Are CX lounges the PP lounges of OneWorld?
#31
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,752
Monday mornings with the weekly PVG/PEK/SIN/TPE etc. work-shuttle-bus filled with up to 40+ DM's on PVG flights across all classes? Did you guy's never experience a typical Monday morning in HKIA?
There is generally quite a waiting line in the Wing F for the dining area to get breakfast.
Although, unlike OP says, thats hardly other OWE's fault but rather CXDM's plus their guests!
There is generally quite a waiting line in the Wing F for the dining area to get breakfast.
Although, unlike OP says, thats hardly other OWE's fault but rather CXDM's plus their guests!
Don't they serve a meal on the flight? Sorry I never took the shuttle (I remember being allowed to fly to PEK on Sunday arvo upteen years ago)
#32
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: HKG
Programs: BA(GGL) QF LTS CX AM, Hilton Diamond, PPL(A)
Posts: 1,654
Actually the 'answer' to why CX lounges are overcrowded are all stated above.
In appropriate order (ie too many SLs). Recently, I was able to hear about what partner elites flood the lounge the most, I'm not surprised the 'major culprit' was BA. I was told that QF and AA are significant but not so compared to BA. Why am I surprised as you can see how easy it is to hit BA OWS/OWE. But again, many are flying CX, so it seems hard to have any bases to bar them from access. Given the popularity of the Avios program as well as UK-HK ties it's also not surprising that there are probably many more BA HKG-based elites compared to AA (there is less than 100) and QF.
In appropriate order (ie too many SLs). Recently, I was able to hear about what partner elites flood the lounge the most, I'm not surprised the 'major culprit' was BA. I was told that QF and AA are significant but not so compared to BA. Why am I surprised as you can see how easy it is to hit BA OWS/OWE. But again, many are flying CX, so it seems hard to have any bases to bar them from access. Given the popularity of the Avios program as well as UK-HK ties it's also not surprising that there are probably many more BA HKG-based elites compared to AA (there is less than 100) and QF.
But then again, I mostly fly CX/KA ex-HKG... so I am giving them some money...
#33
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
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Posts: 19,752
I don't think Krisflyer Gold will work with CX in HKG - or it matters. QF will happily take BA/QR's money (or CX's whenever I have a Gate <30 departure with redemption J)
#34
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hong Kong
Programs: CX, UA, Shangri-La, Hyatt, Starwood
Posts: 7,708
The world is just different now.
FF programs should be about driving loyalty...and specifically, loyalty in the form of revenue...to the airlines' metal. You're a great case in point. Flying CX/KA mainly but utilizing another FF program.
FF programs have just become arbitrage programs, where clever customers one-up each other but I question if they're adding much value at all anymore. Between airlines, especially in alliance like OW, everyone just moves money in a circle between them. O
Meanwhile, obtaining benefits is bizarre and sometimes counter intuitive. I think overall, FF programs have lost the plot as the world has changed.
#36
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: HKG, TXL
Programs: CX DM
Posts: 566
I guess most people are just lazy + most KA PVG/SHA flights depart from 5xx gates thus Wing F is far better located for these.
As for partner elites flying partners, I think that's problematic too. If you look at the upgrade lists on HKG-DFW, it's not surprising that there are up to 60 or even 80 elites on a single flight every day. However, I am skeptical that most are 'smart' enough to use the CX lounge (AA directs them to PPL). Still it could tally up - think about AA x 2, QR x 2, BA x 2, QF x ?, JL x 2, RJ, MH,...it could add up. But these ones are where CX gets the $ from so I doubt it these pax will be 'targets' - even QR lounges (at DOH and worldwide) accept oneworld premium pax, which they get $ for.
I also wouldnt be surprised if a lot of those people actually do go to CX lounges instead of the PP to which they are directed to. I'm sure that there are more than you'd guess, just from hear-say and being told by friends/colleagues etc.
Still a problem 8 years on http://daisy-lancashire.blogspot.com...07312275443676?
Don't they serve a meal on the flight? Sorry I never took the shuttle (I remember being allowed to fly to PEK on Sunday arvo upteen years ago)
Don't they serve a meal on the flight? Sorry I never took the shuttle (I remember being allowed to fly to PEK on Sunday arvo upteen years ago)
Also, although a lot of those PVG weekly shuttle DM's flying exclusively in Y will most likely manage to continue 'achieving' DM. If anything, for those guy's, getting DM just got easier with the new changes!
While before they used to rely on getting 120? sectors (52weeks x 2 = 104 sectors, 16 short of DM), now they'll get 1040 tier points in V and 1560 tier points in K. While V class earns then exactly the same as before when using sectors, its now easier for them to just mix in 1 long haul which most likely will get them to 1200.... don't know if i've explained it clearly enough?
yea, this is where FF programs really need to re-think things.
The world is just different now.
FF programs should be about driving loyalty...and specifically, loyalty in the form of revenue...to the airlines' metal. You're a great case in point. Flying CX/KA mainly but utilizing another FF program.
FF programs have just become arbitrage programs, where clever customers one-up each other but I question if they're adding much value at all anymore. Between airlines, especially in alliance like OW, everyone just moves money in a circle between them. O
Meanwhile, obtaining benefits is bizarre and sometimes counter intuitive. I think overall, FF programs have lost the plot as the world has changed.
The world is just different now.
FF programs should be about driving loyalty...and specifically, loyalty in the form of revenue...to the airlines' metal. You're a great case in point. Flying CX/KA mainly but utilizing another FF program.
FF programs have just become arbitrage programs, where clever customers one-up each other but I question if they're adding much value at all anymore. Between airlines, especially in alliance like OW, everyone just moves money in a circle between them. O
Meanwhile, obtaining benefits is bizarre and sometimes counter intuitive. I think overall, FF programs have lost the plot as the world has changed.
yea, I wonder if G16 is actually going to be something for Diamonds or F? Probably not, but....it will be right next to the Qantas lounge. Just saying there will literally be two OW lounges next to each other with the same access permissions. A hope I guess, albeit unlikely.
I think if CX does something special for Diamonds only (+ F), G16 is where they have to do it. Otherwise there's no chance. They've already renovated all the lounges and they're quite good already. Going for G16 becoming some DM+F lounge would be it's close to security and immigration, so if they add some buggy service it could be easier to coordinate. Of course, this is unlikely....no less because it's on the opposite side of the airport as the CX desks (although close to KA). Not to mention they've made no mention of it.
I think if CX does something special for Diamonds only (+ F), G16 is where they have to do it. Otherwise there's no chance. They've already renovated all the lounges and they're quite good already. Going for G16 becoming some DM+F lounge would be it's close to security and immigration, so if they add some buggy service it could be easier to coordinate. Of course, this is unlikely....no less because it's on the opposite side of the airport as the CX desks (although close to KA). Not to mention they've made no mention of it.
Then the Wing/Pier could be for CX F/DM only.
#37
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 5,797
#38
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hong Kong
Programs: CX, UA, Shangri-La, Hyatt, Starwood
Posts: 7,708
Gates 18-19 aren't *as* common as gates 3-4, but there is at least one flight daily, and usually multiple. Today there have been 2 to the US so far. And I think in weird situations Gate 17 is also utilized, but I know for certain that's not an exclusive CX gate. Only 18-19 are, and 3-4. And as mentioned above, the problem with 18-19 is that both jetbridge entrances are on the northern "tip". So they cram 5 gates in there. Collateral damage is the fact they can't rope off the whole tip that way, because the entrance to Gate 17 gets in the way. (Gates 3-4 are ideal because only gate 4's jetbridge is on the southern "tip").
If CX could get all gates 17-19, now that would be great. Because they could rope off the whole area. But I don't get to ask such specific questions in my meetings with HKIA or CX, particularly if it's obvious I then post it on FT.
Europe long-haul flights don't follow this pattern. It's USA flights only.
Last edited by QRC3288; May 29, 2017 at 3:41 am
#39
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: HKG
Programs: BA(GGL) QF LTS CX AM, Hilton Diamond, PPL(A)
Posts: 1,654
yea, this is where FF programs really need to re-think things.
The world is just different now.
FF programs should be about driving loyalty...and specifically, loyalty in the form of revenue...to the airlines' metal. You're a great case in point. Flying CX/KA mainly but utilizing another FF program.
FF programs have just become arbitrage programs, where clever customers one-up each other but I question if they're adding much value at all anymore. Between airlines, especially in alliance like OW, everyone just moves money in a circle between them.
Meanwhile, obtaining benefits is bizarre and sometimes counter intuitive. I think overall, FF programs have lost the plot as the world has changed.
The world is just different now.
FF programs should be about driving loyalty...and specifically, loyalty in the form of revenue...to the airlines' metal. You're a great case in point. Flying CX/KA mainly but utilizing another FF program.
FF programs have just become arbitrage programs, where clever customers one-up each other but I question if they're adding much value at all anymore. Between airlines, especially in alliance like OW, everyone just moves money in a circle between them.
Meanwhile, obtaining benefits is bizarre and sometimes counter intuitive. I think overall, FF programs have lost the plot as the world has changed.
But the OW membership has driven revenue to CX. I mean, I don't (never) consider SQ or other *A members when I fly at all, even if pricing can be cheaper.. because of my status with OW.
So, even though money is circulating around the OW airlines, at least it is kept within the alliance, which I suppose is a part of the purpose?
#40
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hong Kong
Programs: CX, UA, Shangri-La, Hyatt, Starwood
Posts: 7,708
But the OW membership has driven revenue to CX. I mean, I don't (never) consider SQ or other *A members when I fly at all, even if pricing can be cheaper.. because of my status with OW.
So, even though money is circulating around the OW airlines, at least it is kept within the alliance, which I suppose is a part of the purpose?
So, even though money is circulating around the OW airlines, at least it is kept within the alliance, which I suppose is a part of the purpose?
However, it still seems a little bizarre to me....if that's the case, there really should just be one FF program in the alliance. The differing rules / requirements / benefits for each were clearly created in a world where the intention was for program members to be overwhelming fliers on their "home" airline. And that foundation has shattered in the last decade, but the programs havent really. Sure they've changed requirements and earn rates and whatnot but they haven't changed their foundation, and I think that's just kinda prehistoric given the global world we live in. The foundation of an airline owning a FF program is to drive revenue to itself by encouraging fliers to go out of their way to stay loyal, and thus spend more $$$ on the home airline. You raise an excellent point about the alliance "circle". My follow up question to that is....then why seriously doesn't CX just cancel their own program but stay in OW? EVERY lounge entry, at that point, would be ancillary revenue!
#42
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
Programs: FB , BA Gold
Posts: 15,540
Frankly, this is the Nth thread on this topic and it makes me smile as many posters simply show their personal bias.
CX wants to generate revenues whatever the OW FFP used by the pax.
Posters should realize that Hong Kong is a small base (i dont want to use words like country, city, SAR..). So MPC is primarily a very small FFP. On the other hand, HKG OW pax use mostly CX flights. There are hundreds of daily CX/KA flights compared to a few non-CX OW flights. What CX wants is to attract pax in premium cabins. What is lounge-costly to CX is all those MPC G or DM (or OWS and OWE) flying cheap regional Y.
If lounges are crowded, CX should reserve access to its top lounges to revenue pax in F and J, like QR does, and dedicate specific lounges to elite members flying Y. I think that it is the current trend and CX is considering it.
#44
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: HKG
Programs: BA(GGL) QF LTS CX AM, Hilton Diamond, PPL(A)
Posts: 1,654
It sounds too cheap I reckon I reckon I consume $30 of food when I visit the Pier F. Just a starter, main course and desert would set you back more then $30 I reckon?
#45
Join Date: Jul 2011
Programs: OneWorld Emerald (BA GGL), *A Silver (Miles & Less), Skyteam Pleb (KLM FlyingBlue), Mucci Platinum
Posts: 900
It was already that sort of figure many years ago. I wouldn't be surprised if that figure is in fact higher now, and much higher for F.