FlyerAl

I'm trying to see the positive out of this frightening news. The only thing I can think of is - fingers crossed - as the virus is already spreading here (not from travel), it will continue to spread due to failed vaccine procurement & pandemic fatigue. This will lead to further spread and economic consequences, increased frustration with the government and ultimately it being replaced with a different one. If only they had taken a different approach (less travel shaming, and more testing), they could spare some of the economic upheaval they've caused. At this point, government failure is our only way out of this.

yvrcnx

I think this will all get worse when recovery payments will stop in about two months for the over 1 million Canadians but then many will say that it's more important to keep people save from getting the virus than the small number of 3% of Canadians with now no more income and difficulty to find a job. Both are important and I am not saying nothing should be done.

It's difficult to find a balance and I do believe in taking measures to prevent the spread of the virus but not sure if locking down even more is the way to go, though it looks like many other countries are following this trend (Germany, Netherlands.....etc.)

bambinomartino

But, but, our PM noted that "freedom of movement is a constitutional right for all Canadians".

What is the practical effect of making international travel impractical or prohibitively expensive and inducing the airlines to cancel just about every route in and out of Canada? Our only land border is effectively closed, from the other side. Now lobby the US to... what, ban Canadians only from flying so JT can say, I didn't pass any law abridging your Charter rights?

I mean, they already have the pre-flight covid test requirements for entering the US by air as of next week. The Biden administration is already floating the possibility of a mandatory quarantine in addition to that. What else could the Canadian government possibly be legitimately asking the Americans to do??????

New strains? Well, yeah, Einstein, that's what viruses do. That's what covid-19 will continue to do. The current model, even with the (for whatever it's worth) promise of the vaccines has no end game. None. How long will this go on?

Flatten the curve my...

tcook052

<moderator hat/toque on>

With the imminent return of Winter to Alberta expected overnight I'll share a wintery analogy as this thread suddenly hit an icy patch and is careening toward the ditch as many, many other factors far beyond the scope of the thread topic are being tossed out so before that happens let's crank the steering wheel and return to the centerline and find the way forward to discuss possible additional entry restrictions to enter Canada while leaving peripheral topics of politics, macroeconomics, and relativity for other threads in other forums. More off topic posts and I'll go back and carry out a course correction with post edits and deletions.

tcook052
Canada forum moderator

<mod toque off>

Yul_voyager

Out of curiosity, I had a look at the NZ managed isolation website. There is no place available at all (calendar stops in April). Not a single one. If Canada decides to go this way, this is actually a way to ban (almost) all international travel.
We will see if that actually happens, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if it comes to that. Hopefully it would be just for a couple of days, like you get tested at D+1 and can be released when the result comes back after a couple of days, but if I have to bet I would still put my money on 14 days...
We should know more next week anyway...

Error 601

How the hell can something be a loophole when you can travel on commercial flights and avail yourselves of fast-track covid testing programs on your return?

This is like when a business accused me of dishonesty for printing a PDF of a coupon that resided on their public facing website.

FlyerAl

These draconian measures are supposed to prevent the new variants from spreading here? A significant number of people are able to return to Canada as essential travellers without having to test or quarantine like truck drivers, health care workers, crew members. They are more likely to be carrying the virus and spreading variants than someone coming back from a beach vacation. So even if they ban all non-essential travel, we're still going to see cases coming in from abroad.

If they intend on imprisoning travellers at airport hotels, how will that work at the land border crossings? Some of them are small crossings in the middle of nowhere! Are they going to set up camps by the borders, or transport individuals to a facility in the nearest town? What do they do with the vehicles in the meantime? Can they logistically establish a system next week? I mean they can't even quickly distribute the few vaccines that are already here!

FlyerAl

It's possible the government could convince the new Biden administration to prohibit Canadians from non-essential entry by air. But then there's the question of transit, since flying to many foreign destinations requires making a connection at a U.S. hub airport.

rankourabu

80% enter without quarantine.
Half of that are truck drivers. So be it. Canada is far from self sufficient.

There is a great example in the other thread how someone is openly abusing the "essential" designation and how easy it is.

How about we crack down on that instead ....

Badenoch

One man's "draconian" is another man's "long over due." The more non-essential leisure travellers going on vacation continue to disregard the government advisory against travel the more the government will take actions to dissuade them. A mandatory two-week quarantine in a government-selected accommodation is a logical next step and not without precedence. Incarcerating those returning from an entirely unnecessary sun vacation at lowest-bidding airport hotels seems entirely appropriate.

tcook052

I agree. The number of passengers arriving by air is a tiny fraction of what it was a year ago (not my hyperbole BTW as AC Q3 RPM was down 91% compared to same period in 2019 as reported by the airline in Nov.) so it seems like using an anvil to kill ants.

If the goal is to end all cases of the virus entering Canada there are other sources that deserve much more scrutiny which is long overdue.

TheCanuckian

Of course if travel increases dramatically, we can assume that travel-related cases will as well. The fact that travel is at only 9% of last year's levels means that most of the travel-related cases have been mitigated simply by people staying off planes. The question, I guess, is whether you try to crush that small percentage by reducing travel from 9% to something lower; or whether you leave it as-is and turn your attention elsewhere. It seems travel is a relatively easy bug to quantify and crush, so a good one to go after from a PR perspective.

rankourabu

Some advisor: look a poll that says 67% Canadians say shut down the border completely becaus le we trained them to believe that this is huge issue even if it isnt. And Ford and Legault are yelling at us!

Govt: Excellent. Get the anvil.

Yul_voyager

Which means, it is strictly a punitive measure, which target the ones who should not travel but travel anyway, and absolutely not a measure which is going to limit the spread / introduction of the virus / new variants.
So it has nothing to do with the managed isolation in NZ or Australia when it is an absolutely necessary measure to protect the country. Let's be clear about it.

Badenoch

Many of those who are coming into Canada by land are essential to maintaining supply chains but tighter scrutiny on who is truly essential would be worth the effort. What is certain however is that while desirable there is nothing essential about a winter vacation in the sun.

Quebec's earlier spring break in 2020 relative to Ontario is believed to have contributed to its higher infection rate in the early stages. Fewer people travelling reduces the risk of more people being infected particularly if they are vacationing in regions with higher infection rates. Travel restrictions also reduce the likelihood of new strains coming into the country.