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-   -   US to US transit through YYZ (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/canada/2129646-us-us-transit-through-yyz.html)

tem123 Jul 25, 2023 12:48 pm

The only way I could get from DCA to MSP for LH miles on the day I wanted is in AC business class with 85 minutes connection in YYZ.
I realise this means going through both Canada and US immigration.

I will have carry-on luggage only, so no checked bags, and am LH Senator (Star Gold) with an EU passport and both ESTA and advance CBSA, but no Global Entry or Nexus.
Grateful for views on whether this 85 minutes connection is doable.

wrp96 Jul 25, 2023 12:57 pm

Is this AC to AC or is one of the legs on UA? If it's AC to AC it violates cabotage and isn't allowed.

tem123 Jul 25, 2023 1:12 pm

It is AC to AC but LH booked it as two separate flights, probably because of the cabotage issue..
I have checked my booking on the AC site and it is also showing as two separate flights.
I will have no checked bags and two separate boarding passes, so maybe it will be OK.

YYCCL3 Jul 26, 2023 5:08 am

This will be tight. You might be able to avoid CBSA (Canada border control) and head straight to US security and CBP based on your second boarding pass, which would save some time, but there can be big lines for both of these depending on the time of day.

tem123 Jul 26, 2023 8:30 am

Thanks, it does seem risky.
I may decide to leave Washington for another day and come directly to YYZ from Europe as there is still availability in J for miles. No problem with onward flights in J on AC to final destination MSP as it is international while UA only offers basic Y on domestic flights for LH biz mileage tickets.

D582 Jul 26, 2023 4:13 pm


Originally Posted by tem123 (Post 35443812)
It is AC to AC but LH booked it as two separate flights, probably because of the cabotage issue..
I have checked my booking on the AC site and it is also showing as two separate flights.
I will have no checked bags and two separate boarding passes, so maybe it will be OK.

I’m assuming by two separate flights you mean two separate PNRs? Regardless of that though if AC flags this they may not let you board to next flight as *THEY* are the ones that get in trouble for cabotage issues. AC deems anything under 4 hours as cabotage.

YVR Cockroach Jul 26, 2023 6:49 pm


Originally Posted by D582 (Post 35447047)
I’m assuming by two separate flights you mean two separate PNRs? Regardless of that though if AC flags this they may not let you board to next flight as *THEY* are the ones that get in trouble for cabotage issues. AC deems anything under 4 hours as cabotage.

Probably due to an interpretation of what constitutes cabotage by U.S. Customs (or whoever the enforcer is). Posted an example in the cruise forum about the PVSA a few months ago. US Customs states that booking a cruise from say S.F. to Vancouver on a cruise ship, and immediately getting on the next cruise on the same cruise ship from Vancouver to Seattle is a violation of the PVSA.

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/35150308-post7.html

EmailKid Jul 26, 2023 8:12 pm


Originally Posted by D582 (Post 35447047)
....
AC deems anything under 4 hours as cabotage.

Interesting.

So if it's over 4 hours it's not cabotage?

YVR Cockroach Jul 26, 2023 10:18 pm


Originally Posted by EmailKid;35447536
So if it's [b
over[/b] 4 hours it's not cabotage?

Anything over a 4 hr layover as far as flights within North America is consider a stop instead of a layover (at least if there is a legal connecting flight within that time).

tem123 Jul 27, 2023 12:13 am

Many thanks to all for the interesting comments and advice.

It is on one PNR as part of a round trip miles ticket from Europe to MSP.
The risk of AC and/or US customs stopping me boarding combined with the tight connection has persuaded me to rebook on a direct LO flight WAW-YYZ, with the added benefit of saving around $200 in charges.

Cabotage is indeed sometimes overlooked as a potential problem, both for the transport of goods and in this case passengers.

m.y Jul 27, 2023 12:46 pm

AC has terrible on time record (something around 50% of the flights are delayed), and these short haul flights the most impacted. I would not attempt this itinerary unless you are ready to spend the night in Toronto.

tem123 Jul 27, 2023 12:59 pm


Originally Posted by m.y (Post 35449636)
AC has terrible on time record (something around 50% of the flights are delayed), and these short haul flights the most impacted. I would not attempt this itinerary unless you are ready to spend the night in Toronto.

Thanks - your advice has definitely made me change my mind!

Changeup2000 Aug 12, 2023 10:48 am

Done US to YYZ to US itinerary on AC before. AC will only issue ticket if the connection is more than 4 hours.


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