Some Thoughts on New Pearson Express
 

I am curious if I am the only one who thinks that the new Pearson express is a low-value proposition for anyone who doesn't live exactly nearby one of the stations?

Are any YYZ-based user on the forum actually considering using it?

Let's say you will want to connect with the TTC to the Bloor GO Station (25 minutes to Pearson), only saves you about 20 minutes over using TTC to go further on the Bloor-Danforth Line to Kipling and then take the 192 Keele express to Pearson for just $2.7 (40 minutes to Pearson from Dundas West). The express from Bloor GO costs $22 (not including $2.7 required to connect).

So is it worth spending $22 to save approximately 15 minutes each way? Roundtrip that is $44 extra. A $275 RT flight to NYC means that just getting to the airport will be a %15 increase in the cost of the flight.

A cab from Bloor GO Station is $32 - only $10 more expensive than the express train.

The family fare is $44 from Bloor GO - more expensive than taking a cab. Why would a family of 5 take the Pearson Express?

What I would like to see:

1) Something like a $10 fare max - with free connection to TTC
2) There should be a station at one of the interchanges that are actually the "TTC Hubs" - e.g., Spadina, St. George or Bloor-Yonge stations.

For business people staying at the Royal York or going for a meeting at King and Bay, this thing will be great. For everyone else - yawn. Eventually if/when coordinate with expanded Go rail service, it might be useful for people going to the 905 East who don't want to pay for a taxi.

It is truly amazing that in the 21st century someone can't even buy a single ticket that seamlessly connect the UP Express to TTC and Go.

And here I've been getting annoyed at the $10 round-trip YVR-downtown on the Canada Line.

...but yeah, for someone who regularly commutes *to* downtown Toronto via YYZ - which I think makes me their target market - even a hilariously costly $54 round-trip is preferable to taxis to and from Pearson, especially if it means less time sucking down exhaust fumes on the Gardiner.

Exactly. The target market is people going to/from downtown, where the service will be much cheaper and faster than a taxi. The stops at Bloor and Weston are only a sop to the neighbours of the line to cut down their NIMBYism, not because they actually anticipate a lot of traffic there.

I can understand that the target market going from YYZ-downtown is well-served by the express. However, they would majorly increase the value by simply adding a stop at St. George or Spadina station. Why not do that.

because the train tracks doesn't pass through those stations, UPX intersects Bloor line at Bloor Go station. Even if it did, additional stops would increase travel time making it even less competitive against other modes.

You can use a Presto Pass on most, if not all, GTA public transit. This includes:
Brampton Transit
Burlington Transit
Durham Region Transit (DRT)
GO Transit
Hamilton Street Railway (HSR)
MiWay
Oakville Transit
OC Transpo
Toronto Transit Commission (TTC) – select locations (but I imagine all locations in the not too distant future)
York Region Transit/Viva (YRT/Viva)

If you are connecting with GO or VIA at Union Station (or the Porter shuttle), the UPE will also be excellent. And, in general, the chances of getting caught in traffic in a cab or encountering various cab-borne discomforts makes the UPE attractive. If you compare the cab fare, don't forget the customary tip in your calculations. I will be glad to use the train. The TTC subway and bus at rush hour especially are not a place to be hauling luggage. Since the trip to Pearson is not a daily occurrence the higher fare is not as big a deal as it will be for those work at Pearson.

One word. Uber.

(I live very close to the UP Express, and will never take it unless it's rush hour).

Don't worry. With the new RFID ticket system, the price will be considerably increased.

I see the ultimate problem (outside of cost) with the express train is that the main station (Union) is really not all that central (sure, east-west central, but not north-south). Unless you are working "on Bay Street" or live in one of the new condos close to it, you are going to have to get there either on taxi or public transport. If you take a taxi you might as well take it all the way to the airport as the cost and time will be comparable while public transport will add a lot of extra time even if you are on a subway line--not to mention the hassle of luggage. If I live at, say, Yonge and St. Claire would I really want to give myself an extra hour to walk to the subway, take it to union and then wait for my train? Sure the ride to YYZ from union is 25 minutes, but very few people will not have a lengthy commute to get to Union. The other two stations are really only handy if you live quite close to them.

Because there's no existing GO/Via/CP/CN track that goes substantially near those stations. Are you suggesting they should have built new track to do that? Big money to acquire property. Oh, did you want underground? BIG money.

If you're suggesting that UP should join (interline) the subway track at the Bloor/Dundas GO station... uh... it can't. TTC railway gauge is not standard railway gauge (seriously). And even if it could interline, then it would get stuck in subway traffic, wouldn't be much of an express anymore.

I'm not suggesting it interline but that it effectively connect (like the different terminals at YYZ, for example). So you can get out at the UPX express stop somewhere near Spadina and then walk to the subway from there.

Which is what you will be able to do with the current UPX from the Bloor GO station to the Dundas West station. Except Dundas West station is only about 10 minutes away from Keele anyway (which already connects express to Pearson).

The Bloor GO station (i.e., Dundas West) is not that far from Spadina - how hard would it have been to either move the stop there/add a new stop?

But then again, this seems to be the way that Toronto builds infrastructure. They don't focus on holistic value, but just on specific routes for specific purposes. Hence why Toronto has a very, very inefficient (for a majority of the population) subway system.

Please look at a map and show us on a map where your train tracks would go before making absurd assertions. Spadina station is 4km away from Bloor Go. You are talking about major acquisition of expensive real estate properties? So yes, it is extremely difficult, and for what benefit? There's already a subway connection at Bloor Go.

It would have been pretty hard, considering where the tracks currently go (from Bloor, they swing down towards the lake, to Queen and Dufferin, then parallel to the lake until they get to Union). The closest stop to Spadina would be the Union stop, the only way to make it closer, given where the tracks run, would be to add a stop outside the Rogers Centre, which would not be practical. I actually think the Bloor stop's proximity to Dundas West is about as close as one could get, given existing infrastructure - it isn't a bad option, and better than many options I have come across in other parts of the world.

I may well use the service, at $19 (Presto fare) it is considerably cheaper than a cab, and it almost certainly quicker than taking a cab. I do work on Bay, so it is convenient for me if coming from work (not from home). The statement "but very few people will not have a lengthy commute to get to Union" simply isn't the case, tens of thousands of people work within an easy walk of Union station, and I think that is who it is aimed at, not people from the north or east end of the city, anymore than the bus that went from downtown was designed for them. A huge number of tourists will be within an easy reach of union (just thinking on the number of hotels close by) so it is good for them too (when you get large families, not so much compared with a minivan taxi, but there are still a good number who would prefer the certainty of a train (time and price) than a cab (plenty of cities rip off tourists, although I haven't experienced that issue in TO myself). )