brunos

I never said that getting 2F awards on a flight was impossible.
Actually I have often done it but with patience as two seats are seldom released simultaneously (it can happen though). I usually book 1F and 1J award and wait for the opening of another one. Then I release the J award.

HKGglobaltrotter

Thanks for sharing. I, too, buy revenue F tickets a lot of the times and am fully aware of both sides of the the coin so to say. But given the loading ( I checked J cabin too) and the time I requested for the upgrade, they simply flat out refused it. However, at the same time, the MPO agent actually told me they could secure me the F seat IF I use my Bookable upgrade voucher. So, I am not sure how they do their math here (??!). A pax trying to give you the miles (the currency) for a seat and got refused; then been told you could get the same seat for free using the voucher. I have lots of miles to burn and multiple Bookable upgrade vouchers to spare. But in this occasion, I see loading was light so I tried to burn some miles. My whole case scenario was just mind-boggling. I got what I wanted at the end but this was a very unpleasant F redemption experience I had so far.

kaka

brunos

As you point out, bookable upgrades are clearly a strong benefit for DM. They book into A bucket, so no need to have award availability if A is available. On the other hand, awards are offered to any AM member (and partner airlines after a while). So, the bookable upgrades have higher "ranking". As a non-DM, I would be happy if they did not exist but CX recognizes loyalty of its most faithful members..
Please take my post with a pinch of humour.

bagold

As Brunos said, you have to first understand the booking buckets for First. There are F, A and Z.

F is typically full-fare first.
A is typically discounted first or Round the World first.
Z is award ticket.

Normally CX has F and A available for booking. So the DM Bookable Upgrades are only for DM to earn and enjoy. CX decided to give these Bookable Upgrades a bookable class of A in First instead of Z. DMs should be happy with that.

It is perfectly normal and makes commercial sense to have A class available and not Z. So CX saying you can use Bookable Upgrades and not Award is normal. UNLESS you want CX to make Bookable Upgrades only for Z class??? Which in my books would be a huge downgrade in DM benefits.

I also book revenue F/A for myself (35-40 long haul segments / year for me). Occasionally award F for myself (maybe once a year). But Award J and F for my family all the time and we travel quite a lot. I've once managed to book the entire 747 First Class using either awards or upgrade on a long haul.

I've also booked 5 out of 6 on 77W in F using award. It all depends on timing and how empty those flights are. Typically now, they open maybe 1 seat in F at 360 or 353 days. I then get another 1 F closer to departure date.

Don't forget people do book 360 days out using the more expensive award tickets. So people should not be surprised that 353 days you can't find anything!

marcommm

CX/Asiamiles has never promised/said the number of award seats released 353, 360 or any days out. It is all just personal predictions based on past experiences. I wouldn't be surprised if they do not release a single award seats to/from CTS on Christmas/CNY.

percysmith

They explicitly disclaim this:

https://www.asiamiles.com/en/amtsl/t...format=popup#1

jagmeets

QRC3288

A lot of great discussion upthread has come out of this.

I will add: the bookable upgrades are very valuable, given they book into A class. F and A have such similar availability which makes those award upgrade certificates excellent. I'm not sure where this forum stands on them, but I use them exclusively for J->F upgrades and they are for all intents and purposes just like booking an F cash ticket. A availability is almost always there. I've never had a problem. In this instance (J->F), I am realizing a year or two into this new program just how valuable they are and really like them. It's a great perk. Kudos to CX for that one and especially not forcing them into the Z bucket, which would've been way less useful.

To jagmeets, my suspicion is they were wheeling and dealing playing "let's make a deal". I've had MPC agents do that with me a number of times before after they go on hold and ask for permission to do something. Not the exact same instance as HKGglobaltrotter with the upgrades, but enough times where they get permission from someone above to essentially engage in bargaining with you by providing you some offer like that which is either a different number of points, or is against the normal rules, etc.. Usually they're not very favorable and I can't recall ever taking them up on the offer. Last time they did this, they offered me some crazy deal for too many points on an unavailable flight I wanted for a regional business trip. I flew the competition on cash instead.

jagmeets

HaikalS

If the DM bookable upgrades map to A fare, do we know what the Gold bookable upgrades map to? I fare?

jagmeets

QRC3288

interesting. sorry to take this slightly off track, but what this means is essentially those Diamond mid-tier upgrades are way more valuable than the Gold ones. Since most Gold upgrades aren't going J->F, given the very limited availability of short/medium haul F.

I fare is far far far far more restricted than A fare. For all intents and purposes, A = F. I fare doesn't come close to equaling J.

wyskevin

I completely agree with you. “Since the change- things were definitely worse than in the past.” As my personal experience, I have never encountered no seats available in T-360/353 on any European flights to HKG. So I became upset after being told nothing available. Below was the following conversation with MPC agent on that day.

Me: “This is insane! After June 22nd, AM claimed there would increase 20% reward seats. But today, in T-353, the first day to release the seats, I got nothing! I am not requesting particular European flights, but any flight. Still, none is available. I can’t believe this!” (I was in a bad mood for sure.)

Me: “ Can I talk to your supervisor please?”

Agent: “ Please hold, sir.”

Agent: in few mins, “We can release one business class seat for you from MXP to HKG on that day.”
(ahhh…. Release seat for me? Isn’t it the privilege only to DM?”)

Me: “But Im not a fan of Milan.”

Agent: “Where would you prefer to fly, sir?”

Me:” AMS, BRU, DUB, FRA and CDG”

Agent:” Let me check for you. Please hold.”

Agent: in min, “Sorry, sir. Only MXP available. Can we put you on waitlist?”

Me: “ Fine. Please put me on waitlist and hold the confirmed seat on MXP.”

Agent:” Sure. Please hold. Let me check how long we can hold your seat on MXP.”

Agent: in min. “ We can hold your seat for two months, which is Oct 22nd. Meanwhile, you are still on waitlist on the destinations above.”

Me: “ ok, thanks.”

To be honest, this is an acceptable offer. OK, it is kinda of “The Squeaky wheel gets the oil!” However, my point is reward seats are definitely much more difficult to book than they were before.

Oh, another thing: I always think DMs own the privilege to request reward seats released. It is one of the reasons I’d like to become DM. But maybe this privilege does not come as easy as in the past????

HKGglobaltrotter

The b&w rule is that one can use the Bookable Upgrade upto T-15 days prior to departure but I feel like the MPO agent was trying to help me here. She noticed that I have 6 of those unused and suggested to me that she could secure a seat for me if I utilize one of those vouchers. I believe some other members had similar experiences where they had successfully secured seats using Booking Upgrade at times that are much closer to departure. I am not going to suggest this will be allowed every time but as a matter of fact I knew that agent was genuinely trying to help. Even she said it was very unusual at T-8 hrs before departure that they weren't releasing seats, not even one given they have 6 empty seats to spare on that evening!
Yes of course there could be some businessmen who show up last minute buying fully flex F fare to LHR. But I found it a bit ridiculous to hold up all 6 seats at T-8 hrs. YMMV.