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Spend-based Avios earning coming to BAEC in 2023

Spend-based Avios earning coming to BAEC in 2023

Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:18 am
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Krisz
Well currently there are fares loaded for LHR-JFK return for 1 (plus surcharge and taxes) according to expert flyer. I would love to see the comments from passengers that you earned a nice 5 Avios for this flight. I know it's a corner case but these kind of cases will be published in the news along the lines that the fat cat bankers are earning 52000 Avios on the same flight. This new system is just wrong in many ways and most of people who doesn't read FlyerTalk or other blogs and publications will just see that they never ever able to get any reward for their flight.
I doubt that carrier imposed surcharges will be excluded from earnings
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:22 am
  #32  
 
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A holiday flight + hotel/car is currently opaquely priced as to the flight and hotel/car component.

Assuming the flight component continues to attract avios, BA will have to disclose unbundled pricing to work out the flight component avios award.
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:22 am
  #33  
 
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Originally Posted by Dave Noble
I doubt that carrier imposed surcharges will be excluded from earnings
Well Iberia currently says net spending not including taxes or fees. so let's see what exactly they mean but I fear it will be base fare value.
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:25 am
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Krisz
Well Iberia currently says net spending not including taxes or fees. so let's see what exactly they mean but I fear it will be base fare value.
surcharges are neither taxes nor fees though. I doubt it will be different to airlines such as AA which count base fare plus surcharges towards earning - or maybe BA will finally get rid of surcharges and actually just have fares
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:26 am
  #35  
 
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First Avios. Next..?
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:27 am
  #36  
 
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Originally Posted by Dave Noble
looking in November , an I fare from London is showing as EUR4200 + surcharge of EUR308 for a total of EUR4508 , on same dates, ex BUD is EUR1639 + surcharge EUR400 for a total of 2039

does it make any sense that the perosn paying 45% of the price gets more TPs and Avios?
Well it depends what you're trying to incentivize. If you're paying 4.5K for a fare, you're a corporate traveller probably. You have a prescribed policy and a prescribed airline, and you don't have a lot of discretion. It doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense to discount more (avios are essentially a discounting mechanism) to get money you were going to get anyway.

On the other hand, if you're looking at cheaper fares - TP runs are an edge case - you're likely to be more sensitive to price variations between carriers. Collecting Avios in that situation might just swing a deal with slightly higher fares and therefore more margin in an increasingly important segment - luxury leisure travel. The only way you make sense of a change like this is by assuming the thing you are trying to grow - revenue and associated margin - is invariant. BA will undoubtably hand out less avios as a result of the change, so it looks great to accountants, but quite likely they'll lose discretionary spend as well. So it's a bit self-defeating.

I doubt many flyers give a tinker's cuss about avios - most people can't redeem them at all, even those of us with a signficant stash find that the value they provide is being squeezed out by high surcharges,. So in that sense this isn't going to irritate a vast number of flyers. But the level of spin applied to make it sound like it's anything less than a devaluation of earnings is supremely annoying.

Tesco moved from loyalty point promotions to discounting, including clubcard prices. That's arguably a decent loyalty strategy which actually does work in terms of providing value to loyal consumers, albeit by competing with front end rather than retrospective discount. The Nectar deal on the other hand, in setting a base price of 0.8p per avios is probably the factor that's screwed the BAEC scheme up, since avios do now have a value where before they were likely to sit in many accounts until they expired.
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:28 am
  #37  
 
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The earning of avios is already spend-based to an extent, with the higher fare buckets being awarded more avios.

I looked at London-JFK return in business using the low fare finder for relatively cheap flights. Half the fare is taxes/charges and would therefore be excluded from the earnings. I am sure there will be multiple fares that are lower than this one as well.

As a Silver, I'd earn 13,832 on these flights currently.
Under this new model, I'd earn 6,699, assuming BA followed the same earning threshold as Iberia. That's well under half.


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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:29 am
  #38  
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Originally Posted by rjn21
A holiday flight + hotel/car is currently opaquely priced as to the flight and hotel/car component.

Assuming the flight component continues to attract avios, BA will have to disclose unbundled pricing to work out the flight component avios award.
Ah, one of lifes little mysteries, which would require BA Holidays to reveal what price deals they have with associated agencies. We have just paid BAH for a private car transfer from HER to our hotel, about 118 each way. Due to disruption, we had to take a taxi for <90! Muddy waters lie within BA Holidays!
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:29 am
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Cw novice
It's interesting though that the subscription Avios service launched will be better for earning Avios than taking a single flight by a factor of 10x

By my calculations a 1700 flight x 8 will earn c15,000 avios. Whilst a c1800 annual subscription will earn 200,000 avios.

Avios can be really handy to have though especially if there's a big event on when cash tickets are eye watering compared to an RFS.

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But you didnt get a flight for your 1800. You did, which I assume was the main purpose of travel, for your 1700
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:37 am
  #40  
 
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Originally Posted by sigma421
They now throw so many Avios around through Nectar, Amex, Barclays the eStote etc. that even as a Silver member flying is a fairly marginal part of how I earn Avios.
some of those options aren't available to people not living / spending money in the UK. I only have Amex.
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:38 am
  #41  
 
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Disappointing. Not terribly surprising, though the unintended consequence of pushing people to partner [marketed] flights does seem to be a very obvious consequence. A win for the OPM flyers most likely, until the OP ask that the cashback M is returned to their pocket rather than that of the employee.
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:46 am
  #42  
 
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Originally Posted by Dave Noble
looking in November , an I fare from London is showing as EUR4200 + surcharge of EUR308 for a total of EUR4508 , on same dates, ex BUD is EUR1639 + surcharge EUR400 for a total of 2039

does it make any sense that the perosn paying 45% of the price gets more TPs and Avios?




Whether it is a devaluation depends on what tyoe of customer you are surely.
Yup, and this devaluation affects both leisure travellers and status holders more.

On our primary route TFS, a return for a GCH currently earns circa 9k Avios on a (R, I) ticket, or 12.75k on a (J,C,D) one.

So you would need to spend 1k+ on R,I { Never happens } or 1.4k+ on J,C,D for it not to be a devaluation. { On that route you may be slightly better off if you take the kids away on the peak flying days over Christmas, but that's pretty much it. }

Last edited by The Geek; Oct 31, 2022 at 11:54 am
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:49 am
  #43  
 
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Originally Posted by Krisz
Well Iberia currently says net spending not including taxes or fees. so let's see what exactly they mean but I fear it will be base fare value.
I'm guessing that this is the case because otherwise it opens up the question of why you earn Avios on taxes and fees on a "paid" flight, but not on an Avios redemption flight. I'd be quite happy to start earning on Avios flights - but I don't see any pigs flying over blue moons at the moment.
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:51 am
  #44  
 
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Originally Posted by Dave Noble
does it make any sense that the perosn paying 45% of the price gets more TPs and Avios?
Yes, since the departing point isn't the same and different markets get different prices. By the way, adding a flight from BUD doesn't increase that much the amount of avios earned...
Also, non UK members have less advantages and they are excluded from a lot of promotions comparing to UK residents.
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Old Oct 31, 2022, 11:59 am
  #45  
 
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Originally Posted by Dave Noble
I doubt that carrier imposed surcharges will be excluded from earnings
Originally Posted by Krisz
Well Iberia currently says net spending not including taxes or fees. so let's see what exactly they mean but I fear it will be base fare value.
Originally Posted by Dave Noble
surcharges are neither taxes nor fees though. I doubt it will be different to airlines such as AA which count base fare plus surcharges towards earning - or maybe BA will finally get rid of surcharges and actually just have fares
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Originally Posted by efincomputer
I'm guessing that this is the case because otherwise it opens up the question of why you earn Avios on taxes and fees on a "paid" flight, but not on an Avios redemption flight. I'd be quite happy to start earning on Avios flights - but I don't see any pigs flying over blue moons at the moment.
Aer Lingus AerClub has been earning Avios per € / / US$ / C$ for a while.

The programme does say that Avios are awarded on the base fare only, however the reality is that Avios land in the account based on all the money paid for the actual airline ticket. This is directly the opposite of what is on their website, but that's how it comes into the accounts and there are no reversals. Since they all use the same system, hopefully they will all arrive the same way. The only things not included, if I recall correctly are seating fees and fees for bags, otherwise the entire cost of the flight ticket including taxes is used for the calculation.
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