Warning flights to Hong Kong
Jun 28, 2021, 8:19 am
#16
Join Date: Mar 2020
Programs: British Airways GGL/CCR, Hilton Diamond & Marriott Gold
Posts: 2,609
Its both
Our rates are up, however we are also leaders globally in sequencing, so yes our knowledge and data points are higher as well.
However, my push back would be (for us at least) who cares about infection rates, what is key is hospital admissions and deaths - thats the negatives associated with Covid.
Thankfully, due to a strong vaccination program we are seeing more of the former and not so much of the latter - however places like HKG, which has only managed Covid due to lockdown and restrictions, its all bad.
Simply put they need to hurry up and vaccinate.
Jun 28, 2021, 8:38 am
#17
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 579
Couldn't agree more with this.
I agree with Portugal's approach of enforcing quarantine for those who are not vaccinated, but HK appears to not be evolving in the way it deals with the pandemic, plus is being unacceptably slow to vaccinate. They should also be incentivising vaccine update through waiving quarantine for vaccinated individuals (and replacing with a test before flights plus 2 & 8 day testing).
I agree with Portugal's approach of enforcing quarantine for those who are not vaccinated, but HK appears to not be evolving in the way it deals with the pandemic, plus is being unacceptably slow to vaccinate. They should also be incentivising vaccine update through waiving quarantine for vaccinated individuals (and replacing with a test before flights plus 2 & 8 day testing).
Jun 28, 2021, 8:40 am
#18
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold / Hilton Diamond / IHG Diamond Ambassador / Marriot Bonvoy Gold
Posts: 2,532
Its both
Our rates are up, however we are also leaders globally in sequencing, so yes our knowledge and data points are higher as well.
However, my push back would be (for us at least) who cares about infection rates, what is key is hospital admissions and deaths - thats the negatives associated with Covid.
Thankfully, due to a strong vaccination program we are seeing more of the former and not so much of the latter - however places like HKG, which has only managed Covid due to lockdown and restrictions, its all bad.
Simply put they need to hurry up and vaccinate.
Our rates are up, however we are also leaders globally in sequencing, so yes our knowledge and data points are higher as well.
However, my push back would be (for us at least) who cares about infection rates, what is key is hospital admissions and deaths - thats the negatives associated with Covid.
Thankfully, due to a strong vaccination program we are seeing more of the former and not so much of the latter - however places like HKG, which has only managed Covid due to lockdown and restrictions, its all bad.
Simply put they need to hurry up and vaccinate.
The sadness is that the UK has wasted its vaccine roll out by allowing the Delta Variant in and then to take off. There are many reasons for this but I think it is clear where the blame for that lies.
Domestically, the low level of hospitalisations and thankfully deaths, means that we might still be able to open up and live our normal lives. That said, there is some concern that schools may still have restrictions in September such is the spread among young people.
Internationally however this is a disaster for travel. The graph shows the dangers of the variant and nation states, particularly with slow vaccine roll outs will rightly in my view take the cautious approach and who can blame them.
Jun 28, 2021, 9:06 am
#19
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: HKG, BHX, MAN
Programs: Qatar Gold (OWS), Asiana Diamond (*G)
Posts: 1,493
Can someone advise what '2 hours in the UK' means - is that 2 hours in the airport, or outside it/through border?
If quarantine is relaxed for certain countries by November, seriously considering working remotely from a third country and transiting via LHR for Hong Kong. Problem is that the connection time could be 9hours.... Happy not to leave the airport and I cetainly won't consider myself having 'been in the UK' if I've just been drinking champers in the lounge for 9 hours.
Also the whole stigma against the UK is now getting rediculous. Delta is only 'more' of a problem here beause we are world leaders in genomic sequencing. What about all the other countries awash with Delta but that just don't know about it....
If quarantine is relaxed for certain countries by November, seriously considering working remotely from a third country and transiting via LHR for Hong Kong. Problem is that the connection time could be 9hours.... Happy not to leave the airport and I cetainly won't consider myself having 'been in the UK' if I've just been drinking champers in the lounge for 9 hours.
Also the whole stigma against the UK is now getting rediculous. Delta is only 'more' of a problem here beause we are world leaders in genomic sequencing. What about all the other countries awash with Delta but that just don't know about it....
Jun 28, 2021, 9:09 am
#20
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: HKG, BHX, MAN
Programs: Qatar Gold (OWS), Asiana Diamond (*G)
Posts: 1,493
Its both
Our rates are up, however we are also leaders globally in sequencing, so yes our knowledge and data points are higher as well.
However, my push back would be (for us at least) who cares about infection rates, what is key is hospital admissions and deaths - thats the negatives associated with Covid.
Thankfully, due to a strong vaccination program we are seeing more of the former and not so much of the latter - however places like HKG, which has only managed Covid due to lockdown and restrictions, its all bad.
Simply put they need to hurry up and vaccinate.
Our rates are up, however we are also leaders globally in sequencing, so yes our knowledge and data points are higher as well.
However, my push back would be (for us at least) who cares about infection rates, what is key is hospital admissions and deaths - thats the negatives associated with Covid.
Thankfully, due to a strong vaccination program we are seeing more of the former and not so much of the latter - however places like HKG, which has only managed Covid due to lockdown and restrictions, its all bad.
Simply put they need to hurry up and vaccinate.
Jun 28, 2021, 9:13 am
#21
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 579
Right, but until you cross a border, you are inherently not 'in' a place.... legally. Although confusingly you can be said to be in UK juristiction the moment you step onto a G-registered aircraft...
What happens if you time a 60m connection and there are delays in departing flight? You are OK to board as you have spent less than 2hrs at time of getting your boarding pass..
Does time in the aircraft on the ground equal time 'in' a place... Is it time from aircraft doors opening?, time from you disembarking, And how do authorities know what time your doors opened, or you left the arriving aircraft....
Basically I'm saying that this '2hr' rule is very grey and open to interpretation/impossible for authorities to robustly check, especially if stated block times of incoming/outgoing flights are within the rules.
Anyway this is a moot point as I won't be booking my autumn 'connecting' itinerary until nearer the time, and assuming the countries I will be coming from will be OK
What happens if you time a 60m connection and there are delays in departing flight? You are OK to board as you have spent less than 2hrs at time of getting your boarding pass..
Does time in the aircraft on the ground equal time 'in' a place... Is it time from aircraft doors opening?, time from you disembarking, And how do authorities know what time your doors opened, or you left the arriving aircraft....
Basically I'm saying that this '2hr' rule is very grey and open to interpretation/impossible for authorities to robustly check, especially if stated block times of incoming/outgoing flights are within the rules.
Anyway this is a moot point as I won't be booking my autumn 'connecting' itinerary until nearer the time, and assuming the countries I will be coming from will be OK
Jun 28, 2021, 9:22 am
#22
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: HKG, BHX, MAN
Programs: Qatar Gold (OWS), Asiana Diamond (*G)
Posts: 1,493
Right, but until you cross a border, you are inherently not 'in' a place.... legally. Although confusingly you can be said to be in UK juristiction the moment you step onto a G-registered aircraft...
What happens if you time a 60m connection and there are delays in departing flight? You are OK to board as you have spent less than 2hrs at time of getting your boarding pass..
Does time in the aircraft on the ground equal time 'in' a place... Is it time from aircraft doors opening?, time from you disembarking, And how do authorities know what time your doors opened, or you left the arriving aircraft....
Basically I'm saying that this '2hr' rule is very grey and open to interpretation/impossible for authorities to robustly check, especially if stated block times of incoming/outgoing flights are within the rules.
Anyway this is a moot point as I won't be booking my autumn 'connecting' itinerary until nearer the time, and assuming the countries I will be coming from will be OK
What happens if you time a 60m connection and there are delays in departing flight? You are OK to board as you have spent less than 2hrs at time of getting your boarding pass..
Does time in the aircraft on the ground equal time 'in' a place... Is it time from aircraft doors opening?, time from you disembarking, And how do authorities know what time your doors opened, or you left the arriving aircraft....
Basically I'm saying that this '2hr' rule is very grey and open to interpretation/impossible for authorities to robustly check, especially if stated block times of incoming/outgoing flights are within the rules.
Anyway this is a moot point as I won't be booking my autumn 'connecting' itinerary until nearer the time, and assuming the countries I will be coming from will be OK
It's counted from the STA of flight 1 to STD of flight 2.
Despite this, it is highly likely that BA will just suspend their LHR-HKG route for pax, like in the past.
Jun 28, 2021, 9:30 am
#23
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: UK
Programs: BA GGL, QR Gold, CX Silver, ITA Executive, TK Elite, Hilton Diamond, Bonvoy Gold
Posts: 62
Right, but until you cross a border, you are inherently not 'in' a place.... legally. Although confusingly you can be said to be in UK juristiction the moment you step onto a G-registered aircraft...
What happens if you time a 60m connection and there are delays in departing flight? You are OK to board as you have spent less than 2hrs at time of getting your boarding pass..
Does time in the aircraft on the ground equal time 'in' a place... Is it time from aircraft doors opening?, time from you disembarking, And how do authorities know what time your doors opened, or you left the arriving aircraft....
Basically I'm saying that this '2hr' rule is very grey and open to interpretation/impossible for authorities to robustly check, especially if stated block times of incoming/outgoing flights are within the rules.
Anyway this is a moot point as I won't be booking my autumn 'connecting' itinerary until nearer the time, and assuming the countries I will be coming from will be OK
What happens if you time a 60m connection and there are delays in departing flight? You are OK to board as you have spent less than 2hrs at time of getting your boarding pass..
Does time in the aircraft on the ground equal time 'in' a place... Is it time from aircraft doors opening?, time from you disembarking, And how do authorities know what time your doors opened, or you left the arriving aircraft....
Basically I'm saying that this '2hr' rule is very grey and open to interpretation/impossible for authorities to robustly check, especially if stated block times of incoming/outgoing flights are within the rules.
Anyway this is a moot point as I won't be booking my autumn 'connecting' itinerary until nearer the time, and assuming the countries I will be coming from will be OK
Correct me if I am wrong, IIRC, earlier in 2021, I have asked the immigration department about the 2-hour rule and they mentioned it being the "ticketed time", ie, scheduled arrival/ departure time. They also said the 2-hour rule applied to transit as well because the pax will have been "in contact" with the people from the UK no matter whether you are landside or airside.
Back in March 2020, I flew back to Hong Kong via Germany (at that time it is not required for UK arrivals to quarantine, but yes for EU countries) and during the immigration process, I was basically told the same thing about transit means in contact with the locals = you have "technically" been to the place.
Jun 28, 2021, 9:34 am
#24
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 579
Both the UK and HK count transits as 'being' in a place, unless you remain on the plane and no new pax get on (tech stops).
It's counted from the STA of flight 1 to STD of flight 2.
Despite this, it is highly likely that BA will just suspend their LHR-HKG route for pax, like in the past.
It's counted from the STA of flight 1 to STD of flight 2.
Despite this, it is highly likely that BA will just suspend their LHR-HKG route for pax, like in the past.
Jun 28, 2021, 9:40 am
#25
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London
Programs: Mucci. Nothing else matters.
Posts: 38,644
Jun 28, 2021, 10:01 am
#26
Join Date: Mar 2020
Programs: British Airways GGL/CCR, Hilton Diamond & Marriott Gold
Posts: 2,609
the BAEC police, you loose status and the lounge dragons kick you out....
Last edited by PGberkshire; Jun 28, 2021 at 11:17 am
Jun 28, 2021, 10:28 am
#27
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 579
However if I arrive at T5 withou a visa, I can be refused entry to the country and deported with no rights to appeal (as opposed to having those rights the moment I go landside....
And if I buy something I don't have to pay VAT....
Jun 28, 2021, 10:47 am
#28
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London
Programs: Mucci. Nothing else matters.
Posts: 38,644
Similarly, Hong Kong's rules are entitled to treat you as being "in" the UK even if you are only in direct airside transit at Heathrow, as well as making allowances for how the time spent "in" the UK is to be calculated.
Jun 29, 2021, 9:59 am
#29
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 579
I'm basically assuming that the UK ban will last as long as last time (6 months), and that my planned (already rescheduled) F 2-4-1 Nov 50% off flight will be junked (hope they open up new F availiability come November as there is currently nothing to move any cancelled flights to)
I was actually hoping HKG would move towards exemptions for vaccinated travellers, especially with the recent dowgrading of the risk from the UK was optomistic that things were going in a slow but positive direction. Now its going in the opposite direction.
Given we in the UK are heading towards full vaccination, as well as further unlocking on 19 Jul, COVID will become an endemic (but hopefully low) risk but UK will never have zero COVID. Given this, will we ever be allowed to travel to Hong Kong again?
I was actually hoping HKG would move towards exemptions for vaccinated travellers, especially with the recent dowgrading of the risk from the UK was optomistic that things were going in a slow but positive direction. Now its going in the opposite direction.
Given we in the UK are heading towards full vaccination, as well as further unlocking on 19 Jul, COVID will become an endemic (but hopefully low) risk but UK will never have zero COVID. Given this, will we ever be allowed to travel to Hong Kong again?
Jun 29, 2021, 11:49 am
#30
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: ±38,000 feet
Programs: LH HON, BA GGL, AF Plat, EK Plat
Posts: 6,428
I'm basically assuming that the UK ban will last as long as last time (6 months), and that my planned (already rescheduled) F 2-4-1 Nov 50% off flight will be junked (hope they open up new F availiability come November as there is currently nothing to move any cancelled flights to)
I was actually hoping HKG would move towards exemptions for vaccinated travellers, especially with the recent dowgrading of the risk from the UK was optomistic that things were going in a slow but positive direction. Now its going in the opposite direction.
Given we in the UK are heading towards full vaccination, as well as further unlocking on 19 Jul, COVID will become an endemic (but hopefully low) risk but UK will never have zero COVID. Given this, will we ever be allowed to travel to Hong Kong again?
I was actually hoping HKG would move towards exemptions for vaccinated travellers, especially with the recent dowgrading of the risk from the UK was optomistic that things were going in a slow but positive direction. Now its going in the opposite direction.
Given we in the UK are heading towards full vaccination, as well as further unlocking on 19 Jul, COVID will become an endemic (but hopefully low) risk but UK will never have zero COVID. Given this, will we ever be allowed to travel to Hong Kong again?
