Mar 7, 2014, 7:25 pm
Last edit by: der_saeufer
Why should I keep my CSP?
When downgrading, the card number does not change, but the expiration date and CVV will. The downgraded account retains the same credit limit and opening date, so it doesn't change AAoA nor count towards 5/24.
What's the best use of UR points?
Possible reasons to keep the card include
For additional details, see the CSP Benefits Guide.
Why should I cancel my CSP?- ability to earn 2 UR points/dollar on travel & dining expenses
- primary insurance coverage on rental cars
- See post #369 for an example of how this has real financial value
- 7% annual dividend (Note that this benefit ends in early 2016 with the award of the 2015 dividend.)
- no forex fees
- ability to transfer points at 1:1 (in many cases instantly) to a wide range of airline & hotel partners
- the potential difficulty in being approved again later for a second CSP
- See this wiki for details
- synergy with Freedom or other Chase card earning UR points
- you are among the few customers who receive a retention bonus offsetting the cost of the annual fee
For additional details, see the CSP Benefits Guide.
Possible reasons to cancel the card include
Why should I downgrade my CSP?- lack of interest in the UR transfer partner programs (or you hold, or will hold, another transfer-eligible premium card, such as the Ink Plus)
- you have a no-fee Freedom card to which you can transfer (and warehouse at no cost) your UR points
- you plan to re-apply & earn a second signup bonus at a later date or with a different first-year-free UR card
- Note: In 2015, Chase UR cards became much more difficult to churn
- you would rather use a 2% cashback card for most spending
- benefits of the card in your particular circumstances are outweighed by the annual fee
Possible reasons to downgrade the card include
What can I downgrade to (no AF), and why would I want to?- Opened a new CSR account for that sweet, sweet bonus. The CSP offers nothing that the CSR doesn't, so there's little point in keeping both--the AF is refunded in full if you downgrade within 60 days. There are conflicting reports of prorated refunds for downgrades >60 days after the fee is charged. AF refunds generally post within a day or two.
- You plan to re-apply & earn a second signup bonus at a later date or with a different first-year-free UR card, but have a UR balance you want to keep
- You're waiting out 5/24 to get CSR and you don't want to pay the CSP AF
- Sapphire (non-preferred). Not much point in this. No UR transfers to partners, 2x on dining, 1x on everything else. This card no longer exists for new customers, but it was still a downgrade option from CSP as of 9/16.
- Freedom. 5x bonus categories, rotating by quarter, 1x on everything else. If you downgrade and activate the bonus, you'll get the bonus retroactive to the beginning of the quarter. When they overlap, you get both (e.g. Jul-Sep '16 restaurants paid with CSP pre-downgrade get base points plus 1 extra from CSP and 4 extra from Freedom)
- Freedom Unlimited. 1.5x on everything.
When downgrading, the card number does not change, but the expiration date and CVV will. The downgraded account retains the same credit limit and opening date, so it doesn't change AAoA nor count towards 5/24.
Please read about/discuss this issue in Best use of Ultimate Rewards points [Consolidated].
Chase Sapphire Preferred - Keep, Downgrade, or Cancel?
Jun 4, 2012, 11:27 am
#16
Join Date: May 2008
Location: SFO
Posts: 851
On the flip side, Chase is a little more draconian than others, say Citi, about # of cards you have. I've got 2 freedoms, a UA, the CSP, and an Ink Bold. I was able to call reconsideration and get the UA but it may be safer to reduce the # of cards I have since Chase seems to have a lot of attractive offers.
Jun 4, 2012, 5:53 pm
#17
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: PEK
Programs: SPG Plat, A3 *A Gold, HH Gold, IHG Plat
Posts: 392
Should I cancel Sapphire Preferred?
The Chase Sapphire Preferred card is well liked in these circles. I am at my anniversary date and have received the $95 annual fee.
Called twice to see about waiving and they were firm in keeping the fee. They did apply a courtesy 2,500 points. Besides canceling the card, they also offered to downgrade the card to a non-Preferred card which would remove the ability to transfer points to airline partners as well as add Forex charges.
I live in China, so adding Forex charges removes any interest in daily use of the card. Non-transfer to airline partners reduces the flexibility of UR points. I would probably keep the card open just for the credit line to transfer to future Chase card offers.
Since realizing that Discover card is the most widely accepted card in China, and also has 0% Forex changes and no annual fee, plus cashback bonus up to 5% and more that stack, it seems attractive to switch daily spend to Discover and then purchases made in the US I can use Starwood card which I am willing to pay annual fee for the elite nights credits, plus it has airline transfer.
The last 4 months I have averaged $1,400 spend on this card. Annually that is 22,470 include 7% annual bonus, and 25% is dining. If I use plasticiq.com points values of $0.0125/pt then this is $280, minus annual fee = $185
If I put $1,400 / mo on Discover it is at least 16,800 assuming no category bonuses, I think it is safe to assume at least 25% bonus for category bonuses so 21,000. At $0.01/pt that is $210
It's a close call
Maybe I downgrade now and reapply for the Preferred at another date. Like maybe the MC version of the card.
So, is it worth $95 annual fee to be able to transfer UR points to airlines?
Called twice to see about waiving and they were firm in keeping the fee. They did apply a courtesy 2,500 points. Besides canceling the card, they also offered to downgrade the card to a non-Preferred card which would remove the ability to transfer points to airline partners as well as add Forex charges.
I live in China, so adding Forex charges removes any interest in daily use of the card. Non-transfer to airline partners reduces the flexibility of UR points. I would probably keep the card open just for the credit line to transfer to future Chase card offers.
Since realizing that Discover card is the most widely accepted card in China, and also has 0% Forex changes and no annual fee, plus cashback bonus up to 5% and more that stack, it seems attractive to switch daily spend to Discover and then purchases made in the US I can use Starwood card which I am willing to pay annual fee for the elite nights credits, plus it has airline transfer.
The last 4 months I have averaged $1,400 spend on this card. Annually that is 22,470 include 7% annual bonus, and 25% is dining. If I use plasticiq.com points values of $0.0125/pt then this is $280, minus annual fee = $185
If I put $1,400 / mo on Discover it is at least 16,800 assuming no category bonuses, I think it is safe to assume at least 25% bonus for category bonuses so 21,000. At $0.01/pt that is $210
It's a close call
Maybe I downgrade now and reapply for the Preferred at another date. Like maybe the MC version of the card.
So, is it worth $95 annual fee to be able to transfer UR points to airlines?
Jun 4, 2012, 6:38 pm
#18
Join Date: May 2012
Location: HNL
Programs: AS MVPG, HA Plat
Posts: 1,268
Not if it makes more sense to put most of your spending on another card. Why not transfer out the points you have and then downgrade to the regular Sapphire to keep the credit line there for future opportunities?
Jun 4, 2012, 7:23 pm
#19
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Ann Arbor
Programs: Delta GM, Hilton
Posts: 192
You could apply for the Chase Ink Bold. It also has the ability to transfer points to airline partners and no forex fees, in addition to no fee the first year.
Jun 4, 2012, 7:27 pm
#20
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 17
For the Sapphire, the 2500 retention bonus you got is worth $31.25. This pegs the Sapphire return at roughly $216. This is really a big wash. One reason to keep the Sapphire is that you get the flexibility to choose which airline or hotel to transfer to in the future. Remember that with the airline miles transfer feature, your Sapphire points can be worth a lot more than 1.25c/point. So, if its all a wash, I'd keep it just for that feature.
I am in a similar situation as you and would keep the Sapphire if it came with some sort of retention bonus. Did you have to fight hard for yours?
Edited to add: I think your math might be a little off. $1400 spend per month is about 18000 points per year at 1 point per dollar including 7% bonus. This is worth about $225 in cashback at 1.25c/point. Or about $161 after you take away the annual fee and add the retention bonus.
However, remember that Sapphire Preferred gives 2 points per dollar for *any* travel, even taxicabs. So, overall, you might still get to the $216 per year in cashback or more.
I am in a similar situation as you and would keep the Sapphire if it came with some sort of retention bonus. Did you have to fight hard for yours?
Edited to add: I think your math might be a little off. $1400 spend per month is about 18000 points per year at 1 point per dollar including 7% bonus. This is worth about $225 in cashback at 1.25c/point. Or about $161 after you take away the annual fee and add the retention bonus.
However, remember that Sapphire Preferred gives 2 points per dollar for *any* travel, even taxicabs. So, overall, you might still get to the $216 per year in cashback or more.
Last edited by mojoshtudd; Jun 4, 2012 at 7:34 pm
Jun 4, 2012, 7:58 pm
#21
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: ECP
Programs: DL Diamond
Posts: 1,658
Note also the Ink line is not set in stone. I regularly exceed my limit (which has been upped twice now sans hard pull).
Jun 4, 2012, 8:51 pm
#22
Join Date: May 2008
Location: PHL (kinda, no airport is really close)
Programs: AA Exp, but not sure for how long. Enterprise Platinum woo-hoo!
Posts: 4,550
I originally planned to cancel my SP after one year (my primary card is Amex PRG, and Amex points are especially valuable to me). But I am going to keep it for a unique reason. I've been buying up Chase points from co-workers, saving them for overseas trips. Compared to the other ways of getting United points, it's very worthwhile for me to pay $95 a year for a place to store them. (Of course I do use the card, mostly for restaurants, and it's the only rewards card I have with no Forex fee, and as my wife lives in Canada, a card with no Forex fee is important.)
Jun 5, 2012, 2:40 am
#23
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 15
In the same situation, 1 year anniversary is in July. I think I will keep if I get the retention bonus. Main issue is that I won't be home until August or Sept to pick up a new card and I would like to have a CC available with no foreign transaction fee until then. With the retention bonus + points you will come out ahead, even though it hurts to pay a fee.
Jun 5, 2012, 4:20 am
#24
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Tampa, FL
Programs: AAMM & PLT; UA Gold, DL Silver, Marriott LT Titanium Elite, Hilton Diamond, Hertz #1 Gold Club
Posts: 1,591
I thought for your first $3,000 spend each year with Discover you get .25 per $.
Last edited by mia; Jun 6, 2012 at 8:11 am Reason: Please do not quote the entire text of multi-paragraph posts
Jun 5, 2012, 8:57 am
#25
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: PEK
Programs: SPG Plat, A3 *A Gold, HH Gold, IHG Plat
Posts: 392
Yes, I am new to using the Discover car so am unclear on how the cash back will work. I was also told that overseas purchases was unable for any bonus promotions, though the current statement only has overseas transactions and they definitely received 5% cashback.
Jun 5, 2012, 2:01 pm
#26
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: LAX
Posts: 2,851
My annual fee just came up on my Chase Sapphire Prefered. I just downgraded to the Chase Sapphire for no annual fee. I rather keep the Chase Ink bold for the 2 lounge passes per year for transferring ultimate reward points to Hyatt or United instead of the Chase Sapphire.
Jun 6, 2012, 5:41 am
#27
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 297
Seems like you have a pretty good handle on the situation and have thought it through pretty well. For the sake of throwing my two cents in, here is what I'd do in your situation:
It seems as though the Discover makes more sense for you to shift your everyday spending habits to, so I'd downgrade the Chase Sapphire Preferred to the regular Chase Sapphire. This way, you aren't paying the annual fee but you also aren't closing a credit line, so it will continue to help your credit score.
I'd then go and apply for Chase Ink Bold. As long as you can make the minimum spend of $10,000 in 3 months (which might not be as hard as you think- I wrote a post about 5 ways to meet high minimum spends that you can't hit with normal spending patterns), then you'll receive 50k Chase points.
On top of that, you'll still have a Chase card that gets Ultimate Rewards, meaning you can still transfer any balances you get from your regular Sapphire to Ultimate Rewards points.
Also, you can use the Chase Ink Bold for some everyday spend in categories that make sense for you, like 5x on cellphone, internet, etc or gas, which is 2x.
Of course, when the annual fee comes up for the Ink Bold next year, you can then start this process all over again, and decide if the $95 is worth it.
I don't see any real downsides to this plan, as you'll get out of paying the annual fee for the Sapphire Preferred, you'll keep the credit line open, you'll earn a signup bonus with the Ink Bold, and you'll still be able to transfer Sapphire points to Ultimate Rewards points if necessary.
It seems as though the Discover makes more sense for you to shift your everyday spending habits to, so I'd downgrade the Chase Sapphire Preferred to the regular Chase Sapphire. This way, you aren't paying the annual fee but you also aren't closing a credit line, so it will continue to help your credit score.
I'd then go and apply for Chase Ink Bold. As long as you can make the minimum spend of $10,000 in 3 months (which might not be as hard as you think- I wrote a post about 5 ways to meet high minimum spends that you can't hit with normal spending patterns), then you'll receive 50k Chase points.
On top of that, you'll still have a Chase card that gets Ultimate Rewards, meaning you can still transfer any balances you get from your regular Sapphire to Ultimate Rewards points.
Also, you can use the Chase Ink Bold for some everyday spend in categories that make sense for you, like 5x on cellphone, internet, etc or gas, which is 2x.
Of course, when the annual fee comes up for the Ink Bold next year, you can then start this process all over again, and decide if the $95 is worth it.
I don't see any real downsides to this plan, as you'll get out of paying the annual fee for the Sapphire Preferred, you'll keep the credit line open, you'll earn a signup bonus with the Ink Bold, and you'll still be able to transfer Sapphire points to Ultimate Rewards points if necessary.
Jun 6, 2012, 11:50 am
#28
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Los Angles
Posts: 2,101
I have Sapphire, Freedom and Ink bold, all have separate UR accounts, Should I consolidate these points into one account? If yes, which one?
Jun 6, 2012, 12:42 pm
#29
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,953
Jun 6, 2012, 3:11 pm
#30
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Traveling some where hopefully
Programs: AS, AA Gold, and Hilton
Posts: 1,954