Aer Lingus Wetlease

Old Oct 26, 2022, 1:28 pm
  #16  
 
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Ryanair can transfer a significant mass of aircraft to G- though. Then any of their many many UK - Europe flights can freely switch between EI- and G- reg on a day by day basis once they've ensured their domestics and UK-non EU (e.g. Morocco) is covered. EI can't use their G- aircraft on intra-Europe flights so it's rather more limiting
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Old Oct 26, 2022, 2:46 pm
  #17  
 
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Originally Posted by sammyg901
Ryanair can transfer a significant mass of aircraft to G- though. Then any of their many many UK - Europe flights can freely switch between EI- and G- reg on a day by day basis once they've ensured their domestics and UK-non EU (e.g. Morocco) is covered. EI can't use their G- aircraft on intra-Europe flights so it's rather more limiting
These flights are in the EI booking engine as Aer Lingus, Operated by British Airways for Aer Lingus Uk. They are in the booking engine with EI prime numbers, the code for Aer Lingus Uk is EG. Im unsure of teh significant of that or that the agreement appears to end with the change to the summer schedule. I understand the CAA are not happy for EG to operate the route with EI- registered aircraft.

Indeed the need for EG to operate BHD-LHR does give Aer Lingus a few operational headaches.
It is probably not viable for MAN-based EG flight crew to operate a single G-reg short-haul A320 to/from BHD, or they would have done that, surely?.
EI do overnight 1 or 2 A320s at LHR and if they could get agreement with the unions about EG operating some LHR-DUB flights they might be in business as 2 of the 3 LHR-SNN flights are operated as W patterns from DUB, so there is probably enough work for 2-3x A320s for EG at LHR, even if they are limited to operating a portion of DUB and SNN alongside the BHD flights.
To further bulk the operation, EG might feel the desire to explore what European flights they could operate from BHD on their A320s, FAO and AGP were long standing, for example. It is conceivable that EG could have a viable operation for around 4 A320s operating out of LHR and BHD, it would require a certain amount of pragmatism from EI's pilot and cabin crew unions though.
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Old Oct 26, 2022, 3:34 pm
  #18  
 
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Sorry for the dumb question, but is an Aer Lingus flight LHR-BHD cabotage? Or is NI a considered separate country in this case?
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Old Oct 26, 2022, 4:07 pm
  #19  
 
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Originally Posted by pfreet
Sorry for the dumb question, but is an Aer Lingus flight LHR-BHD cabotage? Or is NI a considered separate country in this case?
It wasnt cabotage under EU open skies. It is with hard Brexit. While NI remains in the single market for goods under NI Protocol I dont think it covers services such as air travel.

Originally Posted by BrianDromey
These flights are in the EI booking engine as Aer Lingus, Operated by British Airways for Aer Lingus Uk. They are in the booking engine with EI prime numbers, the code for Aer Lingus Uk is EG. Im unsure of teh significant of that or that the agreement appears to end with the change to the summer schedule. I understand the CAA are not happy for EG to operate the route with EI- registered aircraft.

Indeed the need for EG to operate BHD-LHR does give Aer Lingus a few operational headaches.
It is probably not viable for MAN-based EG flight crew to operate a single G-reg short-haul A320 to/from BHD, or they would have done that, surely?.
EI do overnight 1 or 2 A320s at LHR and if they could get agreement with the unions about EG operating some LHR-DUB flights they might be in business as 2 of the 3 LHR-SNN flights are operated as W patterns from DUB, so there is probably enough work for 2-3x A320s for EG at LHR, even if they are limited to operating a portion of DUB and SNN alongside the BHD flights.
To further bulk the operation, EG might feel the desire to explore what European flights they could operate from BHD on their A320s, FAO and AGP were long standing, for example. It is conceivable that EG could have a viable operation for around 4 A320s operating out of LHR and BHD, it would require a certain amount of pragmatism from EI's pilot and cabin crew unions though.
Some of this would make sense, and would add some critical mass (but also complexity) to Aer Lingus UK.

Both BHD and SNN have lost their flight crew bases and were being operated (by EI) on W patterns via DUB. There was some night stopping of flight crews in BHD, and some ground transfers to and from DUB (only about 90 mins by road). Cabin crew for BHD to date were based at BHD. The dedicated A320 for the BHD LHR shuttle (a genuine shuttle of 3 daily rotations) gets swapped over at LHR with a DUB service to allow for maintenance and rotation.

Its a far cry from past days at BHD with x4 daily LHR and x4 daily LGW (given up as remedy slots as part of IAG buyout, used by FR then dropped), along with the sun routes. The sun routes always did well, though very occasionally the short, wet runway at BHD necessitated a fuel stop. Unfortunately a lot of the winter market from Belfast is bound for the Canaries which arent reachable from BHD and were dropped when EI moved down from BFS in 2012. From BFS they tried European city markets but didnt stick at them, and didnt try again from BHD.

Its possible to see an Aer Lingus UK model as envisaged above with EI giving BHD a go again for more than LHR, and tying up SNN and even LHR DUB might help. While EI regional was down, they used EI mainline A320s on some of the BHD and DUB to GB routes (with BACF taking the thinner routes) and this could be done again to rotate aircraft and crews through MAN if they wanted to use MAN flight crews using both the A321 and A320 alternatively they could use the long haul A321s from MAN on BHD -LHR!!

For those that ask why not turn over BHD LHR to BA completely, bear in mind that EI tend to keep the route flying during IRROPS at LHR, while BA treat the route with only slightly less contempt than their GB routes. EI have saved the day when BA have thrown in the towel countless times (eg snow on the ground) and EI tend to run a punctual operation. While BA have the advantage of dropping PAX into T5 domestic, EI are useful for interlining with Star or Virgin, and have the latest possible departure from LHR given the BHD curfew which benefits day trippers (though they dont have the earliest departure ex BHD in the morning).

Last edited by Prospero; Oct 29, 2022 at 1:50 pm Reason: Combine consecutive posts
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Old Oct 26, 2022, 6:28 pm
  #20  
 
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Originally Posted by BrianDromey
These flights are in the EI booking engine as Aer Lingus, Operated by British Airways for Aer Lingus Uk. They are in the booking engine with EI prime numbers, the code for Aer Lingus Uk is EG. Im unsure of teh significant of that or that the agreement appears to end with the change to the summer schedule. I understand the CAA are not happy for EG to operate the route with EI- registered aircraft
Aer Lingus UK flights to North America ex-MAN are all sold as EI prime flights with EI code not EG (with BA codeshare also as a part of the oneworld transatlantic JV). Commercially, purely from a customers viewpoint, it is the same EI company that is operating the ex-MAN services. It isnt like Iberia Express whereby flights can be bought with an I2 code or an IB code.

The current wet-lease is for 6 months. I suspect this is whilst they figure out and sort out any red tape after which Id expect it to be operated by Aer Lingus UK (for Aer Lingus) going forward.
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Old Oct 26, 2022, 9:06 pm
  #21  
 
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Interlining with Star at LHR T2 has been one of EI's big advantages in my experience. Hope that continues in whatever arrangement this ends up with.
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Old Oct 27, 2022, 5:46 am
  #22  
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It looks as though all Avios availability for the EI flights has now disappeared from BA.com. Is that to be expected with this sort of arrangement?

That's a real shame if so.
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Old Oct 27, 2022, 6:07 am
  #23  
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Originally Posted by JD1905
Could they not have registered the Aircraft with Aer Lingus Regional?
"Aer Lingus Regional" is merely a franchise that is currently held by Emerald Airlines (who only got the franchise just under a year ago after the demise of Stobart).

They operate an all-ATR fleet.

I don't think anyone seriously entertained the idea of re-registering an aircraft and just "giving" it to what is - franchise agreement notwithstanding - a completely separate and unrelated airline, and further an airline that has no history in operating the aircraft type in question (and therefore has no crew who could operate it), to an airport where they have never previously operated (LHR).

If you meant why didn't they just re-register it to Emerald, and continue operating it as if it was Aer Lingus mainline....well, that wouldn't exactly be legal, would it?

Getting BA to perform a wetlease would appear, all round, to be a much more logical solution.
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Old Oct 29, 2022, 1:27 pm
  #24  
 
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G-EUYN positioned into BHD earlier so it must have the honours tomorrow morning.

Presumably BA will use the two night stopping aircraft at BHD to rotate the A320 operating for EI. Removes the need for any towing at the London end?
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Old Oct 29, 2022, 1:43 pm
  #25  
 
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Originally Posted by SHT88T
G-EUYN positioned into BHD earlier so it must have the honours tomorrow morning.

Presumably BA will use the two night stopping aircraft at BHD to rotate the A320 operating for EI. Removes the need for any towing at the London end?
Thats probably the most efficient way to do it. EI had been doing it at LHR T2 by timing their DUB and BHD departures. Since BA and EI aligned their schedules at BHD to avoid running simultaneous services, the night-stop seems like the best option and avoids any problems with late running services during the day.

The only time it will cause problems is during IRROPs when BA op by BA throw in the towel, presuming EI op by EG op by BA inherit the EI tendency to keep flying even with a few snowflakes on the ground.
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Old Nov 1, 2022, 2:31 am
  #26  
 
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Originally Posted by bd95
Thats probably the most efficient way to do it. EI had been doing it at LHR T2 by timing their DUB and BHD departures. Since BA and EI aligned their schedules at BHD to avoid running simultaneous services, the night-stop seems like the best option and avoids any problems with late running services during the day.

The only time it will cause problems is during IRROPs when BA op by BA throw in the towel, presuming EI op by EG op by BA inherit the EI tendency to keep flying even with a few snowflakes on the ground.
As suspected, UUJ and UYN have swapped overnight at BHD. I guess this is confirmation of what was suspected re: aircraft swaps.
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Old Nov 26, 2022, 2:34 pm
  #27  
 
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Originally Posted by SHT88T
As suspected, UUJ and UYN have swapped overnight at BHD. I guess this is confirmation of what was suspected re: aircraft swaps.
This might be the reason why my Saturday evening BA flight to BHD last weekend disembarked at gate 7 rather than using the contact stand at gate 4.
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Old Nov 27, 2022, 7:15 pm
  #28  
 
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My Thursday evening LHR/BHD did the same: disembarked at gate 7. Seemed odd but your suggestion makes sense.
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