percysmith

Sounds like the Channel Tunnel http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channel...l#Construction. 7 years is a good estimate. But by the time it's complete we might need the capacity anyway.

percysmith

If the SZX side is domestic and HKG side is international, I suppose they'll make the train quarantined on the HK side - so everyone getting on the HK side will be treated as if departed HK (same as through trains from Hung Hom).

As the PRC side is the domestic end then I think there has to be at least a border/customs clearance there.

That raises a new question - how are HK ppl meant to use the HKG-SZX link then? Say I'm at the IFC, trying to catch a flight at SZX. Do I get to HKG via AEL, pass HK immigration and customs there and then heave my bags through a special gate to get on the HKG-SZX train? That will be two non-colocated clearances and sounds painful...

(currently this is what the through train passengers are doing right now. but I think HSR will be centrally processed by both PRC and HK officials on the HK side...)

stupidhead

Does Mainland China even allow sterile TWOV? I thought that was only allowed in Shanghai and Beijing.

percysmith

Maybe the objective is to connect passengers to PRC domestic flights; so border entry will be mandatory. TWOV connections between an international flight in HK and an intenational flight in SZX not contemplated.

stupidhead

Perhaps they could have Chinese customs at HKG. Then they don't need to worry about crossing the border twice.

percysmith

Okay sure if that works for HSR, that'll work for HKG-SZX.

stupidhead

I would think for US-China, PEK or even ICN would be a better bet, with HKG being too far south. For Europe-China, it would require backtracking for most of China. The only connections that make sense are US-Southeast Asia and Oz/NZ-China. Maybe Southeast Asia-China.

kaka

possibly, but i take it you're not from this part of the world (HK). Having chinese authorities exercising enforcable powers is a big no-no and would run into massive local problems. Politics ensured this is not like Canada/Ireland-US or UK-France/Belgium.

Try think Cuba/US Pre-clearance.

kaka

Please, again, for those who says the stupid tunnel to baoan would help HK to connect to china.
by the time people are attracted to baoan they would build 20 other runways (maybe not 20, say 3 more?) then voila except the high trip generations from HK everyone else would skip HK to China domestic flights from bao'an all together. please someone tell me, when did airport cooperation worked? in Tokyo it failed big time. JFK/EWR/LGA they are all in a different league. LGW/LHR: i dont even know if it had worked, but that worked out only because BA is a major operator out of London and they put all their leisure flights in an airport that is like 90-120 mins away from LHR. they're in so much of a monopoly they dont even bother offering any transport options. If i hadnt need to burn CX miles on a oneworld operator i really wouldnt have gone for my last HKG-LHR//LGW-PSA trip. Also if CX had direct/1stop CDG-HKG on award, i wouldnt have taken a train from Paris to Amsterdam. (I would say so far AMS as a train-plane transit is as pleasant as it can be around the world (except MAYBE FRA, but still FRA train station is quite a long walk away. AMS is RIGHT ABOVE the airport)) All i really had to do was to get off the train, leave my luggage at a hotel that is a 3 min walk away(Sheraton). I think that walk is even shorter then the one in HKIA to Regal (Do i have to go outside at that footbridge in HK??). If i had thought i need to take a flight from cameroon, get to paris, take a 3 hr train ride to amsterdam, and then off i go to peking, i'd think i would be pretty crazy for not going thru LHR direct or sth.

Unfortunately, there's CZ in china. i have no idea why they seem to think spending 0 would attract many customers, but if they had the capacity of 4 runways and some goodwill and good hardware, i cannot see why people would want to do a HKG-SZH/CAN transfer. Who said KA can get a share of the truly dom cake in china?

Unless the day comes that KA is a dominant player at Bao'an or wherever the chinese decides to link up the rail to, it simply makes 0 sense to have a train and not a runway. See how ICN got all the japanese traffic becasue say SDJ-HND//NRT-HKG makes a lot less sense to SDJ-ICN-HKG.

PS. I am highly skeptical that the current chek lap kok island was just levelling off the little hill. I do not have any data to hand tho but i remember reading off stuff as a kid how much earth had to be delivered from outside to fill in the airport. seems like that dude was just taking facts out of context just because it was convenient. why do they not care about the empty buses clogging up the air with CO2 and other nasty chemicals that would kill you and me but worry about the dolphins that may or may not die and be known if we are all dead by the local pollutants.

percysmith

Tell that to Donald Tsang

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/archiv.../t-506990.html

kaka

i know he said it, but he's on an, ahem, mission to screw up hong kong. we are still so naive and think this can be sorted out. i think i should just go back to UK and you to Australia and we'll meet in BKK instead. then we can just use one of the kangaroo airlines becasue CX would have been flipped cuz noone needs to go thru HK anymore.

Marco Polo

Hong Kong is not a true 24 hour international airport
Compare the aircraft movements
Chep Lap Kok
Average movements 891 per day, with peak 1003 in April.
Checking the airport information pages
Arrivals
4 between 0000 and 0100
8 between 0500-0600
Cargo
8 between 0000 -0100
9 between 0100-0200
4 between 0200-0600

Departures
15 between 0000-0100
4 between 0100-0200
4 between 0700 -0800
Cargo
16 between 0050 and 0600

Never too late www.scmp.com
Hong Kong should first do more to improve airport efficiency, such as increasing the number of night flights
Peter Kammerer Jun 28, 2011
I've been anecdotally given three reasons this is not possible: the noise from aircraft, a lack of demand and safety. First, noise from our airport comfortably falls within international standards, as Airport Authority assessments show. There can be no demand while there is no choice. Lowering landing fees and charges to encourage budget carriers to use our airport, specifically at night, would convince many passengers to travel at times that they would not normally. And as for safety, Gatwick airport outside London uses a single runway for take-offs and landings and manages up to 50 flights an hour, around the clock, 10 fewer than Hong Kong presently achieves with two runways.

As for joint one shot immigration services I can go to and from Macau on my HK Permanent ID card without passport since they have immigration data sharing and I would expect the same to happen in the coming years into China once Donald Lame Duck gets off the pot and joins one of the local tycoon property developers in his new career.

ajhira

Are you kidding? No thanks. I've had enough late night flight experiences in Dubai & Mumbai and other places where they do not care about time for passengers or any locals that come to the airport to pick you up... taking a 1am flight to Europe and landing at 5-6am is about as extreme as they should be... it is very very difficult to catch a flight from 2 to 6am in any city... besides the inconvenience to people, the extra noise generated is not right to people in the surrounding areas.

kaka

indeed but say mumbai/delhi, i think they have weather reasons to worry about during the day. Midnight flights are good for marginal revenue but will never bring enough pax flow and pax value for city growth. Those pax will want to arrive at prime times, and that's what the capacity is built for.

Afterall many "24 hour" airports have much lower activities at 01-06.

Cathay Boy

Airport cooperation doesn't work because all airports will eventually only seeking self-interest, promote self take-off/landing and pax traffic. I'm glad you mentioned EWR/LGA/JFK. One of the biggest complain for NYC government in the late 90s is that EWR gets "favored" treatment over JFK, and they are all run by the same Port Authority!!! It's not until NYC Representatives threaten to force Port Authority to pay up on back-rent up to hundreds of millions of dollars did the Port Authority decided to "invest and improve" JFK.

HKG needs a third runway, or prepare to be another TPE - once holding so much promise, and now is just a footnote in history.