Global Airlines - a competition for BA?

Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:10 am
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: London
Programs: BAEC Gold, Marriott LT Platinum
Posts: 2,261
Global Airlines - a competition for BA?

Hi All

I randomly met the founder of Global Airlines yesterday at the Dubai Airshow and had a 10min chat with him (coming less from my position as BA frequent flyer but more as an Avgeek).

Actually quite a nice chap to chat with. Key points he makes to take business from BA:

- better service, management to focus on customer service
- in flight crew empowered to make decisions to rectify customer service issues, even if costly
- Champagne in all classes
- inflight bars similar to EK
- J / F product positioned slightly under EK but more competitive price
- flexible rebooking/ inflight changes

He said he can finance the above due to the lower acquisition costs for 380ies. From what I've seen (pure speculation) he seemed to be very well connected to EK HQ so I wouldn't be surprised if they provide brain power/ MRO/ or even further planes once they get their 777-9s. A guy from EK told me some 380 are designated for an 'impressive challenger' in the European market (whatever that might mean).

I found it a bit challenging though that he showed quite a dislike 'for status bragging and cheap Champagne drinking frequent flyers' so I was under the impression he likes to poach regulars BA customers who are just fed up and not the LHR-JFK commuters (which he can't get anyway given frequency).

Overall impression was, pure gut feeling, that Global might work out better than Norse etc and might be a headache for Virgin.
Duck1981 is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:15 am
  #2  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Krakow
Programs: BAEC Silver, Miles and More(FTL), IHG(Platinum), Accor, HHonors(Diamond), SPG, Hertz Five Star
Posts: 5,547
4 A380s , but they talk about operational flexibility?

What routes are they flying?

who are they partnering for feeder flights from non hub airports?

I am sure it will meet a niche but with what, 2000 seats a day if every aircraft is available i doubt it will, at least initially, be much competition to anyone. competition for Virgin maybe once they get a schedule up and running

"short term charter potential " seems to be a possibility for them but any serious schedule service at the moment ??

They have already moved from a "disruptor" 5 classes to a more industry standard 3, i can see more of their promises go the same way

Last edited by scottishpoet; Nov 15, 2023 at 3:26 am
scottishpoet is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:21 am
  #3  
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: UK
Programs: Mucci! And BA Silver – previous awards - Gold 11, Silver 6, Bronze 4
Posts: 3,988
Just had a (very quick) look at their website. No route map? No ability to book a flight? No date for starting operations?

I am sure the chap you met is very impressive, but IMHO there is still a lot of work to do. And then you have to prise people away from a) their corporate deals, b) their favourite FF programmes and c) their budget caps for certain routes.

Not saying it is impossible (look where a certain Irishman ended up after a few years of disrupting the industry).
jamiel and DiamondMile like this.
BA or bust is online now  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:22 am
  #4  
Hilton Contributor BadgeHyatt Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: In the air
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Bonvoy LT Plat, Hilton Diamond, GHA Tit, BA Gold, Turkish Elite
Posts: 8,600
Short answer, no.

Odds of the airline moving from Internet meme to making money have to be pretty low. The business model of "All airlines have got it wrong, what's actually going to be most successful is an anti-LCC with low fares but high costs" coming from an industry outsider is ambitious, to say the least.
EuropeanPete is online now  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:26 am
  #5  
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Scotland
Programs: BAEC - Silver | Hilton Honors - Gold
Posts: 291
I think it will be interesting to see how Global Airlines play out.

I think right now its far too early to say if they will be a challenger for BA.

Having only 4 A380s is risky, as we know the A380 for BA has been beset by problems, after years of storage, however when one goes Tech they have enough operational flexibility to reroute passengers. How will GA cope with one down/maintenance?

Champagne in every class feels really lofty, if they can do it, good for them. However it feels like that is probably going to be beset by issues from the outset.

The routes they are flying are JFK/LAX - two of the most heavily competitive routes out there. I am not sure which London airport they are flying from, something tells me it isnt LHR.

This all being said, if they can pull it off and become a contender in the market, and potentially pick up regional to US routes where BA dont, then they could become a threat to BA/VS.

But that is a long way off
Jambon87 is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:31 am
  #6  
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Yorkshire
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 355
Being a somewhat risk averse leisure traveller (when it comes to long haul at least), I always fear how carriers with a smaller presence can handle IROPS. I appreciate that even the larger carriers can have difficulties but at least with BA etc I think they have much better capability to get you to your destination in the event things go awry.

I had the same doubt last year using Jetblue from LGW to JFK which proved unfounded and I have never had major IROPS on any airline so maybe I should worry less about it.
leelapa likes this.
LBA_flyer is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:36 am
  #7  
 
Join Date: Nov 2023
Programs: British Airways Executive Club | AVIS Preferred | World of Hyatt | Marriott Bonvoy
Posts: 54
Anyone with a tiny bit of experience flying and in the airline industry can see that this is not going to work. A380s are costly aircrafts and they will hardly fill the full cabin all year round. LAX and JFK are also expensive airports to have slots. Plus, they are not going to have a network as extensive as BA with a good reward program, which is the only reason why many fly BA despite the "average" experience.

My take is that if someone wants to run a transatlantic-only operation, it has to be done in a fashion that is similar to JetBlue. Fly cheaper fuel efficient narrow bodies with a good hard product from cheaper airports (e.g., A220 from London City to La Guardia). It's profitable and you can afford to undercut BA or AA.
FlyingSquirrel_ is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:37 am
  #8  
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Scotland
Programs: BAEC - Silver | Hilton Honors - Gold
Posts: 291
Thats true IRROPS happen whether you are a massive legacy carrier or a small regional airline, but its the ability to handle it and recover is what makes it.

Now BA have not covered themselves in glory when it comes to IRROPS, however they have the network/alliance and flexibility to get people where they need to goeventually

A start up with 4 A380s that have been in deep storage going on 4 years..I wish them well
Jambon87 is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:40 am
  #9  
Ambassador, British Airways; FlyerTalk Posting Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Leeds, UK
Programs: BA GGL/CCR, GfL, HH Diamond
Posts: 42,452
4 a380s they can't fly as they don't have an AOC and are years away from getting one. in the first instance they will be wetleasing from HiFly.

i think this will be the first instagram airline.

i doubt BA or any other serious airline is giving this a second thought.
KARFA is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:45 am
  #10  
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Scotland
Programs: BAEC - Silver | Hilton Honors - Gold
Posts: 291
Originally Posted by KARFA
4 a380s they can't fly as they don't have an AOC and are years away from getting one. in the first instance they will be wetleasing from HiFly.

i think this will be the first instagram airline.

i doubt BA or any other serious airline is giving this a second thought.
I dont think BA/VS will be overly concerned, but they will probably try and push them out.

Look at what BA did when Norwegian started flying longhaul from LGW. They actively put aircraft on those routes, undercut them and pushed them out.
BA or bust likes this.
Jambon87 is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 3:48 am
  #11  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: London
Programs: BAEC Gold, Marriott LT Platinum
Posts: 2,261
Originally Posted by Jambon87
I dont think BA/VS will be overly concerned, but they will probably try and push them out.

Look at what BA did when Norwegian started flying longhaul from LGW. They actively put aircraft on those routes, undercut them and pushed them out.
Indeed, even my wife - who is nowhere near to be an avgeek - said BA will bring back 280 returns to JFK which are ideal for a shopping trip
uanj, Lynyrd and leelapa like this.
Duck1981 is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 4:08 am
  #12  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Four Seasons Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA, VS, HH, IHG, MB, MR
Posts: 26,842
There IS massive disruption coming to TATL, but it will come from the A321LR/XLR when production ramps up fully. Cheap(ish) aircraft - with excellent resale value - with a low enough seat count to be viable year round and which can use virtually any UK airport. Suddenly Newcastle to New York is viable, or Belfast etc etc.

It's not coming from Global.
Raffles is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 4:10 am
  #13  
Ambassador, British Airways; FlyerTalk Posting Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Leeds, UK
Programs: BA GGL/CCR, GfL, HH Diamond
Posts: 42,452
Indeed. And I think your article after the launch party summarised all the other challenges ahead too

https://www.headforpoints.com/2023/0...-launch-party/
EuropeanPete likes this.
KARFA is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 4:12 am
  #14  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Mexico
Programs: BAEC Gold / Marriott Platinum
Posts: 3,477
Here is my take on it. Not going to compare to BA, but to wider offerings in the market.

- better service, management to focus on customer service (Ok, nice value proposition, but how much do people really care - Virgin apparently offers a nice focus on CS, but yet people still don't fly them as much due to a restricted number of destinations compared to larger carriers).
- In-flight crew empowered to make decisions to rectify customer service issues, even if costly - this will cost them when people start realizing that kicking up a stink gets them lots of free stuff - just see the "How many avios have you got" thread... It will start with being generous and then when they realize the cost they'll start reigning it in.
- Champagne in all classes - IMO a tacky gimmick and not really much of a differentiator. Sure, not every airline offers fizz in Y, but most offer red/white wine and a range of other drinks many people will prefer.
- inflight bars similar to EK - Doubled-edged sword in my opinion. Yes, it can be nice to sit in a bar, but most people in business seem quite happy with the privacy of a private suite these days. Business people want to work or sleep. I've been on 3 planes with bars now and every single one was empty throughout the flight. That's only my experience of course, but I don't think it's a massive value add if you're trying to operate on routes that have a lot of business traffic, i.e. JFK.
- J / F product positioned slightly under EK but more competitive price - OK, but I assume if you want to compete with EK then you'll need a route network, not just a J/F product. A lot of EK passengers are passing through to other destinations.
- flexible rebooking/ inflight changes - who will they have codeshare agreements with and will these necessarily have the flexibility they want.


My conclusion from this is that they've done a good job of identifying certain pain points, but these are some of the pain points that have existed for a long time and are not easily fixed. Being competitive in the market is not simply about matching a product and offering flexible bookings. While nice propositions, they come at a cost. If flexible rebooking was highly profitable to implement, many airlines would do it. But they won't because they don't want planes going out with too many empty seats and they need to forecast revenue ahead of time. Moreover, while luxury is a nice offering, business travellers need flexibility on timings and routes. What happens if one of these big a380 birds goes tech? How do they shift them to other planes and routes without losing bucket loads of cash.
BA or bust and Duck1981 like this.

Last edited by Prospero; Nov 15, 2023 at 1:36 pm Reason: Convert text colour for dark mode
TTmex is offline  
Old Nov 15, 2023, 4:14 am
  #15  
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,564
Coming from where I am this proposed new airline has serious vibes of Oasis Hong Kong https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oasis_...lines#Services about it (flying a small number of large (old) aircraft on trunks).
percysmith is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.