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Why fly BA at the moment in Club, when Swiss offer all of this?

Why fly BA at the moment in Club, when Swiss offer all of this?

Old Sep 2, 20, 12:56 am
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Mikey Mike Mike View Post
Its great that Lufty, Virgin and Swiss (and I'm sure others) are back to full service which demonstrates there is NO justification for BA to continue to use CoVid as a lame excuse for saving money. In economy, the irony of food and drink being scrapped, moving to BOB, and now back to handing out snacks and water is not lost on me. I'm assuming when service is back to the new normal, the freebies go, and back to BOB. You win some, you lose some!!

I cant say whether its the same at their hubs, so theres a massive caveat behind whats coming, but if you assess the total package then there are equally areas where LH, and *A generally, are behind BA. I came through LHR T2 on Monday morning, for a LO flight to WAW in Y.

Fast Track security is still closed, yet T2 is probably still carrying as many passengers as T5. BA has reopened the First Wing, which it funds.

The LH lounge is the only airline one open in the terminal, albeit only the business section - the Senator bit at the back is closed. Based on what Id read about the levels of on-board service LH was offering I had hoped their lounge provision might also be a cut above - but it was a pretty dire experience with only pre-packaged sandwiches on white bread, the most laughable excuse for a salad I think Ive ever seen (judge for yourself from the pic), and a very limited drink selection.

It strikes me that theres only a limited amount of money airlines have to throw around. BA has chosen to put that towards building a better airport and lounge experience, although it needs to extend that further outside LHR. LH and LX seem to feel theyre more likely to attract passengers by having an improved on-board offering.

Theres probably not a right answer, it might even be country driven in terms of expectations, but for anyone travelling in Y - as many of us are for intra-Europe, always have - then personally Id say theres more value from the BA proposition at the moment.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 1:32 am
  #32  
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Originally Posted by 1Aturnleft View Post
The pictures look lovely I agree and the two are definitely miles apart in terms of offering but neither of the sectors taken NCE-ZRH or ZRH-DUB are in comparison with BA - neither sectors are in competition with BA.
Why? Has BA become Ryanair and reverted to only selling point to point tickets? BA, like all other European careers achieve a very significant part of their income from connecting traffic, not least long haul connecting traffic in premium classes. Indeed, like all other European airlines, they need that traffic to survive, and incidentally, they need it to be able to offer London-based people a great wealth of long haul routes, a majority of which would simply not be sustainable (except perhaps as low cost) without connecting traffic. Try and run a DFW-LHR or KUL-LHR with no connecting traffic on either side and I suspect you'll soon give up.

So in many ways, the comments of those saying - in short - "do you really expect me to fly via Zurich for my London-Nice (or London to Dublin) because of a chicken dinner?" are both correct and largely irrelevant. For those, the competition is essentially BA or U2 or FR (EI if you think of it as competition, but that's a bit like are you buying a Renault or a Nissan where you think you are making a choice but it is all going into the same company's account in the end), and if BA, whether they will fool you into spending a bit of extra money to upsell to CE (which is, precisely, a cabin which is overwhelmingly here for long haul connecting traffic in the first place, so upselling a "dry" LHR-DUB for even 20 is largely pure bonus for BA).

I do fly plenty of London-Nice and Dublin-London, and quite frankly, BA couldn't care less about what I think of their service there (nor could I ever be bothered to waste my money on CE on either route). But conversely, I do fly plenty of Nice-LA and Dublin-Singapore and the likes, and there, BA knows perfectly well that they are in direct competition with LX and a number of others, and I do buy most of those in J. Flight times are largely comparable (in fact, LX is typically quite a bit faster because of more efficient connections in ZRH and far fewer occurrences of security rescreening), prices typically are too, and so the difference will be largely made on those peripheral issues such as frequent flyer programme, seat comfort, food and drinks quality and so on.

So I guess that there is very much competition but it is just a matter of understanding which market it pertains to. If, for instance, I put my frequent London-Nice hat on, then my opinion on the LX food offering is about as relevant as surveying a catholic convent as to what's the best brand of condoms. By contrast, when I wear my long haul J (and more rarely long haul F) connecting passenger on, then I am right in the target group for that sort of question, and yes, in those cases, the F&B matters.

PS: in terms of those making broader points about LH group being heads and shoulders above in terms of F&B, I'll incidentally have to respectfully disagree. LH C catering on short flights can be absolutely dismal IMHO, and that is not covid dependent.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 1:41 am
  #33  
 
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Originally Posted by Mikey Mike Mike View Post
Its great that Lufty, Virgin and Swiss (and I'm sure others) are back to full service which demonstrates there is NO justification for BA to continue to use CoVid as a lame excuse for saving money.
'
Virgin arent serving alcohol onboard at the moment so no full service there yet.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 2:16 am
  #34  
 
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Originally Posted by L1705 View Post
Virgin arent serving alcohol onboard at the moment so no full service there yet.
I think Virgin are serving limited alcohol in Upper although the point I think is that theyve made their intentions clear from September onwards to restore an almost entirely full service in all cabins.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 4:54 am
  #35  
 
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Originally Posted by L1705 View Post
Virgin aren’t serving alcohol onboard at the moment so no full service there yet.

Incorrect information, I flew in from Hong Kong Monday and they do indeed serve alcohol in all classes , also they serve hot meals in all cabins as well as snacks throughout the flight, and a 2nd meal before landing, so if you prefer a cold sandwich , book BA!
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Old Sep 2, 20, 5:04 am
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Neil Jones View Post
Incorrect information, I flew in from Hong Kong Monday and they do indeed serve alcohol in all classes , also they serve hot meals in all cabins as well as snacks throughout the flight, and a 2nd meal before landing, so if you prefer a cold sandwich , book BA!
Welcome to Flyertalk and the BA Forum Neil Jones! Make yourself at ease and hope you find the place enjoyable and interesting!
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Old Sep 2, 20, 5:21 am
  #37  
 
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Originally Posted by orbitmic View Post
Welcome to Flyertalk and the BA Forum Neil Jones! Make yourself at ease and hope you find the place enjoyable and interesting!

Thanks
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Old Sep 2, 20, 5:29 am
  #38  
 
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Flew CZ to PRG recently as BA only offering odd days service (or something). After a pretty delicious Starter salad plus chicken brochettes I settled down, to be interrupted by a CC holding the 'hot course'. She was astounded I didn't want it, having mentally finished a perfectly large meal. Overkill on a 90 minute flight, but it did make me wonder about whether I should put up with the chicken a coleslaw sandwiches any more.

The OP makes a fair point. I appreciate that BA have been trying to cut costs, but as a BAEC Gold until mid '22 and with no need to accrue TPs I am being tempted by others based on convenience, and in some instances the F&B is better. It is sometimes worse, and I quite like the food box for its simplicity and presentation. But it is always the same sandwiches and it is probably time to review it as more of us are travelling.

Although BA 's network in Europe (where I do most of my travelling) is great, *A is equally good, on current schedules, and I am now wondering whether I should aim for status there. BA also need to balance their perceived dominance on SH ops with LCC competitors. My flight last week with EZY was on a new and fresh plane with the same (row 12+, or wherever the threshold is on the NEOs) seats, and I seriously did wonder - with no lounge service in outposts, and limited lounge need in the UK due to minimising airport time - whether I too am a victim of Stockholm syndrome. Whilst there is a combination of loyalty, familiarity, service, kudos and safety that keeps me a loyal BAEC member and regular BA flyer since lockdown was lifted, that will not last forever and BA do need to carefully consider what they have to lose by no offering their usual service, as well as what they can gain (or not lose).
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Old Sep 2, 20, 5:48 am
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Prospero View Post

Swiss received a CHF 1.5 billion emergency loan from the Swiss Government so understandably feels less inclined to constrain its costs to the same degree BA is doing
Ah! Now that does paint a different story - when you have 1.5 Billion to get you by that does mean that you can afford to be a bit lavish even if it is with taxpayers money. What I love is the completely unlevel playing field - AF has had a fortune thrown at it by the French government. About Lufthansa I do not know (or particularly care as I am vowed to a life Lufthansa free), but IAG have not taken any government loans. However it seems that the EU rules on state airlines are ignored when it suits.

All that said, the present state of affairs is simply not viable and it needs to be addressed pronto. Whilst I stay a regular customer due to the fact that for me travelling ALC - ZRH - LHR. In fact, I cannot as LX appear not to fly here. From VLC, the cheapest J class seat was 500 which is a lot more money for a flight with connections. I'm afraid that it takes more than an airline hot plate to justify that difference.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 6:06 am
  #40  
 
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Deleted - my brain isnt working today.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 6:21 am
  #41  
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It is fair to point out that BA secured funds of 300m through the UK government’s Covid Corporate Financing Facility. This is a 12 month loan so needs to be repaid by April or May next year. BA has also mortgaged 48 aircraft to the tune of US $750m which is repayable by May 2021. Liquidity is everything right now and during the dark months ahead I think it is inevitable many airlines will run dangerously short of cash.
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Last edited by Prospero; Sep 2, 20 at 6:27 am
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Old Sep 2, 20, 6:51 am
  #42  
 
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Originally Posted by PUCCI GALORE View Post
Ah! Now that does paint a different story - when you have 1.5 Billion to get you by that does mean that you can afford to be a bit lavish even if it is with taxpayers money. What I love is the completely unlevel playing field - AF has had a fortune thrown at it by the French government. About Lufthansa I do not know (or particularly care as I am vowed to a life Lufthansa free), but IAG have not taken any government loans. However it seems that the EU rules on state airlines are ignored when it suits.

All that said, the present state of affairs is simply not viable and it needs to be addressed pronto. Whilst I stay a regular customer due to the fact that for me travelling ALC - ZRH - LHR. In fact, I cannot as LX appear not to fly here. From VLC, the cheapest J class seat was 500 which is a lot more money for a flight with connections. I'm afraid that it takes more than an airline hot plate to justify that difference.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 8:29 am
  #43  
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The major US airlines have realized that they have to give up something to entice travellers back. They already allowed frequent flyers and business class passengers to obtain seat assignments without charge at time of booking, something that BA does not do (but ought to do), so they have just announced that change fees are permanently scrapped. Some are also offering free standby in the near future.

BA needs to drop its complacent stance and join the real world. Dropping additional fees is one way, the soft product is another. In the present climate, both are necessary.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 8:46 am
  #44  
 
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Originally Posted by cvm0093 View Post
*A Airlines are a bit different in service stanards, they've always had a very interesting entry criteria for sure which makes them a step above the rest. When I used to work for them that is, since a recent airline joined I've questioned it completley haha (cringe) Ultimatley you could say the soft service is the icing on the cake and that's probably what swayed you.

I don't mean this in a bad way I saw it before at BA too excellent service, well polished etc but since mixed fleet came in and longhaul went out the window on top the new CC that are taking over the skies, modern day people are very awkward especially in Britain compared to before and I think it just reflects in our flag carrier in a nut shell as well the UK is our homebase. On top of the pressure to minimise costs obviously making our flag carrier a laughing stock dosen't help when it's meant to be a legacy airline.

Hey ho that's the world BA just bear the brunt. Money speaks louder sadly!
I hear so much bad stuff about Lufthansa though, that it seems on-par with BA and not leagues above. Not sure if af/klm is much better either. Greener pastures or something.
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Old Sep 2, 20, 9:32 am
  #45  
 
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Originally Posted by Neil Jones View Post
Incorrect information, I flew in from Hong Kong Monday and they do indeed serve alcohol in all classes , also they serve hot meals in all cabins as well as snacks throughout the flight, and a 2nd meal before landing, so if you prefer a cold sandwich , book BA!
Their website says differently, but I stand corrected.

This is the point though... book what suits you. If you want a hot meal then book with an airline that provides one. However Ive read multiple reasons other than catering that people choose BA
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