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BA Cabin Crew Vote 96% In Favour Of Strike Action

BA Cabin Crew Vote 96% In Favour Of Strike Action

Old Jan 17, 2007, 8:18 am
  #241  
 
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Originally Posted by typical
They could be getting the employees (and pax!) bought into the future of the airline. "10% margin" is NOT the vision of a successful company. At best, it's an outcome of such.
I agree with pretty much the whole of your post, but in particular about this. Forgive me, I wasn't paying much attention at the time, but was the vision of the premium service airline expounded when the strike-prone components were assembled around the time of privatization? I've read later stories about "making the profit at the front of the plane", but was this post-justification or did anyone preach it at the time?
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 8:56 am
  #242  
 
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Insurance cover on being downgraded/cancelled

Originally Posted by chrishow
We are booked on BA034 - LHR to CPT on Wednesday 31st and obviously nervous with the current BA/Union negotiations.

Worst case scenario and there is a strike which affects my travel, do you know how BA or Amex Platinum card insurance would deal with the situation?

I’ve MFU’d from WT+ to CW – in the event of disruption, changing my flight or booking me onto another carrier, do you think it is likely that I could end up being downgraded? Would I be classed differently as they are MFU seats?
As Smirnoff mentioned above, you should be covered by Amex Insurance for the non-refundable costs of your holiday should your outbound flight be delayed beyond 12 hours for strike reasons.

An interesting situation though is if you are offered an alternative flight by BA (within 12 hours) in a downgraded class.

My feeling is that if you refused this downgraded alternate flight, and cancelled your holiday, the insurance company could classify this as 'Disinclination to travel' and therefore refuse to cover your claim for your non-refundable hotel costs.

They state in the policy (for certain other items in their cover) that should you need to change your flight home, that they will only provide an economy ticket.

It might be worth ringing Amex Insurance to double check the situation before you leave, so that you know exactly what your options are at the airport should the worst happen.
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 9:34 am
  #243  
 
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And for those of you that think BA is bad:

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/070117/20070117005730.html?.v=1

You ain't seen nothin' yet....
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 10:04 am
  #244  
 
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Originally Posted by terpfan101
thats what i thought. so guess it starts next monday. wonder if the CC have a fu** all attitude this week. lets hope not!
Being cabin crew for BA I know that the majority of us will keep a professional attitude at work. This whole issue has been simmering for months and I don't think that we have compromised our service as a result. I am in no doubt that on some occasions our service falls short from what is expected but in most cases we do our very best. Please bear with us during this difficult time, we are fighting for our rights, pay and conditions. We don't want to do on strike but if the management do not listen to us and simply impose a lesser pension, take a purser away from the upper deck (Club), and continue with a bully boy approach to our sickness then ultimately you, our loyal passengers will suffer. Please show your support for us if you wish to do so by writing a letter with your views to our CEO (Willie Walsh) and the board members, ultimately, you can change the management's views by threatening to take your business elsewhere, they would soon start listening then and perhaps the issues that we are fighting for will be resolved. The BASSA trade union is in talks today and tomorrow with BA to find a common ground. We all hope that a strike will be averted if not then we have no other choice. Thank you to all our passengers who have offered support not only during this time but also for recognition for our work on board the aircraft, it's certainly more than what we get from our managers.
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 11:15 am
  #245  
 
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I'm on the dole at the moment, and there aren't many workshy people around the job centre at all (they're all on incapacity these days...). It's almost impossible to have a 'good' living on the dole in the way it was, say, during the Thatcher years.

I'm trying not to regard your comments as a personal affront, and I won't say more in case I end up applying to / working with the firm you work at
Good luck, typical, in your quest for suitable work!

I spent three lonely, miserable periods out of work in the Thatcher years (which is why I will never, ever again vote "Con"-servative as long as one member of Thatcher's government still has a pulse!) so I fully sympathise with you!

I know, just as you do, that there are in reality very, very few "work-shy" people out there - sure, there is the odd sponger who milks the system, but, just like those who throw "sickies" at BA, they are the ones who know how to work the system and would still manage it even if they were dumped stark bo77ock naked in the Sahara desert!

Just so as you critics know, just because the "average" sickness was 22 days, that doesn't mean all of the crew throw "sickies". Many of them take no sick days at all, but someone with a broken leg from the ski slopes might take 90 days! Statiticians loking at these two staff would say they had an average of 45 days sick!

God! I feel positively guilty after having four weeks off after a heart-attack eighteen months ago!
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 11:35 am
  #246  
 
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Rather than a political/moral/ethical/legal/whatever question about who is right and wrong, I have a question about the mechanics of where people and planes and outstations will be. I confess, this feeds in to my personal interest, but I am curious how it would be handled nonetheless.

So a plane is at an outstation in some unpleasant part of the world. The news goes out that a strike is planned for Day X. Does the plane at the outstation and the crew who have spent at least one night there:

1) Fly back to London, thus parking too many planes and people in London, but perhaps getting some passengers to their destinations and not leaving crew members stranded, or
2) Stay where it is, because there is a strike on and BA does not want even more people demanding service in London
3) Stay where it is, because the crew who was to work that flight never flew to that forgotten part of the world knowing there would be a strike on the day they were to be working?
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 12:03 pm
  #247  
 
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Originally Posted by bealine
I feel positively guilty after having four weeks off after a heart-attack eighteen months ago!
I assume it's not the folks signed off by the Doctors because of heart attacks or broken legs, it's the un-corroborated absences up to 4(?) days that happen to coincide with sports events, Mondays, the full moon etc that they're trying to tackle. Even before I quit England the "duvet day" was an established tradition in some occupations.
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 4:32 pm
  #248  
 
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Originally Posted by westtexas
Rather than a political/moral/ethical/legal/whatever question about who is right and wrong, I have a question about the mechanics of where people and planes and outstations will be. I confess, this feeds in to my personal interest, but I am curious how it would be handled nonetheless.

So a plane is at an outstation in some unpleasant part of the world. The news goes out that a strike is planned for Day X. Does the plane at the outstation and the crew who have spent at least one night there:

1) Fly back to London, thus parking too many planes and people in London, but perhaps getting some passengers to their destinations and not leaving crew members stranded, or
2) Stay where it is, because there is a strike on and BA does not want even more people demanding service in London
3) Stay where it is, because the crew who was to work that flight never flew to that forgotten part of the world knowing there would be a strike on the day they were to be working?
In answer to your questions, going by what happened last time back in 1996,
the vast majority of aircraft have a short turnaround away from base usually 2 hours, enough to refuel, re cater and clean. Then the aircraft heads back with the crew that had just night stopped. Therefore, there would be one or more crews at a given hotel depending upon the amount of flights there are to a destination. The only place where an aircraft comes back with a crew is Luanda where we have a minimum rest at a hotel. In answer to your questions

1: If a strike took place on a thursday all aircraft taking off from LHR,LGW and GLA on this day would be grounded thus not supplying an aircraft to the network and so in return not being able to ferry passengers back to LHR, so passengers and crew are stranded at that destination. Incoming aircraft to LHR on that day should in theory remain unaffected as cabin crew cannot strike in a foreign country.
2:However, due to mounting people numbers in the terminals and a lack of parking space on the ground for aircraft some flights to LHR would be cancelled, from a logistical point of view. BA would do their best to put passengers on other carriers but space and timing will play an important factor in such cases.
3: Some crew with wives/girlfriends/partners and family going on a trip knowing that there will be a strike on a certain day may indeed decide not to come to work as they may be away from their families for too long, last time the average time that a crew member stayed away from home was 10 days. However, it took took the network approx 17 days to get back to normal.

Please remember that its only the crew who are rostered a duty on the day of the strike that are able to strike and not show up. There are 12,000 cabin crew so only a small portion will strike depending on how long the strike will last for. Last time the vast majority of crew called in sick for up to 7 days (the legal limit in the UK without a doctors note) and even then there were threats from management that we would loose our jobs if we didn,t show a certificate, which was and is wholly illegal.

I do hope that this has answered your questions and fulfilled your interest. I have heard nothing from our union that things are going well. I shall keep you posted.
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 4:36 pm
  #249  
 
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Yes, in any organisation there will always be people that take the piss. The cabin crew have been extremely badly managed for years. They (BA) should have had an excellent sickness policy in place, that takes into account the type of work that is expected of a cc member, that takes into account the amount of time away from home, that takes into account, how impossible it is to get a drs appt on your day off!

When I joined BA I was TOLD by them, never fly with a cold, a bad tummy, food poisoning, never come to work ill, there are lots of drugs that you can't work whilst still taking. If I took notice of all their advice, I would've been sacked ages ago!

BA have changed the goalposts so many times, it's sick!

To the doubters out there. I DID leave because I got so fed up of being treated like crap.

As a senior crew member, I did lots of unpaid hrs. Preparing for a flt and after flts. Whilst away I even visited our pax and crew in hospital. A "thanks " from my mgr? Errrr.... never. I did CPR on 2 pax. A thanks , or a "are you OK?" nope!

As far as the pensions issue goes. I signed my contract. I paid into my pension. If I turned around to my mortgage provider and said that I would like to leave 10 yrs early, with the same houses, do you think that they would let me?

I signed a legally binding contract. I adhered to it. Most crew do. BA are making a tidy profit. Ex chief execs (skippy comes to mind ) are sitting on 100k per yr, for life.... and much much more. For 5 or less yrs service. Even the directors that made HUGE errors are still recieving money from BA. Does the BA mgmt try and change their contract?

Gardening leave anyone.?... I wish!
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 4:41 pm
  #250  
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globesurfer, a warm welcome to FT and the BA forum.

And your updates regarding the situation are greatly appreciated. ^
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 4:43 pm
  #251  
 
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Whilst I'm still ranting... as I do. I tried to make an appointment with my manager to explain my reasons for leaving BA after 14 yrs (only sick twice btw) No appts could be found until after I'd handed in my ID card and could not access the building. Quelle surprise!
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 4:52 pm
  #252  
 
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Originally Posted by bernardd
And for those of you that think BA is bad:

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/070117/20070117005730.html?.v=1

You ain't seen nothin' yet....
Oh great.... Does this mean that half of OW will be on strike shortly?

BA - CC dispute
AA - pilot dispute
QF - labour relations due to Mac takeover

I'm sure IB will be soon to follow although I'm sure our Spannish 'friend' will let us know shortly.
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Old Jan 17, 2007, 10:54 pm
  #253  
 
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Can somebody advise me if BA currently has the same number of Cabin Crew on the Upper Deck to take care of 20 Passengers, as they had 10 years ago when there were up to 32 Passengers in the Old Craddle Seats?
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Old Jan 18, 2007, 1:04 am
  #254  
 
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Originally Posted by UncleDude
Can somebody advise me if BA currently has the same number of Cabin Crew on the Upper Deck to take care of 20 Passengers, as they had 10 years ago when there were up to 32 Passengers in the Old Craddle Seats?
Probably. There are still 2 emergency exits up there that need to be manned.

But then, by the tone of your post, this will probably be an inconvenient truth you'll want to overlook.
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Old Jan 18, 2007, 2:17 am
  #255  
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Originally Posted by UncleDude
Can somebody advise me if BA currently has the same number of Cabin Crew on the Upper Deck to take care of 20 Passengers, as they had 10 years ago when there were up to 32 Passengers in the Old Craddle Seats?
Yes there are two. I know that it sounds a lot - extrravagant even but the geography of a 747 rather dictates this. We always had two even when the UD was WT (on an aside I loved the 747 Classic when it was Club World - and it was so small it was only one cabin crew member.

Again I am giving you my opinion - CW is the most lucrative cabin on the aircraft and I think that we should provide a high level of service to that cabin. However we have to be extremely cautious as some of you know - unless you are sitting there we are very cautious of who comes up to that deck. We has the Nairobi incident and then 9/11 and if we only had one person upstairs we have rest periods to cover and we need to monitor every movement. The galley is at the rear of the cabin rather than the front and we are the last barrier before the flight deck door.

I amreading and digesting some of the posts here and whilst I think that some of the comments are more true of European attitudes rather than British - there is at least a grain of truth. Of course everything must move forwards and clearly we have to remain profitable - I as a shareholder applaud that. However, I read here about the expectations that most people seem to have here and you expect a full service from British Airways. Full service can only be provided with proper crewing.

I will say this. Read what Loobtastic has to say. Her story is by no means untypical. Multply that attitude and what do you get. A work force that is prepared to go this route. I am not and will not say whether I agree with this or not as I can see both sides to the story. What I think is a shame is that it ever got here in the first place. When I joined BA from BCAL we thought that we had landed on our feet - so did the Dan Air crowd. What BA offered in comparison with BCAL was a doddle to do. That has changed - some things and people have now long gone and the world has moved on. I am always very leery when people tell me that we are fighting for our "rights". Our "rights" are enshrined in employment and other law. Our terms and conditions are not law unless contract is being breached. Agan my opinion only.

Finally let me comment on the sickness. If you are not well you should not fly. Crew are constatnly changing climates, time zones, different water, food, air and disrputed sleep. It does make you open for everything going. If you deal with sickness with an attitude that the person is pulling a "sickie" every time that they call sick and act as though you think that they are lying then once again you breed resentment. Calling into a company - any company over sickness is a very personal thing. Some people refuse to admit to sickness and carry on. Others sneeze twice and stay off for a week. You all know the sort. All I will say is that I have a letter from my Doctor with which no company can argue - if the Doctor - any Doctor says that you cannot work - that's it - the employer cannot gainsay it. Now this is an occupational hazard - but until someone comes up with a fool proof method of deciding when one is or is not fit for work when the illness is of short duration (a virus say, not real influenza when getting out of bed is not an possibility). If anyone i sick more than anyone feels is reaonable - then they should be referred to a Company Doctor for a proper assessment and that I think is absolutely proper.
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