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What Is The Matter With This Once Proud Airline??

What Is The Matter With This Once Proud Airline??

Old Mar 22, 22, 6:04 am
  #76  
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Originally Posted by OverTheHorizon View Post
Just to close the loop on this one:

London-bound, the train was more or less equal to plane for comfort (though very busy, barely a free seat), equal for catering, equal on price... in fact, it was so easy we are doing it again in a few weeks
Lancashire-bound, we did miss the CCR (no railway lounge privileges at all on a Standard class Advance ticket !), but again train == plane on comfort, catering and price...

Not a vast difference in time either given we would have had to get to/from MAN, through Security etc.

So our pattern going forward will probably be Lancs->London by train, LHR-MAN by plane, provided that the pricing is broadly comparable and for as long as we retain GGL (just under a year to go...)

I have to say, I had forgotten how nice it is to pull into Euston and walk straight out into the sunshine with our bags Maybe we will do Amsterdam by Eurostar at some point...
Avanti have re-configured one of the F class carriages to "Standard Premium". This doesn't seem to be bookable in advance. On our recent trip from EUS-MAN, it was a god send as Avanti were only running one train per hour (on a Sunday afternoon). We didn't even get charged the upgrade fee.

I tried to get the the bar at one point... no chance. People sitting / blocking the vestibules, and standing in the aisles. We smuggly sat in our seats thinking how lucky we were

Got my money back as well as our original train was cancelled
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Old Mar 22, 22, 7:22 am
  #77  
 
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Logged into my BA account today and realised I have a GUF2 that expires April 1st. Had a check to several destinations I may fly to this year but there was zero F availability. Logged out and couldn't care less about losing the GUF2. Anyway my experience this year with LH/Swiss/Singapore/Qatar has been very good, and I have further flights to Asia with other airlines later this year.

Its is big world out there and my days of being loyal (and I was - BA gold for over 20 years) are pretty much finished, especially to a company who was last competitive in the late 90s.
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Old Mar 22, 22, 7:25 am
  #78  
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Originally Posted by stevie View Post
Logged into my BA account today and realised I have a GUF2 that expires April 1st. Had a check to several destinations I may fly to this year but there was zero F availability. Logged out and couldn't care less about losing the GUF2. Anyway my experience this year with LH/Swiss/Singapore/Qatar has been very good, and I have further flights to Asia with other airlines later this year.

Its is big world out there and my days of being loyal (and I was - BA gold for over 20 years) are pretty much finished, especially to a company who was last competitive in the late 90s.
you should be able to readily get extensions for your GUF if you ask. Extensions in 6 month increments up to 3 years should be fine, and I know at least one person who has had a GUF extended to 4 years.

I think on your broader point, you should distinguish the airline from the FFP. I understand you already prefer other airlines over BA (which is perfectly fine of course), so thats the airline loyalty. On FFP do you think you will use another oneworld FFP going forward instead of BAEC?
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Old Mar 22, 22, 7:59 am
  #79  
 
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Originally Posted by KARFA View Post
you should be able to readily get extensions for your GUF if you ask. Extensions in 6 month increments up to 3 years should be fine, and I know at least one person who has had a GUF extended to 4 years.

I think on your broader point, you should distinguish the airline from the FFP. I understand you already prefer other airlines over BA (which is perfectly fine of course), so thats the airline loyalty. On FFP do you think you will use another oneworld FFP going forward instead of BAEC?
You are perfectly correct in what you say, The exec club over the years has been great value to me, no doubt about it. I guess I am wrestling with the break up with the FFP more than the airline. But since covid I have used other hotels and airlines and not even joined their loyalty clubs.

Can you tell me best way to contact exec club for extension by the way?
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Old Mar 22, 22, 8:13 am
  #80  
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Originally Posted by CPH-Flyer View Post
The last tranches of those loans were repaid in November 2021. What is best, accepting a loan and repaying it (including paying interest) or screwing over staff and passengers long term?
You know and I know that the only reason that LH repaid quickly (and restructured the company which must screw over staff to do so) was so that they were untied from the condition of the loan so that they can get the hands on ITA and their landing slots at Milan. Air France would love to the same but is now having more money put in by the government.

Anyhow I have followed that thread, and it would seem that ground handling and baggage services seem to be the biggest source of complaints. As others have said the value of Collective Memory is not appreciated by companies until it is too late. What none of us were doing was seeing 2 years ago how BA was haemorrhaging cash as they shunted the aircraft hither and yon to park up. I did nit see the balance sheet and nor did anyone ssl,ssmqjq. I wonder what decisions we would have taken especially as we did not know that this would be running for two years.
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Old Mar 22, 22, 8:20 am
  #81  
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Originally Posted by stevie View Post
Can you tell me best way to contact exec club for extension by the way?
I think calling would be fine using your EC phone number. I also think using the online contact form works too for this, but I haven't got personal experience of that so can't confirm.
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Old Mar 22, 22, 8:34 am
  #82  
 
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Originally Posted by binman View Post
There is a highly complex stand planning process but I don't see any sign of it being used as it once was. In particular it is difficult to justify the number of coaching arrivals and departures when the entire 747 fleet has been scrapped and is no longer at LHR. One reason for this may be the need to stand park foreign operators like QR AA etc. This may have been a condition of them moving to T5 and their turnarounds may not fit with the BA model.

Still doesn't explain short haul arriving in B/C and so I suspect that may of the aircraft are indeed idle. It may be easier to park and bus that tow to and from the base. Could be staff shortages and those automated 1 man push back tractors probably don't do base tows.
It's hard to separate anecdotal evidence from cold, hard facts without having a full recap of the stand allocation & usage for the airport in the last few weeks and months, but... it's clear that there are differences. The short haul programme is a lot larger - at least comparatively - vs the long haul one and has been as such for a long while. There's a heap of LGW flights, plus a lot less longhaulers (think the Asian routes).

As a rule, also, BA tows to base only if the turnround time is exceeding 6 hours or thereabouts. Other airlines will only tow to a remote stand in the fuel farm ("T5D"), the only one that went all the way down to BA's base (which is owned by BA and not by HAL) was SAA which used to be charged north of 1m for that each year.

The Mototoks indeed don't have the oomph to do tows, and neither could do it since they need somebody to walk beside them.
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Old Mar 22, 22, 10:42 am
  #83  
 
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Originally Posted by wrp96 View Post
Question: in a situation like this, what does BA mark down as the arrival time? Because if it's considered as when the aircraft reached stand, and not when the passengers actually made it to the terminal, that would add to the frustration.
IIRC from my days working on ACDM, it's an ACARS on chocks/blocks message from the flight deck. Kind of like saying the handbrake is on.

You can't measure arrival time from when the pax enter the terminal - way too many variables!
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Old Mar 22, 22, 1:53 pm
  #84  
 
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Arrival time is calculated when the park brake is set and the engines are turned off. The message is only sent to BA when an aircraft door is opened (passenger or cargo). So in effect, the arrival time can be buffering and the flight is still live until a door is opened. Then the park brake set time is sent to the BA systems and the flight closes.

We (pilots) are supposed to send an additional delay message if there is a wait for stand guidance, steps, buses etc. There is usually a 2 min grace period from when the aircrafts engines are turned off.

Unfortunately its a manual process and I think the data is mainly used to refine resource allocations, investigative work and for de-briefing ops teams rather than forming the basis of any official disembarking time but I stand to be corrected.

OOOI (Out, Off, On, In) times I think are standardised by IATA as universal measurements for the aircraft journey.
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Old Mar 24, 22, 7:55 am
  #85  
 
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Originally Posted by KARFA View Post
you should be able to readily get extensions for your GUF if you ask. Extensions in 6 month increments up to 3 years should be fine, and I know at least one person who has had a GUF extended to 4 years.

I think on your broader point, you should distinguish the airline from the FFP. I understand you already prefer other airlines over BA (which is perfectly fine of course), so thats the airline loyalty. On FFP do you think you will use another oneworld FFP going forward instead of BAEC?
Thanks - I tried.....good luck to you all sticking with this airline it is a shell of what it once was. Life is too short to be loyal to a company.

Hi ....., we extended all unused Gold Upgrade Vouchers by six months in March 2020 and again in October 2020. In February 2021, we added a further 6-month extension to all vouchers that were due to expire before 31 December 2021. We're unable to offer a further extension on these and we're sorry for any disappointment caused. JulieR
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Old Mar 24, 22, 8:17 am
  #86  
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Odd. I havent had one refused yet.

Indeed, I think the sensible advice is you should fly with whichever airline you prefer.
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Old Mar 24, 22, 8:19 am
  #87  
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I had some extended a few weeks ago, though they were earned more recently than implied by that message.
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Old Mar 24, 22, 8:21 am
  #88  
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Originally Posted by stevie View Post
Thanks - I tried.....good luck to you all sticking with this airline it is a shell of what it once was. Life is too short to be loyal to a company.
I see you made a similar comment in a thread you started back in 2013. Which airline have you now decided to fly with?
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Old Mar 24, 22, 8:23 am
  #89  
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Originally Posted by PUCCI GALORE View Post
You know and I know that the only reason that LH repaid quickly (and restructured the company which must screw over staff to do so) was so that they were untied from the condition of the loan so that they can get the hands on ITA and their landing slots at Milan. Air France would love to the same but is now having more money put in by the government.

Anyhow I have followed that thread, and it would seem that ground handling and baggage services seem to be the biggest source of complaints. As others have said the value of Collective Memory is not appreciated by companies until it is too late. What none of us were doing was seeing 2 years ago how BA was haemorrhaging cash as they shunted the aircraft hither and yon to park up. I did nit see the balance sheet and nor did anyone ssl,ssmqjq. I wonder what decisions we would have taken especially as we did not know that this would be running for two years.
Of course the main reason for repaying quicker than needed was to get out of the constraints coming with the loans, the German state owning a significant chunk of the group, and the government interfering in the management of the airline. But the point is that they were capable of repaying the loans, and did not need to destroy their operational capabilities along the way. My memory is that they initially declined a state loan, as they did not want the co-ownership of the German state, but they had to yield as traffic continued to be close to zero. I don't actually recall if BA were offered state guaranteed loans and turned it down or not, but I am sure had they pushed the case BoJo&Co could probably have been reasoned with.

Personally, I would probably not have taken the right (right based on looking back now) steps early on, had I been at the helm of BA or Lufthansa, as I was very much in the doubting camp that this was a long running thing. "by summer, all will be back to normal" was I believe my February catch phrase. The question was more how quickly would I have realised the fact that this was a very much a longer term issue. And there it does seem to me that Lufthansa moved in a better manner than BA. Luck or foresight? Though somehow it could also seem to me that BA saw it as an opportunity to change certain structures, but that opportunity turned in to a pyrrhic victory for them.
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Old Mar 24, 22, 8:27 am
  #90  
 
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Originally Posted by HIDDY View Post
I see you made a similar comment in a thread you started back in 2013. Which airline have you now decided to fly with?
Nothing at all weird or creepy about you searching back 9 years of posts of mine. Actually I find it very sad somebody would waste their time at this.

If you read my previous posts I have broken the habit of 20 odd years and now fly with airlines based upon quality, price, and time table. I no longer am tied to FFP and the fact that a GUF2 extension being refused just confirms this.

Now I hope I have explained myself and will leave you reminisce about days gone by. All the best.
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Last edited by stevie; Mar 24, 22 at 8:54 am
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