Cathay Goes "American"
Oct 28, 2015, 10:10 am
#31
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 6,978
I have to admit, now that I'm PEY flyer sometimes when I see people upgraded into PEY from Y, at times I feel dumb for paying $3000 for a ticket when someone else just paid $1200 and got bumped-up to the same seat with the same service.
However, that's how the system works, when it's full people get op-up, and sometimes I benefit, sometimes I don't. We should be happy for each other. This idea that since I paid full price therefore the airline can't do any favors for any other human being for any reason is ridiculous.
However, that's how the system works, when it's full people get op-up, and sometimes I benefit, sometimes I don't. We should be happy for each other. This idea that since I paid full price therefore the airline can't do any favors for any other human being for any reason is ridiculous.
Oct 28, 2015, 8:07 pm
#33
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2007
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Oct 29, 2015, 1:23 am
#34
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
Programs: FB , BA Gold
Posts: 15,556
To the OP, there are a few somewhat plausible scenarios.
First, "Instant Upgrades". In the past, the PIL records Instant Upgrade passengers in a manner that crew frequently mistake for op-ups ("Instant Upgrade" are Asia Miles award upgrade passengers from cash J tickets, but processed at the airport instead of via MPC beforehand). This has long been a frustration of mine because you're treated like an op-up (which means last meal choice in F), while burning a lot of miles to sit up there...and merely because the waitlist didn't clear before departure day.
Now, four Instant Upgrades on one flight sounds extreme to me! But, just trying to rationalize this...I'm under the impression ORD F cabins are not frequently going out full of revenue pax, so perhaps the cabin was wide open and there were a lot of cash J passengers trying to upgrade? Perhaps...?
Second, Birthday or other Special Upgrades. I highly doubt it was four guys' birthday, especially since you mention they seem to all be friends, but maybe it was a birthday for one or two?
Third, some type of CX / Swire / whatever mgmt. CX is quite clubby with their mgmt and Swire folks flying premium cabins. I'm not sure how they go about ticketing those flights and perhaps they stick them in J and just tell check-in staff to upgrade them to F if space is available? Anyone know?
Fourth, a few HK govt or PRC govt officials, especially those relating to CX / airline affairs. ? Just a few thoughts?
Agree it is certainly disconcerting. Albeit, I've never really encountered something like that so I'm thinking it's an unfortunate one-off.
First, "Instant Upgrades". In the past, the PIL records Instant Upgrade passengers in a manner that crew frequently mistake for op-ups ("Instant Upgrade" are Asia Miles award upgrade passengers from cash J tickets, but processed at the airport instead of via MPC beforehand). This has long been a frustration of mine because you're treated like an op-up (which means last meal choice in F), while burning a lot of miles to sit up there...and merely because the waitlist didn't clear before departure day.
Now, four Instant Upgrades on one flight sounds extreme to me! But, just trying to rationalize this...I'm under the impression ORD F cabins are not frequently going out full of revenue pax, so perhaps the cabin was wide open and there were a lot of cash J passengers trying to upgrade? Perhaps...?
Second, Birthday or other Special Upgrades. I highly doubt it was four guys' birthday, especially since you mention they seem to all be friends, but maybe it was a birthday for one or two?
Third, some type of CX / Swire / whatever mgmt. CX is quite clubby with their mgmt and Swire folks flying premium cabins. I'm not sure how they go about ticketing those flights and perhaps they stick them in J and just tell check-in staff to upgrade them to F if space is available? Anyone know?
Fourth, a few HK govt or PRC govt officials, especially those relating to CX / airline affairs. ? Just a few thoughts?
Agree it is certainly disconcerting. Albeit, I've never really encountered something like that so I'm thinking it's an unfortunate one-off.
All these are more likely explanations that the station manager upgrading friends or good clients while there were empty seats in J. That must be a very rare scenario even at ORD.
Oct 29, 2015, 1:27 am
#35
Join Date: Nov 2006
Programs: MPC,CA,MU,AF
Posts: 8,171
For various reasons, CX also hands out a lot of "one-class upgrade certificate at airport'. I have had a few of them for several valid reasons and found them very difficult to use to opup from J to F on longhaul. I have frequently had flights with several open F seats at checkin, but could not use it because others had priority as explained by the counter staff. This could have happened, and the purser has little way to know except that the pax was opped up at the gate/lounge.
All these are more likely explanations that the station manager upgrading friends or good clients while there were empty seats in J. That must be a very rare scenario even at ORD.
All these are more likely explanations that the station manager upgrading friends or good clients while there were empty seats in J. That must be a very rare scenario even at ORD.
Oct 29, 2015, 6:34 am
#36
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 6,978
Oct 29, 2015, 6:51 am
#37
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Hong Kong
Programs: BAEC, CXMPO, Golden Circle, HH & Avis Preferred
Posts: 7
To the OP, there are a few somewhat plausible scenarios.
First, "Instant Upgrades". In the past, the PIL records Instant Upgrade passengers in a manner that crew frequently mistake for op-ups ("Instant Upgrade" are Asia Miles award upgrade passengers from cash J tickets, but processed at the airport instead of via MPC beforehand). This has long been a frustration of mine because you're treated like an op-up (which means last meal choice in F), while burning a lot of miles to sit up there...and merely because the waitlist didn't clear before departure day.
Now, four Instant Upgrades on one flight sounds extreme to me! But, just trying to rationalize this...I'm under the impression ORD F cabins are not frequently going out full of revenue pax, so perhaps the cabin was wide open and there were a lot of cash J passengers trying to upgrade? Perhaps...?
Second, Birthday or other Special Upgrades. I highly doubt it was four guys' birthday, especially since you mention they seem to all be friends, but maybe it was a birthday for one or two?
Third, some type of CX / Swire / whatever mgmt. CX is quite clubby with their mgmt and Swire folks flying premium cabins. I'm not sure how they go about ticketing those flights and perhaps they stick them in J and just tell check-in staff to upgrade them to F if space is available? Anyone know?
Fourth, a few HK govt or PRC govt officials, especially those relating to CX / airline affairs. ? Just a few thoughts?
Agree it is certainly disconcerting. Albeit, I've never really encountered something like that so I'm thinking it's an unfortunate one-off.
First, "Instant Upgrades". In the past, the PIL records Instant Upgrade passengers in a manner that crew frequently mistake for op-ups ("Instant Upgrade" are Asia Miles award upgrade passengers from cash J tickets, but processed at the airport instead of via MPC beforehand). This has long been a frustration of mine because you're treated like an op-up (which means last meal choice in F), while burning a lot of miles to sit up there...and merely because the waitlist didn't clear before departure day.
Now, four Instant Upgrades on one flight sounds extreme to me! But, just trying to rationalize this...I'm under the impression ORD F cabins are not frequently going out full of revenue pax, so perhaps the cabin was wide open and there were a lot of cash J passengers trying to upgrade? Perhaps...?
Second, Birthday or other Special Upgrades. I highly doubt it was four guys' birthday, especially since you mention they seem to all be friends, but maybe it was a birthday for one or two?
Third, some type of CX / Swire / whatever mgmt. CX is quite clubby with their mgmt and Swire folks flying premium cabins. I'm not sure how they go about ticketing those flights and perhaps they stick them in J and just tell check-in staff to upgrade them to F if space is available? Anyone know?
Fourth, a few HK govt or PRC govt officials, especially those relating to CX / airline affairs. ? Just a few thoughts?
Agree it is certainly disconcerting. Albeit, I've never really encountered something like that so I'm thinking it's an unfortunate one-off.
Oct 29, 2015, 7:01 am
#38
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hong Kong
Programs: CX, UA, Shangri-La, Hyatt, Starwood
Posts: 7,708
For various reasons, CX also hands out a lot of "one-class upgrade certificate at airport'. I have had a few of them for several valid reasons and found them very difficult to use to opup from J to F on longhaul. I have frequently had flights with several open F seats at checkin, but could not use it because others had priority as explained by the counter staff. This could have happened, and the purser has little way to know except that the pax was opped up at the gate/lounge.
All these are more likely explanations that the station manager upgrading friends or good clients while there were empty seats in J. That must be a very rare scenario even at ORD.
All these are more likely explanations that the station manager upgrading friends or good clients while there were empty seats in J. That must be a very rare scenario even at ORD.
Oct 29, 2015, 7:55 am
#39
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: London
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Posts: 5,163
Oct 29, 2015, 3:10 pm
#40
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: YYZ
Programs: Hilton Gold, Marriott Gold, Club Accor Silver, AC 75K
Posts: 264
I can confidently say without knowing exactly what went on, speculations are just speculations. Don’t forget that Cathay is owned by several companies combined, Swire group being the largest share. I remember years ago that I got bumped out of J because a Swire executive was on urgent business, how I found out about that? I overheard it over the cabin crew, but that doesn’t give me grounds to go and complain to CX for letting their own staff fly before rev passengers. Unless you have solid official evidence, I would not go and blame CX or their staff. Everything happens for a reason and CX often times has to go against protocol because those protocols don’t cover 100% of the possible situations.
I myself have received very special treatment from CX due to a variety of reasons, ones that most people would not often think about. So before pointing fingers I think its best to give the benefit of the doubt, unless you have solid evidence.
I myself have received very special treatment from CX due to a variety of reasons, ones that most people would not often think about. So before pointing fingers I think its best to give the benefit of the doubt, unless you have solid evidence.
Oct 29, 2015, 3:12 pm
#41
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: YYZ
Programs: Hilton Gold, Marriott Gold, Club Accor Silver, AC 75K
Posts: 264
I also think its maybe anniversary upgrades for a DM+ members and their companions. Maybe even Cargo Clan members who give lots of business to CX would warrant such a situation.
Last edited by cxfan1960; Nov 4, 2015 at 2:19 pm Reason: Remove OT sentence that led to OT discussions.
Oct 29, 2015, 4:52 pm
#42
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: YYZ
Programs: Hilton Gold, Marriott Gold, Club Accor Silver, AC 75K
Posts: 264
I’ve talked to HKG GA all the time and they said on outports the chances of upgrades are much higher. HKG is the stingyest, I’ve never gotten an op-up from HKG. Not even a birthday upgrade
Oct 29, 2015, 4:55 pm
#43
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Washington, D.C.
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AA tagged baggage to HKG. Apparently at ORD, someone retagged to DPS, as I had a connecting flight 14 hours later - next day. As noted, not told retagged so I waited at baggage claim at HKG. CX told me they were "sorry". Not that big a deal but a little frustrating after long day of travel.
Oct 30, 2015, 2:29 am
#44
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2015
Programs: AA & SPG Plat
Posts: 387
There are many things you don't know.
She did violate confidences because she has no right sharing flight details with a pax, F class or no F class. Especially in the age of terrorism this is very irresponsible and reckless.
You do NOT know what they sold or did not sold. Unless you tabbed into CX database directly you have no confidence in knowing anything behind the scene of CX booking.
If Expertflyer is your source of info you are on very weak grounds. There are numerous times a religious check on Expertflyer shows all 9s, and when I board I was upgraded on a full-booked flight. And there are other times when it shows all 0s, and the plane is viritually deserted.
Flying a route 20+ times may give you an idea, but there are uniqueness of each particular flight on any given moment. Many other posters have already mentioned it. Some people might just want to burn miles by using Instant Upgrade. Other people might be on waitlist and approved in the last minute. It may be CX management flying. It may be government VIPs. The point is you have no idea what really happened.
She did violate confidences because she has no right sharing flight details with a pax, F class or no F class. Especially in the age of terrorism this is very irresponsible and reckless.
You do NOT know what they sold or did not sold. Unless you tabbed into CX database directly you have no confidence in knowing anything behind the scene of CX booking.
If Expertflyer is your source of info you are on very weak grounds. There are numerous times a religious check on Expertflyer shows all 9s, and when I board I was upgraded on a full-booked flight. And there are other times when it shows all 0s, and the plane is viritually deserted.
Flying a route 20+ times may give you an idea, but there are uniqueness of each particular flight on any given moment. Many other posters have already mentioned it. Some people might just want to burn miles by using Instant Upgrade. Other people might be on waitlist and approved in the last minute. It may be CX management flying. It may be government VIPs. The point is you have no idea what really happened.
Source of this?
Nov 1, 2015, 7:08 pm
#45
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They might have also specifically chosen to fly on their birthday/anniversary in the hope of the op-up. I know I might if a travel date fell close to my birthday etc.
Last edited by cxfan1960; Nov 4, 2015 at 2:20 pm Reason: Update quoted post edited by mod.