, for example), but also don't want to risk losing them. Should I just transfer to United now and not worry about it, or is the risk of them being confiscated so low that it makes sense to preserve flexibility?
Any thoughts are much appreciated!
Any thoughts are much appreciated!