May 15, 2014, 8:16 am
Last edit by: StartinSanDiego
This thread is now archived. Please follow the topic here: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase-ultimate-rewards/1986148-chase-closed-my-credit-card-account-s-tales-speculation-2019-thread.html
If you feel your account has been unfairly closed, consider filing a complaint with the Consumer Protection Financial Bureau:
CFPB's complaint form: http://www.consumerfinance.gov/complaint/
When someone reports an account closure here, a lot of the same questions get asked. It might be useful to answer some questions in advance. This could help figure out what happened or how to proceed:
2013.9
2013.12 2014.6
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...ta-points.html
On 1/4/15, LivelyFL noted that 34 posts have referenced account closures (updated 1/25/15):
1, 55, 80, 108, 117, 129, 146, 165, 182, 212, 221, 222, 232, 235, 262, 272, 281, 326, 364, 410, 411, 428, 475, 477, 482, 513, 552, 586, 620, 648, 656, 662, 714, 718, 784 and 815.
Mortgasm provided more detail as follows:
001 - moarmiles little explaination - 'inconsistent spending'
055 - brettskyg chase gift cards tiny ms
080 - Artemk checking chase gift card, tiny MS, international wires, wall-mart BP
108 - TTnc4me (105 actually) no info
117 - rodsren
129 - Kybosh chase gift card checking
146 - mintcilantro - checking 6k/month MS, BB payments from another ss#, some MO/AP, 7new cards in 90days, short cycling
165 - newcomr - checking
182 - thehawk75 - heavy MSw/other banks,
212 - LRD - 2x spend of 20k /month (on two cards), checking
221 - iceman 77_7, no info
222 - jk2 no info
232 - hitman1420 checking , heavy MS activity (no number)
235 - clearlyanewb checking, MS activity (10k AGC and more), light credit history, 10 recent inquiries
262 - brc01 - shortcycling, some MS (18k/month over a few cards), 1
272 - rambo - 70% MS on 5 cards, WM BP of 16k/month on 5 cards
281 - prestonv - heavy MS - 20k/month on multiple chase cards, heavy WMBP (ink stayed open)
326 - pacupgo - false alarm, no shutdown
364 - edh101985 - tiny MS (bonus only) , 4 chase cards in 6 months,
410 - msetr - lots of freedom/ink ms
411 - standaman360 - international wires (business), million dollar balances,
428 - queensgambit - gambling transactions, UR point transfer from SO, 5 chase apps 3 new chase cc in 45 days, Blogger points coach
475 - dogloverjb - checking, international wires,
477 - ftomasz - 14 inquiries in 8 months, 5 chase, minimal MS, rapid upswing in credit, paying from multiple accounts
482 - liw5215 - Heavy MS, re-entered after 13 months
513 - thegasguru - checking, $3k/month MO to checking, NO MS, AP,
552 - LAXtoWorld - 3 cards in 30 days
586 - adavydov7 checking, $1k APs,
648 - CMHFlyerOH - checking, MO, 3k gift cards
656 - I can see for miles - Maxed UR 5x rewards on Freedom and Ink cards. Chased closed all accounts. Was approved for Ritz Carlton card 14 months later and did nothing unusual with it, other than lower CL from 30K to 10K to free up CL for possible approvals. Two subsequent Chase apps (Chase Ink and Marriott Rewards), on separate dates 3+ months later, were declined for a "previous unsatisfactory relationship ..."
662 - frogdog51 - Chase VGCs (Reapproved in 12 months)
677 - Subdawg - closed for piggybacking
714 - Mamibear - 'abuse' redcard MS
718 - maxswanson - MS, 11 chase cards, traded UR, (reapproved after 12 months)
752 - peaser - "reputational risk" associated with the business (decision reversed later)
757 - uncommonsensical checking, 3 Cashier's Check deposits with quick w/d (the w/d were to pay CHASE credit cards! ridiculous 'loss prevention' dept. gods). All CC's closed 2 days later. Tried EX Office- they seem to have zero power once the Mullah in loss prevention has issued a fatwa (my guess: some 27 year old with a god complex).
762 - knopfler - checking closed (all credit cards closed in both mine and Mrs. Knopflers accounts about three weeks after checking closure)
771 - milemonkey - 'reputational Risk" connected to Attorney General lawsuit
784 - unstable one: 2 cash deposits over 10k to chase checking
815 - dukerau - one time UR point sale, 77% spending is 5x,
If you feel your account has been unfairly closed, consider filing a complaint with the Consumer Protection Financial Bureau:
CFPB's complaint form: http://www.consumerfinance.gov/complaint/
When someone reports an account closure here, a lot of the same questions get asked. It might be useful to answer some questions in advance. This could help figure out what happened or how to proceed:
- Did you transfer UR points to someone with a different address? Different last name?
- Did you sell UR points to someone?
- Approximately what percentage of your charges earned less than 5x points in the past 12 months?
- Did a Chase or non-Chase bank recently close one of your credit cards?
- Are you using up a large percentage of your credit line on all Chase and non-Chase credit cards?
- Is your total credit line with Chase much higher than with other banks?
- Did you apply for many credit cards or other forms of credit in the past 2 months? ("Many" may be hard to define.)
- If you have a Chase checking account how much did you typically deposit in money orders per month, if any?
- Did you recently start spending a lot more with Chase than in typical months?
- Is your monthly balance frequently close to your credit limit?
- Approximately what percentage of spending was on gift cards this year?
- How much of your bill do you typically pay using WM or KMart bill payment if any?
- Do you have a Chase mortgage or other account that might be profitable to Chase?
- Has your credit score or credit profile changed recently? As in: significantly more debt, more open credit lines, or a large drop in your credit score?
2013.9
2013.12 2014.6
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...ta-points.html
On 1/4/15, LivelyFL noted that 34 posts have referenced account closures (updated 1/25/15):
1, 55, 80, 108, 117, 129, 146, 165, 182, 212, 221, 222, 232, 235, 262, 272, 281, 326, 364, 410, 411, 428, 475, 477, 482, 513, 552, 586, 620, 648, 656, 662, 714, 718, 784 and 815.
Mortgasm provided more detail as follows:
001 - moarmiles little explaination - 'inconsistent spending'
055 - brettskyg chase gift cards tiny ms
080 - Artemk checking chase gift card, tiny MS, international wires, wall-mart BP
108 - TTnc4me (105 actually) no info
117 - rodsren
129 - Kybosh chase gift card checking
146 - mintcilantro - checking 6k/month MS, BB payments from another ss#, some MO/AP, 7new cards in 90days, short cycling
165 - newcomr - checking
182 - thehawk75 - heavy MSw/other banks,
212 - LRD - 2x spend of 20k /month (on two cards), checking
221 - iceman 77_7, no info
222 - jk2 no info
232 - hitman1420 checking , heavy MS activity (no number)
235 - clearlyanewb checking, MS activity (10k AGC and more), light credit history, 10 recent inquiries
262 - brc01 - shortcycling, some MS (18k/month over a few cards), 1
272 - rambo - 70% MS on 5 cards, WM BP of 16k/month on 5 cards
281 - prestonv - heavy MS - 20k/month on multiple chase cards, heavy WMBP (ink stayed open)
326 - pacupgo - false alarm, no shutdown
364 - edh101985 - tiny MS (bonus only) , 4 chase cards in 6 months,
410 - msetr - lots of freedom/ink ms
411 - standaman360 - international wires (business), million dollar balances,
428 - queensgambit - gambling transactions, UR point transfer from SO, 5 chase apps 3 new chase cc in 45 days, Blogger points coach
475 - dogloverjb - checking, international wires,
477 - ftomasz - 14 inquiries in 8 months, 5 chase, minimal MS, rapid upswing in credit, paying from multiple accounts
482 - liw5215 - Heavy MS, re-entered after 13 months
513 - thegasguru - checking, $3k/month MO to checking, NO MS, AP,
552 - LAXtoWorld - 3 cards in 30 days
586 - adavydov7 checking, $1k APs,
648 - CMHFlyerOH - checking, MO, 3k gift cards
656 - I can see for miles - Maxed UR 5x rewards on Freedom and Ink cards. Chased closed all accounts. Was approved for Ritz Carlton card 14 months later and did nothing unusual with it, other than lower CL from 30K to 10K to free up CL for possible approvals. Two subsequent Chase apps (Chase Ink and Marriott Rewards), on separate dates 3+ months later, were declined for a "previous unsatisfactory relationship ..."
662 - frogdog51 - Chase VGCs (Reapproved in 12 months)
677 - Subdawg - closed for piggybacking
714 - Mamibear - 'abuse' redcard MS
718 - maxswanson - MS, 11 chase cards, traded UR, (reapproved after 12 months)
752 - peaser - "reputational risk" associated with the business (decision reversed later)
757 - uncommonsensical checking, 3 Cashier's Check deposits with quick w/d (the w/d were to pay CHASE credit cards! ridiculous 'loss prevention' dept. gods). All CC's closed 2 days later. Tried EX Office- they seem to have zero power once the Mullah in loss prevention has issued a fatwa (my guess: some 27 year old with a god complex).
762 - knopfler - checking closed (all credit cards closed in both mine and Mrs. Knopflers accounts about three weeks after checking closure)
771 - milemonkey - 'reputational Risk" connected to Attorney General lawsuit
784 - unstable one: 2 cash deposits over 10k to chase checking
815 - dukerau - one time UR point sale, 77% spending is 5x,
Chase closed my credit card account(s) [Archived 2013-mid 2019]
Dec 4, 2013, 10:37 am
#31
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: SoCal
Programs: AA EXP, SPG Lifetime Platinum, MR Platinum, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 249
not to get off topic, i currently use my ink in office supply and the other 5x bonus categories to maximize the earnings...i hardly charge anything else as i use spg. should i use more of the normal personal spending on ink to hide most of the 5x categories? what are others doing ? i only spend about 600 on phone bills, internet , cable, and office stores ( mainly gas cards)
I do as you but also mix in some restaurants, Fast Food, Starbucks.... to mix it up a little. Also do some obvious personal spend at Macys and such. Have not had any issues to date but I also move points out the day they post just in case!!!
I do as you but also mix in some restaurants, Fast Food, Starbucks.... to mix it up a little. Also do some obvious personal spend at Macys and such. Have not had any issues to date but I also move points out the day they post just in case!!!
Dec 4, 2013, 10:45 am
#32
Join Date: Jan 2011
Programs: UA S, Marriott P
Posts: 1,154
not to get off topic, i currently use my ink in office supply and the other 5x bonus categories to maximize the earnings...i hardly charge anything else as i use spg. should i use more of the normal personal spending on ink to hide most of the 5x categories? what are others doing ? i only spend about 600 on phone bills, internet , cable, and office stores ( mainly gas cards)
I do as you but also mix in some restaurants, Fast Food, Starbucks.... to mix it up a little. Also do some obvious personal spend at Macys and such. Have not had any issues to date but I also move points out the day they post just in case!!!
I do as you but also mix in some restaurants, Fast Food, Starbucks.... to mix it up a little. Also do some obvious personal spend at Macys and such. Have not had any issues to date but I also move points out the day they post just in case!!!
pretty much anything can be a business expense, especially for sole proprietor/consultant.
Dec 4, 2013, 10:52 am
#33
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: NYC
Programs: UA 1K, AA EP, Hyatt Diamond, SPG Platinum, M life Noir
Posts: 1,279
I agree, but just so anyone reading this thread doesn't get the wrong idea, you are not supposed to write-off suit purchases on your taxes.
Dec 4, 2013, 11:50 am
#34
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 83
Very doubtful that it was your high UR balance. I have had over 1 million UR in my account and know of others with the same.
Dec 4, 2013, 12:23 pm
#35
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 771
not to get off topic, i currently use my ink in office supply and the other 5x bonus categories to maximize the earnings...i hardly charge anything else as i use spg. should i use more of the normal personal spending on ink to hide most of the 5x categories? what are others doing ? i only spend about 600 on phone bills, internet , cable, and office stores ( mainly gas cards)
I do as you but also mix in some restaurants, Fast Food, Starbucks.... to mix it up a little. Also do some obvious personal spend at Macys and such. Have not had any issues to date but I also move points out the day they post just in case!!!
I do as you but also mix in some restaurants, Fast Food, Starbucks.... to mix it up a little. Also do some obvious personal spend at Macys and such. Have not had any issues to date but I also move points out the day they post just in case!!!
Dec 4, 2013, 12:25 pm
#36
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
Sure, there are exceptions to the rule, but the bottom line is that non-specialty clothing required for work, e.g. a suit, isn't a reasonable and ordinary expense.
Dec 4, 2013, 7:40 pm
#37
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: HPN
Programs: not anymore! I'm FREE!
Posts: 3,459
Dec 5, 2013, 11:47 am
#38
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: world
Programs: all
Posts: 1,422
Uh, let's see. This is a bank that has admitted to committing fraud and is paying out billions of dollars in a settlement with the feds. Closing accounts with large balances but little usage in order to reduce their liability is just another fraudulent behavior. Given their past behavior with mortgage-backed securities, why would one expect them to behave differently in their credit card business?
You have a point. However, it is not really worth for a bank this size to do fraud for small things. Miles wont move the needle (in terms of increasing eps) for this of gargantuan bank. Multi billion dollar fraud is a different thing..is worth the while..makes a difference
its like what Donald Trump said...if you owe the bank a million dollars you are F+*&%&.... if you owe the bank a billion dollars, they are F&%*&^
Dec 5, 2013, 12:18 pm
#39
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: NYC
Programs: UA 1K, AA EP, Hyatt Diamond, SPG Platinum, M life Noir
Posts: 1,279
Uh, let's see. This is a bank that has admitted to committing fraud and is paying out billions of dollars in a settlement with the feds. Closing accounts with large balances but little usage in order to reduce their liability is just another fraudulent behavior. Given their past behavior with mortgage-backed securities, why would one expect them to behave differently in their credit card business?
Almost every major company out there has been accused or gotten in trouble for some kind of wrongdoing or alleged wrongdoing, that doesn't mean that all companies are out there are trying to screw you over all the time. Although I'm sure it's a popular opinion.
Dec 5, 2013, 12:21 pm
#40
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Southern California
Programs: Alaska MVP 75K, Delta Plat, Bonvoy Ambasador, Hilton diamond.
Posts: 527
You have a point. However, it is not really worth for a bank this size to do fraud for small things. Miles wont move the needle (in terms of increasing eps) for this of gargantuan bank. Multi billion dollar fraud is a different thing..is worth the while..makes a difference
its like what Donald Trump said...if you owe the bank a million dollars you are F+*&%&.... if you owe the bank a billion dollars, they are F&%*&^
its like what Donald Trump said...if you owe the bank a million dollars you are F+*&%&.... if you owe the bank a billion dollars, they are F&%*&^
...oh and I fully think Chase is cherry picking customers off to reduce liability. This is not new behavior in any shape way or form. Just because you are "not a big fish" you should not expect to receive ethical treatment, in fact being a small fish only makes you an easier target for a large corporate entity like Chase.
Dec 5, 2013, 2:17 pm
#41
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: HPN
Programs: not anymore! I'm FREE!
Posts: 3,459
And then there's the truth. JPMorgan did not actually admit to committing fraud in the recent MBS settlement;
that would be financial and legal suicide for them. The federal government punishing JPMorgan for doing something they begged the company to do (acquire WaMu and Bear Stearns at the height of the financial crisis) has very little to do with the any incentive they may have to end a credit card relationship with one individual. With JPMC in the government's crosshairs right now, do you really think they'd be unjustly terminating individuals' credit card relationships in order to save a few bucks, when they have over $2,500,000,000,000 in assets?
How do you think Chase got to be so enormous? By cultivating a culture of honesty and ethical behavior? Believe that if you want to. I don't.
I didn't say all companies are "trying to screw you over all the time." I'm saying that JP Morgan Chase is, at least some of the time. For one thing, there are some who say the 13.5 billion dollar settlement is far too low in proportion to the harm they did.
Dec 5, 2013, 2:55 pm
#42
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: NYC
Programs: UA 1K, AA EP, Hyatt Diamond, SPG Platinum, M life Noir
Posts: 1,279
Personally, I think almost everyone involved in the MBS meltdown is at fault, from the people buying homes they knew they couldn't afford, to the government and regulators for incentivizing (or at least not curtailing) such behavior, to the banks for not being more forthcoming with the risk in their MBS products, to the ratings agencies for not highlighting the risk as is the entire purpose of their existence.
I do - because it's not Jamie Dimon or whatever his name is sitting there and deciding to terminate the OP's account. It's someone way down on the management chart, who has to answer for the profitability of his particular part of the business. That person wants to keep his job, get promoted, earn his annual bonus, whatever. He looks around and sees all the other fraud that his managers turn a blind eye to. Then he says, well, I guess it's OK if I do that too.
And there are others who think it was far too high. I think the U.S. government is ultimately shooting themselves in the foot since no bank will want to come to the rescue ever again should the economy tank. But that's just my opinion.
Dec 5, 2013, 6:33 pm
#43
Join Date: Aug 2008
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 1,714
While we're searching for the truth let's get something straight - the bolded bit is factually incorrect. We can discuss this in OMNI if you like but the swallowing up of Bear Stearns was hailed as "cheap" by Dimon himself (http://www.cnbc.com/id/25211297) and Dimon was hailed as a genius for doing the deal at the time - that's hardly the government "begging" is it? It's funny how, when the deal looked good, the financial media couldn't praise Dimon enough....and now that it isn't looking quite so clever the same hacks are screaming that the government begged for the deal and that Dimon was doing them a favor at the time.
Dec 5, 2013, 7:10 pm
#44
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: HPN
Programs: not anymore! I'm FREE!
Posts: 3,459
We can go around in circles forever about the OT issues, so I'll drop it.
Unless and until the OP chimes in with more info, we won't know whether there is indeed more to the story. You might be right that there is, but I don't put it beyond even a trillion dollar bank to decide that a small customer is unprofitable and drop him. There are plenty of reports on this forum about the automated nature of Chase's decision-making in their credit card business. I don't think it would be surprising to find that they've implemented an algorithm to identify and eliminate unprofitable customers. If there continue to be reports of seemingly baseless account closures, then we'll know something like that is going on.
Unless and until the OP chimes in with more info, we won't know whether there is indeed more to the story. You might be right that there is, but I don't put it beyond even a trillion dollar bank to decide that a small customer is unprofitable and drop him. There are plenty of reports on this forum about the automated nature of Chase's decision-making in their credit card business. I don't think it would be surprising to find that they've implemented an algorithm to identify and eliminate unprofitable customers. If there continue to be reports of seemingly baseless account closures, then we'll know something like that is going on.
Dec 5, 2013, 11:35 pm
#45
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: NYC
Programs: UA 1K, AA EP, Hyatt Diamond, SPG Platinum, M life Noir
Posts: 1,279
Bolding mine
While we're searching for the truth let's get something straight - the bolded bit is factually incorrect. We can discuss this in OMNI if you like but the swallowing up of Bear Stearns was hailed as "cheap" by Dimon himself (http://www.cnbc.com/id/25211297) and Dimon was hailed as a genius for doing the deal at the time - that's hardly the government "begging" is it? It's funny how, when the deal looked good, the financial media couldn't praise Dimon enough....and now that it isn't looking quite so clever the same hacks are screaming that the government begged for the deal and that Dimon was doing them a favor at the time.
While we're searching for the truth let's get something straight - the bolded bit is factually incorrect. We can discuss this in OMNI if you like but the swallowing up of Bear Stearns was hailed as "cheap" by Dimon himself (http://www.cnbc.com/id/25211297) and Dimon was hailed as a genius for doing the deal at the time - that's hardly the government "begging" is it? It's funny how, when the deal looked good, the financial media couldn't praise Dimon enough....and now that it isn't looking quite so clever the same hacks are screaming that the government begged for the deal and that Dimon was doing them a favor at the time.
Originally Posted by snic
Unless and until the OP chimes in with more info, we won't know whether there is indeed more to the story. You might be right that there is, but I don't put it beyond even a trillion dollar bank to decide that a small customer is unprofitable and drop him. There are plenty of reports on this forum about the automated nature of Chase's decision-making in their credit card business. I don't think it would be surprising to find that they've implemented an algorithm to identify and eliminate unprofitable customers. If there continue to be reports of seemingly baseless account closures, then we'll know something like that is going on.