tuhao888

You really lack professionalism even though you yourself claim to be an individual working in the high end consulting field; no need to get personal and hostile with the jabs. I was merely making remarks based on what you wrote and I was confused.

Regarding your point to elitism, I find it highly laughable and ironic you're pointing that towards me when you yourself are always like "I only fly F and J", "I've rarely sat in the back lately", "The food is inedible". Perhaps those statements could be reworded better.

Further to your point regarding high end catering, I never said Cafe de Coral was terrible. In fact, I don't mind it from time to time. However, just because one perceives something as a positive, tasty, or enjoyable does not equate it to be high end or of the top calibre. I have no doubt some things are enjoyable to others but classifying airline lounge for catering services as high end, that's a long shot.

PS. I bought more AS miles during this current promotion.

SAGflyer

Was the visit recent? Guess PP is still hit and miss? Yet there are so many users at CXTPF (literally every seat was occupied when I visited last time and queued up over 2 hours for massage) these days as compared to Pen times when TPF was pretty tranquil and exclusive without many flyers to be served.

ernestnywang

Does anyone know what will be the Chinese name of The Deck?

ermen

Well lounge overcrowding is not a PP or Pen issue.

TBH I really cannot identify with what people are saying on lounge overcrowding and poor service. Granted I don't fly weekly. But on the times I have mainly been there below - there was nigh an issue.

Fri 3-830pm departures
Fri overnight departures
Sat mid and late morning departures

QRC3288

You're right about one thing. Consulting is, candidly, not my profession.

But I don't mean offense....I just thought your comments, particularly in light of a few in another thread or two, were elitist, at least in my eyes. Name dropping things that didn't seem necessary except to provoke (Chanel, private planes, the brand name of absurdly expensive jackets, etc.). What we buy, whether or not some of fly private, etc. - at least a few members I know on this board do regularly, and haven't once mentioned it - I found as oddly unnecessary details, and struck me as "provocative".

​​​​​​Okay. Although the context of my posts would be helpful. I think (hope!) I mostly say these things when folks are asking for advice about longhaul economy, etc.. Admittedly I'm no good for advice in economy as I am for CX's premium cabins, this is just reality. I've spent plenty of time in my life economy class before. Truthfully, I don't much anymore, and I'm quite thankful for that. But I have real respect for the pain endured by longhaul road warriors in Y, far more than friends who whinge about things I find absurd, whose wealth seems to have helped them lose the plot. To the extent my memory is accurate, I suspect I offer comments like those when helping folks out who have multiple queries, and I don't respond to part of it. But if I've offended, my apologies.

I'll add, no doubt you've seen my other quite strong arguments in favor of seat blocks in Y, not discriminating against "economy DMs", etc. I don't benefit from these things directly but I still feel quite strongly in favor of them.

I do really dislike CX's J catering, and to the extent that's elitist well so be it.

Finally, for the point about high end, maybe we have different definitions of it. Sure, in luxury world there is a fairly vertical hierarchy of things. Higher price means "higher end", at least there is quite a high correlation in the eyes of most luxury consumers....many of whom are indeed in the group of folks who "earned" the disparaging nickname for mainland nouveau riche you've decided to use as your handle. But of course, as those folks with the nickname perhaps teach us through their outlandish behavior and coarse words, price and high end really aren't the same thing.

tuhao888

Yes, agreed on many of the points you listed.

However, I still do not understand the point about the lack of correlation between whether something is considered high end or not. I know everything is relative but just because one enjoys something, it categorically does not automatically make it higher end. That's the most difficult part I'm trying to grasp right now. You mentioned that you enjoy Cafe de Coral from time to time; how does that elevate the hierarchical category of the company just because consumers enjoy it?

sxc

Let’s get back to the topic of this thread - the change over of the lounge operator to Sodexo.

Thanks
sxc
Cathay Pacific Moderator

ermen

What can Sodexo do better that PP or Pen can't.

Mind you the staff are likely to be the same (just name badge change only)

Was happy to get rid of that Pen champagne that was horrid.

kaka

10 september.

kaka

i guess it's gotta do with cx's management or how they turn a blind eye to issues.
and the budget.

dodgeflyer

My biggest issue with professional outsources is the steady decline they tend to stand for. Rarely have I experienced an improvement in services.

Assuming staff costs remain the same, the only other ability to affect Sodexho's profitability (or to provide a lower tender price) is via costs. Initially this is via economies of scale. On day 1, say this is split between Sodexho and client; when I say 'split' I refer to the price they're able to undercut the competition by.

Over time it is easy for Sodexho to skim the costs, either via holding its price constant (thus inflation eats away at actual budget) or via substitutions in its supply chain. Because they are professional outsources, the entire organisation is valued based on perceived costs savings, vs. say the 'luxury proposition' such as the Pen, and ultimately this infiltrates the overall product required. In the end the menus will be driven by costs, rather than creativity (not the existing food is particularly creative).

I am fairly sure this is offered as a fixed price contract thus there's no incentive for Sodexho to provide services above pass grade; CX then reduces budget and the decline continues. For an applicable case study: see BA EC Baxter-Storey contract change...

hl176

oopl

I hope Sodexo does improve things but my previous experience with their brand has been so-so.

djsflynn

Just to underscore the sheer scope of out-sourcing and how it comes back to the airline and how low (or high) it sets the bar: reflect that SATS prepares meals for everybody from Singapore Airlines to Scoot to Singapore's military services (true story: SATS is working on military meal packs which have an incredibly long shelf life without being refrigerated, makes you wonder if that might trickle up to some LCCs!).

Sodexo is exactly the same proposition: the client will get what they're willing to pay for, and what they're willing to tolerate in case standards slip after a starting at a high benchmark.

percysmith