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-   -   Canada suggests armed agents at border (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/canada/443884-canada-suggests-armed-agents-border.html)

cur Sep 1, 2006 11:57 pm


Originally Posted by Altaflyer
I actually have worked at a border crossing at 3 am and it may as well have been remote since the PIL (booth) was certainly quite the hike from anyone else on shift. At no time was I afraid for my life and frankly I will say again that having guns may indeed cause more problems than it potentially solves.

Some officers may feel more safe and that's fine. The Union is doing this for the MONEY - its 90% about the money. Also, having worked with some officers it frightens me to think they will be carrying guns :eek:

Put the union conspiracy theory to rest. The Union didn't get officers more pay when batons and OC spray were implemented, and they have told officers that they're not lobbying for more pay. Many officers resent CEUDA because of this. Its the employees that want more pay because their job has shifted from tax collector to law enforcer. If you were a social worker and told you may have to use deadly force, you'd probably want a higher rate of pay, too.

Altaflyer Sep 2, 2006 7:37 am

....and I do not disagree that if guns are carried the pay should increase. I just don't think that guns are needed and feel that it is a way to get a pay increase. While I do not know, I bet the Union asked for a pay increase when pepper spray and batons came in. Come to think of it, were not all regular officers re-classed to PM-3 from PM-2 recently?

YOWkid Sep 4, 2006 1:12 pm


Originally Posted by Altaflyer
....and I do not disagree that if guns are carried the pay should increase. I just don't think that guns are needed and feel that it is a way to get a pay increase. While I do not know, I bet the Union asked for a pay increase when pepper spray and batons came in. Come to think of it, were not all regular officers re-classed to PM-3 from PM-2 recently?

I believe everyone has been reclassified to PM-4 now, including the ex-CFIA officers which were of a different classification. But this may also depend on geographical location -- ie. this info came from a CBSA agent I talked to at YYZ back at the end of May.

YOWkid Sep 4, 2006 1:15 pm


Originally Posted by taupo
To the topic at hand, I think the border guards at land and sea crossings should be armed, not so sure about airports.

In theory, there should be no need to have CBSA agents armed at the airport -- there is the local police, the RCMP, and most people they deal with are behind secured area anyway. So, if CATSA and all Canada's international partners are screening correctly, there should be no guns behind that secured wall.

And in the same light, I'm surprised people haven't argued that CATSA agents should be armed.

Altaflyer Sep 4, 2006 1:56 pm


Originally Posted by YOWkid
And in the same light, I'm surprised people haven't argued that CATSA agents should be armed.

:eek: :eek: :eek:

I think I'd have to start taking VIA from Edmonton to Toronto if that happened :eek:

YOWkid Sep 4, 2006 4:32 pm


Originally Posted by Altaflyer
:eek: :eek: :eek:

I think I'd have to start taking VIA from Edmonton to Toronto if that happened :eek:

And you wouldn't be the only one...

tcook052 Sep 6, 2006 8:13 pm

Some interesting numbers here:

http://www.ctl.ca/issues/ISArticle.a...issue=09012006

The CBSA manages, controls and secures Canada's border at approximately 1,200 points across Canada. An average of 260,000 travellers are processed into Canada every day.

Some of these travellers pose risks to the border officers at border crossings. In 2004, there were 621 weapons seizures, 8,711 drug seizures valued at $290 million, and currency seizures from suspected proceeds of crime valued at approximately $12,978,867. In addition, work-alone situations currently occur at 138 border sites, 95 of which are land port of entries.

The project is aimed at ensuring that Canada's borders are protected from those who threaten the security of the country, while ensuring that legitimate commerce or travel is not delayed.

"Arming CBSA officers and eliminating situations where these officers work alone will allow them to do their job better and more effectively," stated Harper.

Altaflyer Sep 6, 2006 8:57 pm


Originally Posted by tcook052
In 2004, there were 621 weapons seizures

Happened to work at the POE with the most of these seizures and you would certainly not think of it as the POE with the most such seizures :)

tcook052 Sep 6, 2006 9:54 pm


Originally Posted by Altaflyer
Happened to work at the POE with the most of these seizures and you would certainly not think of it as the POE with the most such seizures :)

Just cheese seizures, right? ;)

Altaflyer Sep 6, 2006 10:07 pm


Originally Posted by tcook052
Just cheese seizures, right? ;)

No tcook, those nice travellers just abandoned their cheese at US Customs :)

LeSabre74 Sep 26, 2006 9:19 am

Liberal MP hits the nail on the head (in this particular case):
http://www.canada.com/topics/news/na...ad799f&k=50994

Their shenanigans are embarassing Canadians and putting us at risk.

ALW Sep 26, 2006 9:25 am

Wouldn't the appropriate response be to call in the RCMP? If they wanted to make the point they need guns, call in a lot of RCMP.

=aw

robsawatsky Sep 26, 2006 1:19 pm


Originally Posted by ALW
Wouldn't the appropriate response be to call in the RCMP? If they wanted to make the point they need guns, call in a lot of RCMP.

=aw

In this instance, the RCMP were informed, made an assessment and reported that there was no probably risk. So, the RCMP didn't setup enmasse at the border. But the Border Agents didn't go back until a ruling from the Labour Board. Why the agents didn't return until 4:30 AM the next morning raises a lot of questions because the union rep stated that they went inside the building, didn't just go home. Unfortunately, this seems more like a political tactic to speed-up the arming process than a real safety issue.

wsommerv Sep 26, 2006 3:06 pm

"The traffic jams also resulted in at least one breach of the border, when a vehicle bearing California license plates blasted through the border at Blaine, Wash.
Faith St. John, a spokeswoman for Canada Border Services, said the car isn't believed to be connected to the case involving the armed suspect."

So, uh, maybe then? Or maybe not? We're not really sure.

cur Sep 27, 2006 3:23 am

Ohhhh CBSA. Some people are i by them, I just see them as the loveable goofs. Like the three stooges! The CBP at least has a fitness test they have to pass.

tcook052 Jul 29, 2007 2:32 pm

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl.../National/home

CHILLIWACK, B.C. — The first of Canada's border guards to be authorized to carry weapons on the job graduated Friday after attending training in both Ottawa and Chilliwack, B.C.

The training of the 39 guards, who will be deployed at border crossings across Canada, is part of a plan to enhance safety and strengthen security at Canada's border, says a news release issued Friday.

Prime Minister Stephen Harper announced funding for firearms training for Canada Border Services Agency officers at land and marine ports of entry in August 2006.

tcook052 Sep 1, 2007 12:15 pm

http://hotels.wwtms.com/action/achot...e?locale=en_CA

FORT ERIE, Ont.—Canadian border officers at Fort Erie sported handguns this morning for the first time.
A Beretta PX4 Storm 9 mm pistol could be seen strapped to the belts of several officers checking quiet mid-morning traffic, among 17 border agents to be armed as of today at the Peace Bridge crossing into the United States.


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