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-   -   The 2023 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation EC261 / UK261 (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/british-airways-executive-club/2106171-2023-ba-compensation-thread-your-guide-regulation-ec261-uk261.html)

corporate-wage-slave Jun 24, 2023 9:06 am


Originally Posted by Greyraccoon (Post 35358792)
It seemed to be a combination of factors. Boarding started late, no specific reason given for this apart from “the airport is busy this morning”. Baggage arrived at the aircraft late due to a technical issue with baggage handling. On arrival on stand, there was no operator to drive the airbridge. And to top it off, the rear cargo had to be offloaded first due to weight and balance.

The baggage handling may be airport related. I wonder if the crew arrived a little too late? The ground handling and offload is under BA's control. So what this may boil down to is BA's concept of countable minutes. If that baggage handling issue was enough to tip you past the cut off point for the IAH service then EC261 may not be payable, give that the IAH service left a little early today. Technical issues are quite common with baggage systems - belts go down, scanners stop working - and some is under BA's / Menzies control, but the automation side is EDI controlled. Because you were rebooked mid flight that means the LHR end wasn't part of the factor that got you on to the United flight so it's just the EDI time factors. I would certainly apply but because of the short connection then it may be BA won't be paying up here.

Ben_C 44 Jun 24, 2023 5:33 pm

Hi, I was scheduled to fly back from Newark with BA in early June and had several cancellations before getting rebooked on another airline, I was hoping for some thoughts on if I’d be entitled to any compensation. Originally I was scheduled to fly on BA188 on June 6th but this got cancelled far in advance and I rebooked for the following day, for this I understand I’d be entitled to nothing. I rebooked onto BA188 on June 7th which got cancelled around 36 hours in advance I think because my connecting flight to Edinburgh BA1450 the following afternoon June 8th was cancelled (I believe BA188 actually operated). After this cancellation BA automatically rebooked me onto BA180 out of Newark the following morning June 8th, however around an hour after this rebooking then cancelled this flight also. After this I was then rebooked onto BA2272 on June 8th out of JFK to Gatwick but this flight didn’t suit and I called BA and got booked onto the flight that got me home a direct flight from Newark to Edinburgh on United UAL161. I was wondering what people thought about compensation eligibility for this situation? I did apply to BA however in their reply they quoted wrong dates and put the BA180 cancellation on June 8th down to “Aircraft Damage” which I’m skeptical about as the aircraft scheduled from what I could see G-ZBLG operated another flight that same day with no issue. Thanks

dms505 Jun 24, 2023 6:32 pm

Have also had an aircraft damage reason given today to not compensate me for a cancelled flight…feels within BA’s control, no?

corporate-wage-slave Jun 25, 2023 2:55 am


Originally Posted by dms505 (Post 35359915)
Have also had an aircraft damage reason given today to not compensate me for a cancelled flight…feels within BA’s control, no?

The main correct reason for denying compensation here is lightning strike. So if this was during one of the recent stormy days it may be correct. Otherwise, well it depends on the details.

corporate-wage-slave Jun 25, 2023 3:04 am


Originally Posted by Ben_C 44 (Post 35359830)
I did apply to BA however in their reply they quoted wrong dates and put the BA180 cancellation on June 8th down to “Aircraft Damage” which I’m skeptical about as the aircraft scheduled from what I could see G-ZBLG operated another flight that same day with no issue. Thanks

It may be that the customer relations agent had as much problem as I had in trying to unravel all of that (you certainly had a very difficult travel journey here). Ultimately what matters is the flight that you were last booked on relevant to the claim, and the one you ended up using. I think that's BA188 on 7 June versus UA161 on a date that isn't clear, and it depends on original, scheduled and actual arrival time. It may be that you have more than one claim here, at least on paper, but perhaps it's best to treat it as one claim.

Ben_C 44 Jun 25, 2023 7:25 am


Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave (Post 35360512)
It may be that the customer relations agent had as much problem as I had in trying to unravel all of that (you certainly had a very difficult travel journey here). Ultimately what matters is the flight that you were last booked on relevant to the claim, and the one you ended up using. I think that's BA188 on 7 June versus UA161 on a date that isn't clear, and it depends on original, scheduled and actual arrival time. It may be that you have more than one claim here, at least on paper, but perhaps it's best to treat it as one claim.

Thanks and apologies, i missed the date for UAL161 which was June 7th. Would the claim relate to the initial cancellation or the final cancellation? BA180 on June 8th was the last flight to be cancelled so I was working off of the assumption that because I left the day before this flight on UA161 on June 7th (even though that was my original departure date) I would be entitled to claim for this? I’ve already submitted the claim but as you’ve said reading a paragraph with as many cancellations probably caused confusion with the agent.

corporate-wage-slave Jun 25, 2023 8:35 am


Originally Posted by Ben_C 44 (Post 35360869)
Thanks and apologies, i missed the date for UAL161 which was June 7th. Would the claim relate to the initial cancellation or the final cancellation? BA180 on June 8th was the last flight to be cancelled so I was working off of the assumption that because I left the day before this flight on UA161 on June 7th (even though that was my original departure date) I would be entitled to claim for this? I’ve already submitted the claim but as you’ve said reading a paragraph with as many cancellations probably caused confusion with the agent.

That is why it is possible that you have 2 claims here. But ultimately you have to make a claim against a first flight for that claim and a rebooked flight for that claim. The safest is BA188 on 7 June then UA161 on 7 June, and I don't have enough information here, in terms of timing, to say whether it is claimable. If you regard BA180 on 8 June as your start point then you are disregarding the event that led to you being on that flight, and if BA180 did have a legitimate reason for cancellation such as weather then you're a bit stuck. Moreover there is the broad point that after being cancelled off BA188 on 6 June (with proper notice), you ended up with a ticket dated 7 June, and in the final analysis you travelled on 7 June, so that aspect of EC261 was working. If UA161 meant leaving much earlier, and / or arrived into EDI more than 2 hours after the original BA timings then your case is relatively strong.

Ben_C 44 Jun 25, 2023 8:39 am


Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave (Post 35361022)
That is why it is possible that you have 2 claims here. But ultimately you have to make a claim against a first flight for that claim and a rebooked flight for that claim. The safest is BA188 on 7 June then UA161 on 7 June, and I don't have enough information here, in terms of timing, to say whether it is claimable. If you regard BA180 on 8 June as your start point then you are disregarding the event that led to you being on that flight, and if BA180 did have a legitimate reason for cancellation such as weather then you're a bit stuck. Moreover there is the broad point that after being cancelled off BA188 on 6 June (with proper notice), you ended up with a ticket dated 7 June, and in the final analysis you travelled on 7 June, so that aspect of EC261 was working. If UA161 meant leaving much earlier, and / or arrived into EDI more than 2 hours after the original BA timings then your case is relatively strong.

Thanks I’ll take that into consideration in my reply to the claim

Boreas Jun 25, 2023 6:39 pm

Hope this is the right place to put this. Would anyone happen to know the internal reason for the cancellation of the BA1459 EDI LHR on 22nd June? BA are claiming thunderstorms, which is highly suspect because they operated other flights that day as did other airlines. If it is the case, that's a different matter I suppose, but fairly bizarre considering the agent on the phone tried to book me on a flight the same day around the same time, but the ticketing window had just shut. Thank you again.

Boreas Jun 25, 2023 6:45 pm

I abandoned my journey for a refund because the only flights available were the next day, so it was over 5 hours. The train down cost £118.30 however BA are only offering me £75.80 because I've "already received the refund for £42.50" from Reward Flight Saver. Surely that's taking the mickey somewhat - please can someone shed some light on that? The £42.50 was originally my money which I gave to BA...I can see both sides however I feel as if I am being ripped off...

flarmip Jun 25, 2023 8:11 pm


Originally Posted by Boreas (Post 35362311)
I abandoned my journey for a refund because the only flights available were the next day, so it was over 5 hours. The train down cost £118.30 however BA are only offering me £75.80 because I've "already received the refund for £42.50" from Reward Flight Saver. Surely that's taking the mickey somewhat - please can someone shed some light on that? The £42.50 was originally my money which I gave to BA...I can see both sides however I feel as if I am being ripped off...

If you choose to obtain a refund, you relieve BA of their obligation to get you from A to B. Their only liability is to refund you the fare in the way it was paid, i.e. Avios and cash for a redemption.

BA are thus being rather generous in what they've offered - your journey was effectively completely free!

stifle Jun 26, 2023 1:34 am


Originally Posted by Boreas (Post 35362311)
I abandoned my journey for a refund because the only flights available were the next day, so it was over 5 hours. The train down cost £118.30 however BA are only offering me £75.80 because I've "already received the refund for £42.50" from Reward Flight Saver. Surely that's taking the mickey somewhat - please can someone shed some light on that? The £42.50 was originally my money which I gave to BA...I can see both sides however I feel as if I am being ripped off...

Quite the opposite, you've travelled for free. Remember if things had gone to plan you'd be at your destination and without a refund. You're at your destination and also got your money back.

DXB2745 Jun 26, 2023 1:41 am


Originally Posted by Boreas (Post 35362311)
I abandoned my journey for a refund because the only flights available were the next day, so it was over 5 hours. The train down cost £118.30 however BA are only offering me £75.80 because I've "already received the refund for £42.50" from Reward Flight Saver. Surely that's taking the mickey somewhat - please can someone shed some light on that? The £42.50 was originally my money which I gave to BA...I can see both sides however I feel as if I am being ripped off...

how on earth do you feel you are being “ripped off”? Do explain.

You forfeit your rights when you cancel the ticket - which you done. So BA have been very generous in paying the money to make up for the train fare.

what more do you want? You already cancelled the ticket (hence BAs involvement should then stop) but they’ve actually paid for your journey on the train too. So you got from EDI to LDN for free.

Are you looking for compensation as well?

corporate-wage-slave Jun 26, 2023 1:46 am

Yes, the alternative, that the contact agent should have offered (and you could have requested) is that BA can convert a EDI-LHR ticket to an LNER service. These aren't codeshares (unfortunately) but simply replaces the air carrier with the rail company. I have a feeling that being a redemption ticket this isn't possible since redemption ticketing is structured quite differently to commercial. But had the agent converted you from EDI-LHR to EBB-KGX then you would have had your trip without paying anything extra and not got a refund on your redemption. So you're £42.50 up on this. The incentive on BA to have this arrangement is that if everyone is nimble enough then BA doesn't have to give compensation for the delay.

If the service was delayed you have to be incredibly careful / avoid cancelling tickets - you may deprive yourself of compensation and right to care. By all means reach out here if you are unsure of the rules. For a cancellation + refund you may still be entitled to compensation, but 22 June there really was bad weather on that route so I can't see that going anywhere. But you still need to be careful regarding Right to Care.

RichieMc Jun 26, 2023 3:41 am


Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave (Post 35277351)
Yes, if relying on Q v United. There are other CJEU cases where it would imply BA is on the hook, but this is the more recent case.


Originally Posted by RichieMc (Post 35277107)
I look at this thread from time to time, but I can’t claim to have read it in its entirety. Have a question about EC261 relating to delays on US domestic flights at the end of an itinerary starting in Europe on a European carrier. Seen a few people saying they had something like BUD-HEL-DFW on AY then connecting (same ticket) on AA to MCI or something. All AY flights on time, but DFW-MCI gets a 3+ hour delay and they’re getting comp from AA. This seems to go against what is in the first few posts of this thread, specifically post 6 Q3.

There’s also this: https://thepointsguy.com/news/eu-fli...estic-flights/

Any insight or recent experiences? A few weeks ago, I had a GVA-LHR-LAX all on time and BA operated then connecting to LAX-SFO on AS. All one ticket sold by BA. Last flight on AS had a mechanical fault and required an aircraft swap. Ended up 3.5 hours late. Wondering if worth making a claim. As much to satisfy my curiosity as to get the cash.

I've made a few claims here and there with BA over the years They've always been pretty straightforward and I've filed via the website and been approved in a matter of days and paid soon after that. Never needed to use CEDR/MCOL. This one is clearly a bit more complex. I made a complaint via Alaska's website. The eventually came back with a $100 voucher. I pointed out Q vs United but they wouldn't budge. So I'm planning on digging in. Got confirmation from AS this is their final answer. Separately, I tried a normal claim through BA and they quite rightly said it's an AS operated flight (BA codeshare on a BA 125 ticket though) and suggested I contact them.

So my question is how does one go about making such a claim? Using the CEDR form, it seems the only options are BA, Cathay and SAS. And as I understand it, MCOL is for claims against UK businesses. Alaska seems to have an address in Ware, but not sure how helpful that is. Any tips on how to proceed?


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