Cabotage? Flying PEK-HKG-PVG
Jun 17, 2019, 11:32 pm
#46
Join Date: Sep 2018
Programs: Alaska
Posts: 2,188
Thanks! 
Appreciate the advice! I guess the main reasons for booking this itinerary were 1) direct flights in business class between PEK and SHA are super-expensive at approx. 500-820 USD one-way [according to Google Flights] 2) no award tickets available on my preferred date 3) I don't mind spending a day in the air and at the airport if that allows my to try out a new airline/product 4) admittedly, I didn't really check for alternatives like the train.
Since this is an award ticket, I would be able to cancel it. So I will probably look into the train option a bit closer - unless somebody has an idea how to get cheaper business class tickets between PEK and SHA
Appreciate the advice! I guess the main reasons for booking this itinerary were 1) direct flights in business class between PEK and SHA are super-expensive at approx. 500-820 USD one-way [according to Google Flights] 2) no award tickets available on my preferred date 3) I don't mind spending a day in the air and at the airport if that allows my to try out a new airline/product 4) admittedly, I didn't really check for alternatives like the train.Since this is an award ticket, I would be able to cancel it. So I will probably look into the train option a bit closer - unless somebody has an idea how to get cheaper business class tickets between PEK and SHA
On the other hand, if you take train, it takes less than 1 hour to arrive at any HSR station and you don't have to arrive 2 hours before departure.
Jun 18, 2019, 12:33 am
#47
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Stuck on this planet - mainly in STR and LAX
Posts: 5,019
I believe the cabotage problem is only an US issue, i don't know of any other country where this is a problem.
Worst case (but unlikely in my non-expert opinion) you will be denied boarding in PEK. In that case you still can buy a train ticket and likely be in SHA almost faster than with your current plan.
You can either go directly to the train station and buy the ticket there or use a site like ctrip.com. Dont use the non-chinese services for this, they rip you off.
With 2 to 5 trains per hour it should be relatively easy to find seats.It should be around 80 US$ for 2nd class, double for 1st class and triple for business class (the first two are normal train seats, business class is lay flat at the end of the trains like business class seats on longhaul airplanes).
Taking the train is actually fun and especially in business class a great experience. The fastest trains take between 4 and 5 hours.
Worst case (but unlikely in my non-expert opinion) you will be denied boarding in PEK. In that case you still can buy a train ticket and likely be in SHA almost faster than with your current plan.
You can either go directly to the train station and buy the ticket there or use a site like ctrip.com. Dont use the non-chinese services for this, they rip you off.
With 2 to 5 trains per hour it should be relatively easy to find seats.It should be around 80 US$ for 2nd class, double for 1st class and triple for business class (the first two are normal train seats, business class is lay flat at the end of the trains like business class seats on longhaul airplanes).
Taking the train is actually fun and especially in business class a great experience. The fastest trains take between 4 and 5 hours.
Jun 18, 2019, 2:45 am
#48
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 42,033
I believe the cabotage problem is only an US issue, i don't know of any other country where this is a problem.
Worst case (but unlikely in my non-expert opinion) you will be denied boarding in PEK. In that case you still can buy a train ticket and likely be in SHA almost faster than with your current plan.
You can either go directly to the train station and buy the ticket there or use a site like ctrip.com. Dont use the non-chinese services for this, they rip you off.
With 2 to 5 trains per hour it should be relatively easy to find seats.It should be around 80 US$ for 2nd class, double for 1st class and triple for business class (the first two are normal train seats, business class is lay flat at the end of the trains like business class seats on longhaul airplanes).
Taking the train is actually fun and especially in business class a great experience. The fastest trains take between 4 and 5 hours.
Worst case (but unlikely in my non-expert opinion) you will be denied boarding in PEK. In that case you still can buy a train ticket and likely be in SHA almost faster than with your current plan.
You can either go directly to the train station and buy the ticket there or use a site like ctrip.com. Dont use the non-chinese services for this, they rip you off.
With 2 to 5 trains per hour it should be relatively easy to find seats.It should be around 80 US$ for 2nd class, double for 1st class and triple for business class (the first two are normal train seats, business class is lay flat at the end of the trains like business class seats on longhaul airplanes).
Taking the train is actually fun and especially in business class a great experience. The fastest trains take between 4 and 5 hours.
-door to door times are faster 90% of the time
-prices are similar, as long as you don't take the evening flights (i.e. these tend to fetch close to full fare)
-whether or not you eat the train food (I don't), you can't escape the smells
Jun 18, 2019, 2:46 am
#49
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
Programs: FB , BA Gold
Posts: 15,556
Indeed. US aviation authorities tend to be singularly anal about this. The kind of A-B-C itineraries where A and C is in the USA but B is not that would not raise an eyebrow elsewhere in the world tend to give rise to howls of cabotage foul play by US authorities. So, unless we are aware of problems in the past on PRC-HKG-PRC itineraries within 24 hrs, there is probably no reason to worry.
You can fly ORD-YYZ-NYC on AA but not on AC.
The big issue has always been US territories, especially Guam.
Jun 18, 2019, 3:28 am
#50
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: London, UK and Southern France
Posts: 18,364
Well, yes. You could take away the "I think that" from your sentence as this is objectively true: the very point of cabotage rules is protectionism pure and simple. That is the whole point of them: cabotage rules serve no purpose whatsoever other than protecting domestic airlines from foreign competition.
Jun 19, 2019, 5:22 am
#51
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: SYD | HGH
Programs: CX DM, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton DM, Marriott Plat
Posts: 2,121
Thanks! Appreciate the advice! I guess the main reasons for booking this itinerary were 1) direct flights in business class between PEK and SHA are super-expensive at approx. 500-820 USD one-way [according to Google Flights] 2) no award tickets available on my preferred date 3) I don't mind spending a day in the air and at the airport if that allows my to try out a new airline/product 4) admittedly, I didn't really check for alternatives like the train.
Since this is an award ticket, I would be able to cancel it. So I will probably look into the train option a bit closer - unless somebody has an idea how to get cheaper business class tickets between PEK and SHA
Appreciate the advice! I guess the main reasons for booking this itinerary were 1) direct flights in business class between PEK and SHA are super-expensive at approx. 500-820 USD one-way [according to Google Flights] 2) no award tickets available on my preferred date 3) I don't mind spending a day in the air and at the airport if that allows my to try out a new airline/product 4) admittedly, I didn't really check for alternatives like the train.Since this is an award ticket, I would be able to cancel it. So I will probably look into the train option a bit closer - unless somebody has an idea how to get cheaper business class tickets between PEK and SHA
And also if you're not in a hurry, and still want to fly F from PEK to SHA/PVG with your BA points, why not change your lay-over time in HKG to a bit longer, so you won't worry about delays and also gets to try the two F lounges in HKG.
Jun 20, 2019, 5:31 am
#52
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Beijing
Posts: 349
Couldnt agree more!! A total - royal or otherwise - retarded and completely insane procedure, each and everytime. But if u like this sort of thing, then why not throw in a little side kick to Haikou or Xiamen from HKG... actually Qingdao is a fine contender for worst ever security and immigration!
Jun 20, 2019, 5:33 am
#53
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Beijing
Posts: 349
My recommendation would be to seek advice on the visa and prepare to apply for the dual entry visa as soon as it’s conveniently possible, just in case you end up receiving a single entry visa. If that happens you’ll be thankful for the time you have to fine tune/amend your travel plans or if necessary apply for a second visa.
Jun 22, 2019, 5:26 am
#54
Join Date: Jan 2005
Programs: SQ, QF, UA, CO, DL
Posts: 2,884
Thanks! Appreciate the advice! I guess the main reasons for booking this itinerary were 1) direct flights in business class between PEK and SHA are super-expensive at approx. 500-820 USD one-way [according to Google Flights] 2) no award tickets available on my preferred date 3) I don't mind spending a day in the air and at the airport if that allows my to try out a new airline/product 4) admittedly, I didn't really check for alternatives like the train.
Since this is an award ticket, I would be able to cancel it. So I will probably look into the train option a bit closer - unless somebody has an idea how to get cheaper business class tickets between PEK and SHA
Appreciate the advice! I guess the main reasons for booking this itinerary were 1) direct flights in business class between PEK and SHA are super-expensive at approx. 500-820 USD one-way [according to Google Flights] 2) no award tickets available on my preferred date 3) I don't mind spending a day in the air and at the airport if that allows my to try out a new airline/product 4) admittedly, I didn't really check for alternatives like the train.Since this is an award ticket, I would be able to cancel it. So I will probably look into the train option a bit closer - unless somebody has an idea how to get cheaper business class tickets between PEK and SHA
I suspect you would not have any issue with CX or immigration on this itinerary. I have colleagues who do something similar, from Shanghai they travel to Zhongshan via HKG on CX and transfer to the ferry back to China (Zhongshan). They do it with checked luggage and it has not been a problem for CX, the ferry or China immigration.
But as others have said, do you really want to do this? If you have not been to HK why not try to stay overnight? When flights are backed up in PEK and PVG HKG flights get like the lowest priority. Could really spoil the trip, I have waited 6-8 hours in HKG only to have the flight cancel and then it took well over an hour to get an escort back to immigration to get admitted into HKG.