A330 Developments

Old Jul 30, 19, 8:10 pm
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Programs: CX,TG,Delta,PAL,EY
Posts: 126
A330 Developments

According to Planespotters the Dragon is due to receive HLN/HLO/HLT/HLU/HLV. When this done CX will only have 3 (HLD/HLF/HLH) of the 33Ps left. Hopefully HLD will be returned to lessor shortly and HLF/HLH retired in the coming 18 months. Are CX responding to the general (passenger and crew) dislike of this model?

As far as the Dragon is concerned hopefully this will allow retirement of their oldest relics.
QRC3288 likes this.
TomYoung is offline  
Old Jul 30, 19, 8:18 pm
  #2  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: MEL CHC
Posts: 16,531
Originally Posted by TomYoung View Post
...... Are CX responding to the general (passenger and crew) dislike of this model?....
No. Will just be calculation in a spreadsheet (number crunching) and long term planning. Just like with all commercial airlines.
Most passengers have no idea what aircraft they are flying in. We on the FT are in the few% (2%?) who notice or care.
DiamondMile, Sozee and dddc like this.
Mwenenzi is offline  
Old Jul 30, 19, 10:40 pm
  #3  
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SFO/HKG
Programs: ex-UA 1K, AA EXP, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 478
Crappy seats and old entertainment system on the beat up A330s but would gladly opt for the A330 over the 777A due to the improvement in personal space.
dddc and fallinasleep like this.
triplefives is offline  
Old Jul 30, 19, 11:07 pm
  #4  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Programs: Marco Polo Club, KF
Posts: 167
Originally Posted by TomYoung View Post
According to Planespotters the Dragon is due to receive HLN/HLO/HLT/HLU/HLV. When this done CX will only have 3 (HLD/HLF/HLH) of the 33Ps left. Hopefully HLD will be returned to lessor shortly and HLF/HLH retired in the coming 18 months. Are CX responding to the general (passenger and crew) dislike of this model?

As far as the Dragon is concerned hopefully this will allow retirement of their oldest relics.
Interesting and thanks for the update. I don't know if anyone has run the numbers against A350 arrivals/planned 77W returns to lessors but I do wonder if this will leave CX short of regional frames in the not too distant future? If so, then CX's replacement plans seem to me one of the more interesting short haul fleet selection decisions around. If the decision were based primarily on the economics of short haul passenger ops alone then presumably the 787-10 would be a front runner. But throw in CX's relatively large freight ops and the benefits of fleet commonality and I wonder if "regional" versions of the A350 or retaining 77Ws would be in the mix.
Arbeysix is offline  
Old Jul 31, 19, 12:00 am
  #5  
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Programs: BA SL, CX GR, IHG Plat
Posts: 457
Originally Posted by Arbeysix View Post
Interesting and thanks for the update. I don't know if anyone has run the numbers against A350 arrivals/planned 77W returns to lessors but I do wonder if this will leave CX short of regional frames in the not too distant future? If so, then CX's replacement plans seem to me one of the more interesting short haul fleet selection decisions around. If the decision were based primarily on the economics of short haul passenger ops alone then presumably the 787-10 would be a front runner. But throw in CX's relatively large freight ops and the benefits of fleet commonality and I wonder if "regional" versions of the A350 or retaining 77Ws would be in the mix.
Perhaps CX would just deploy the LH aircrafts to regional routes, as they seem to be having a strong LH fleet with adequate spare time during the day. That may explain why they are not ordering any regional aircraft (except the 321 for KA) for replacement.
SLGO is offline  
Old Jul 31, 19, 12:24 am
  #6  
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 527
Originally Posted by TomYoung View Post
Are CX responding to the general (passenger and crew) dislike of this model?
I know a lot of (non-FTer, non-AvGeek) friends who go out of their way to score a window + aisle seat on the A330 when they travel as a couple in Y.
dddc likes this.
Central90210 is offline  
Old Jul 31, 19, 1:07 am
  #7  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: China
Posts: 1,516
My guess is that they will reconfigure the ‘long haul’ A330 to regional seating, replacing with A350 on the Oz/ ME/ India routes.

So as A350 come in, retire the oldest A330, and replace with reconfigured A330 already in the fleet.
peasant is offline  
Old Jul 31, 19, 3:53 am
  #8  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: AMS
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Peon, TK M&S Nobody
Posts: 1,127
Originally Posted by TomYoung View Post
According to Planespotters the Dragon is due to receive HLN/HLO/HLT/HLU/HLV. When this done CX will only have 3 (HLD/HLF/HLH) of the 33Ps left. Hopefully HLD will be returned to lessor shortly and HLF/HLH retired in the coming 18 months. Are CX responding to the general (passenger and crew) dislike of this model?

As far as the Dragon is concerned hopefully this will allow retirement of their oldest relics.
Apologies - can't find the Planespotters post - what's the timeline on this? Is this why my NGO-TPE-HKG flight in October has been switched from A333 to [regional] 777 or was that just the usual chopping and changing?
etiene is online now  
Old Jul 31, 19, 5:53 am
  #9  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Programs: CX,TG,Delta,PAL,EY
Posts: 126
See https://www.planespotters.net/airline/Cathay-Dragon.

Of the 10 oldest A330s still active 7 are with the Dragon and 1 with CX. The 2 oldest with the Dragon have been flying for over 26 years so surely time to go.
etiene likes this.
TomYoung is offline  
Old Jul 31, 19, 8:42 am
  #10  
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Hong Kong
Programs: CX Gold, QF Bronze
Posts: 700
Should CX buy a batch of A330-900neo for both CX and KA? for replacing the 10+ years old A330s, as well as to supplement A350-900 due to its range for some routes cannot afford A350-900.
derek2010 is offline  
Old Jul 31, 19, 6:03 pm
  #11  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Programs: Marco Polo Club, KF
Posts: 167
Originally Posted by derek2010 View Post
Should CX buy a batch of A330-900neo for both CX and KA? for replacing the 10+ years old A330s, as well as to supplement A350-900 due to its range for some routes cannot afford A350-900.
The A330-900neo is not a good fit for CX's short haul network because it is heavier than the A330ceo. The neo's sweet spot is longer medium-long haul routes where the A350 is even stronger again. The 787 may be a better fit for CX short haul but I'm not sure how the numbers would stack up taking into account capex vs the "intelligent misuse" approach of just deploying surplus long haul aircraft on short haul routes when not operating long haul. I'm also not sure if CX has enough long haul frames for this approach taking into account the A350s on order net of 330/77W retirements. There's also the possibility of future performance enhancements to the A350 (including weight reduction, RR ultrafan if and when it materialises etc) to make them better short-haul performers.
TomYoung likes this.
Arbeysix is offline  
Old Jul 31, 19, 11:57 pm
  #12  
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SFO/HKG
Programs: ex-UA 1K, AA EXP, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 478
Originally Posted by Arbeysix View Post
The A330-900neo is not a good fit for CX's short haul network because it is heavier than the A330ceo. The neo's sweet spot is longer medium-long haul routes where the A350 is even stronger again. The 787 may be a better fit for CX short haul but I'm not sure how the numbers would stack up taking into account capex vs the "intelligent misuse" approach of just deploying surplus long haul aircraft on short haul routes when not operating long haul. I'm also not sure if CX has enough long haul frames for this approach taking into account the A350s on order net of 330/77W retirements. There's also the possibility of future performance enhancements to the A350 (including weight reduction, RR ultrafan if and when it materialises etc) to make them better short-haul performers.
I think the A350s and the 777X combined will replace the A330 fleet. There are still 5 or 6 A359s on order, 8 more A351s, and 21 777X for a total of at least 34 new airframes which will be enough to replace the current 31 A330s in the fleet.

I agree the smaller 787 would be better for exclusively short haul flying but CX's advantage is the ability to utilize their long haul aircraft on short haul return trips so that will probably be unlikely. Given the number of stand by passengers/staff travel I've noticed, it's not too hard to fill up the aircraft.
triplefives is offline  
Old Aug 1, 19, 12:42 am
  #13  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Bangkok, Thailand
Programs: CX MPC Diamond (ow emerald), TU Miles & More elite (SA Gold), Marriott Bonvoy Titanium Elite
Posts: 177
Originally Posted by TomYoung View Post
According to Planespotters the Dragon is due to receive HLN/HLO/HLT/HLU/HLV
Forgive my ignorance, but what is HLN/HLO/etc.... tail number/plane identification? (oh oh... I googled it... lol...)

What's the logic behind the registration number/identifier scheme? Is that set by Cathay or the Hong Kong Civil Aviation Department? And on that note, does anyone know where Cathay registers and domiciles their aircraft? Are they owned by companies in Hong Kong? Registered in Hong Kong? Or some mysterious Caribbean island with questionable banking regulations? hehehehe....

cmiller11101 is offline  
Old Aug 1, 19, 1:01 am
  #14  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 420
Originally Posted by cmiller11101 View Post


Forgive my ignorance, but what is HLN/HLO/etc.... tail number/plane identification? (oh oh... I googled it... lol...)

What's the logic behind the registration number/identifier scheme? Is that set by Cathay or the Hong Kong Civil Aviation Department? And on that note, does anyone know where Cathay registers and domiciles their aircraft? Are they owned by companies in Hong Kong? Registered in Hong Kong? Or some mysterious Caribbean island with questionable banking regulations? hehehehe....
[thread drift]
International registries are allocated a letter to identity where an aircraft is registered. So USA is N, France is F and so on. The state controlling the registry then has flexibility on what goes after the initial letter. The USA and Russia use numbers, most other places use either three or four letters.
Cathay aircraft are registered in Hong Kong and the format for a Hong Kong registration is the letter B followed by a dash then three letters. For simplicity most airlines will ask for a cluster of sequential letters for different fleets. It doesn’t always work but it makes it easier to identify which sub fleet is being talked about in meetings etc.

Where aircraft are owned can be very complicated indeed involving leasing , mortgages, holding companies etc etc. I have no idea how Cathay sets that up. [\thread drift]
cmiller11101 likes this.
tinkicker is offline  
Old Aug 1, 19, 1:09 am
  #15  
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Asia Miles. Not bothering to join Marco Polo.
Posts: 16,960
Originally Posted by Central90210 View Post
I know a lot of (non-FTer, non-AvGeek) friends who go out of their way to score a window + aisle seat on the A330 when they travel as a couple in Y.
So do I. Sad to see the A330s go. What's better?
percysmith is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search Engine: