CX Banned (kind of) by China

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Old Aug 11, 19, 8:02 pm   -   Wikipost
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This thread is to discuss the facts and practical implications of the China ruling on airspace and Cathay crew flying through the airspace.

For non-CX impact on travel to HK, please go to this thread in HK/Macau https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hong...ns-travel.html

If you would like to discuss the political motivations or opinions on this, please go to this thread in OMNI/PR https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/omni...-protests.html
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Old Aug 12, 19, 7:50 am
  #136  
 
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Originally Posted by fairhsa View Post
https://www.scmp.com/news/china/poli...-plummet-after

Looks like CX are taking a hard line. Maybe time to start boycotting them.

Does anyone know the CEO's email address or something? I feel like sending a letter saying how much his response pisses me off. I could send to the Marco Polo Diamond but I can't see that going anywhere useful.

CX staff are humans and entitled to do what they like in their time off!

EDIT: I found his Ruperts email address and sent him an email. I suspect he's got rather a lot on his hands today though!
In today's day and age, there are many who hold corporations accountable to "do the right thing". Treating employees right is part of that. CX has been put in a difficult place. They may be forced to choose between China government requirements and business success vs keeping (western) standards of fairness and freedom.

There may be some backlash from customers if there is public sentiment that CX employees are being treated unfairly for political beliefs and supporting causes close to their hearts.
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Old Aug 12, 19, 7:59 am
  #137  
 
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Agreed. I 100% support the protestors, but there's a big financial consequence for CX if they let their staff attend any illegal demonstrations after the CAAC put up their new policy. If enough CX staff somehow get caught as being in attendance by the CCP, it'll be very difficult to roster specific F/As or pilots onto SEA/Oceania routes. I suppose they don't want to even have to deal with rostering a small group of F/As and pilots which is why they took a hard stance after the CAAC directive. I highly doubt anyone in CX management isn't on the protestors' "side", if you will. They simply have to comply with new Chinese policy; they can't afford not to.
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Old Aug 12, 19, 8:03 am
  #138  
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Originally Posted by cx4ever View Post
Agreed. I 100% support the protestors, but there's a big financial consequence for CX if they let their staff attend any illegal demonstrations after the CAAC put up their new policy. If enough CX staff somehow get caught as being in attendance by the CCP, it'll be very difficult to roster specific F/As or pilots onto SEA/Oceania routes. I suppose they don't want to even have to deal with rostering a small group of F/As and pilots which is why they took a hard stance after the CAAC directive. I highly doubt anyone in CX management isn't on the protestors' "side", if you will. They simply have to comply with new Chinese policy; they can't afford not to.

Can they afford to? If the employees feel contributing to Hong Kong's future is more valuable than average pay @ CX, they could just start leaving on their own.
No airline without workers.
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Old Aug 12, 19, 8:48 am
  #139  
 
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The question is the word " Illegal" and I think CX is also using this as some demonstrations were legal and with the Police permits and some were illegal without the permits. So if they attend the legal ones, I think there is enough lax in that the they can get away with it as CAAC has also used the word illegal. So all demonstrations are not illegal in Hong Kong.
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Old Aug 12, 19, 9:26 am
  #140  
 
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Originally Posted by dav662 View Post
The question is the word " Illegal" and I think CX is also using this as some demonstrations were legal and with the Police permits and some were illegal without the permits. So if they attend the legal ones, I think there is enough lax in that the they can get away with it as CAAC has also used the word illegal. So all demonstrations are not illegal in Hong Kong.
Very true Im sure those demonstrations voicing support for the Xianggang police are perfectly legal and CX staff is more than welcome to join
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Old Aug 12, 19, 7:02 pm
  #141  
 
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Originally Posted by cx4ever View Post
Agreed. I 100% support the protestors, but there's a big financial consequence for CX if they let their staff attend any illegal demonstrations after the CAAC put up their new policy. If enough CX staff somehow get caught as being in attendance by the CCP, it'll be very difficult to roster specific F/As or pilots onto SEA/Oceania routes. I suppose they don't want to even have to deal with rostering a small group of F/As and pilots which is why they took a hard stance after the CAAC directive. I highly doubt anyone in CX management isn't on the protestors' "side", if you will. They simply have to comply with new Chinese policy; they can't afford not to.
While I do agree that CX needs to toe the line and at least appear nonpartisan on the ongoing demonstrations, I'm somewhat surprised that social media posts are also being monitored.

Our Social Media Policy also makes it clear that you should not post anything that breaches privacy of colleagues, constitutes bullying or harassment or could bring Cathay Pacific Group into disrepute.
If an off duty crew posts something on IG that could be argued to "bring Cathay Pacific Group into disrepute." would that somehow violate one's freedom of speech?

Last edited by FlyPointyEnd; Aug 12, 19 at 10:10 pm
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Old Aug 12, 19, 8:01 pm
  #142  
 
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Not at all. The employee is free to make comments/ posts on social media, the company is free to give them notice because of it.

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Old Aug 12, 19, 8:39 pm
  #143  
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90 days notice.. Paid .. as per contract

Frankly its the best possible end for most CX staff.
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Old Aug 12, 19, 9:43 pm
  #144  
 
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Originally Posted by peasant View Post
Not at all. The employee is free to make comments/ posts on social media, the company is free to give them notice because of it.
I'm not sure this will be sufficient grounds for dismissal... I can't wait to see the CX employees who were fired to bring CX to court. Bring out the popcorn!
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Old Aug 12, 19, 9:53 pm
  #145  
 
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Originally Posted by flubber View Post
I'm not sure this will be sufficient grounds for dismissal... I can't wait to see the CX employees who were fired to bring CX to court. Bring out the popcorn!
? In HK a company does not need grounds for dismissal - just give you your notice.
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Old Aug 12, 19, 9:59 pm
  #146  
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Originally Posted by peasant View Post
? In HK a company does not need grounds for dismissal - just give you your notice.

Correct.. They have only ever lost by giving grounds.

Whenever they pay out notice period, there is no recourse.

Bring out the popcorn shows ZERO understanding of HK labour law (none.. basically.. Pay Notice.. do as you like)
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Old Aug 13, 19, 12:32 am
  #147  
 
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Originally Posted by deadinabsentia View Post
Correct.. They have only ever lost by giving grounds.

Whenever they pay out notice period, there is no recourse.

Bring out the popcorn shows ZERO understanding of HK labour law (none.. basically.. Pay Notice.. do as you like)
Right... and I guess the unfair dismissal claims I've seen are hallucinations.
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Old Aug 13, 19, 12:46 am
  #148  
 
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They are not. But the most a court can award you is your notice period. So if company pays you your notice period - no recourse.
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Old Aug 13, 19, 3:23 am
  #149  
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Originally Posted by peasant View Post
They are not. But the most a court can award you is your notice period. So if company pays you your notice period - no recourse.
The Employment Ordinance is quite clear.
1. The employer should give "legal" notice, or payment in lieu of notice. Otherwise it is a "wrongful" dismissal. This is what you refer to.

2. There could be an "unlawful dismissal", e.g. a pregnant woman. Then the Labour Tribunal can order reinstatement (if both parties agree) or an award compensation not exceeding HKD150,000

3. The Employment Ordinance list five major reasons for dismissal. In case of "unreasonable" dismissal, the employer should reinstate the employee (if both parties agree) or pay an award.

CX employee could claim that the dismissal is "unreasonable' and CX would counter that they have substantial reasons. It could also be that the employment contract contains clauses about employees conduct.
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Old Aug 13, 19, 3:26 am
  #150  
 
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