Any right to cancel for reduced service?
Jun 4, 2020, 4:02 pm
#31
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: BAEC Gold, EK Skywards (enhanced Blue !), Oman Air Sindbad Gold
Posts: 6,399
I don’t think too many BA regulars would be overly-surprised to see the bold section incorporated as a new mandatory clause, appearing in the form of a ‘tick-box‘ acceptance, just before payment / confirmation for any online bookings. If it does happen, I hope BA at least credit you appropriately.
Jun 4, 2020, 4:26 pm
#32
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,581
Of course they are complementary - that doesn't mean that they are complimentary and have no value that can be assigned to them
Jun 4, 2020, 4:48 pm
#33
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Vancouver
Programs: AB BA Waterloo Mama Mia
Posts: 1,147
I personally am devastated. We have our first and only F ever lined up that we have saved up for to HND in early September for our 10 year couples anniversary. All my optimism has dried up as we cannot see any chance service will be back to ‘as we booked it’ service by then. We paid Ł7k for our flights, which is a lot for a couple of us in our 20s.
I am really disappointed in BA, who have offered us no flexibility thus far even though their ridiculous online change fee calculator says we could change without penalty. It’s not that we don’t want to go, but we want the full service and for that we can wait until next year. I don’t need a refund, I will always want to go to Japan. I feel awfully penalised for booking flights in advance as a loyal BA customer, and will fight them on this if it’s not back to normal and we have no other options even though it seems pointless. We luckily paid on Amex (which we immediately paid off) so we have some backing, but we have realistically spent a lot of money on something I doubt we will have. My only outpost is the FCO advice, but by then I imagine BA will still be shafting customers but their advice will comprise of an ‘air bridge’ with Japan who have largely got it under control. Sad, as the 14 hour flight is a huge part of our holiday for an aviation fanatic and a scared flier.
I am really disappointed in BA, who have offered us no flexibility thus far even though their ridiculous online change fee calculator says we could change without penalty. It’s not that we don’t want to go, but we want the full service and for that we can wait until next year. I don’t need a refund, I will always want to go to Japan. I feel awfully penalised for booking flights in advance as a loyal BA customer, and will fight them on this if it’s not back to normal and we have no other options even though it seems pointless. We luckily paid on Amex (which we immediately paid off) so we have some backing, but we have realistically spent a lot of money on something I doubt we will have. My only outpost is the FCO advice, but by then I imagine BA will still be shafting customers but their advice will comprise of an ‘air bridge’ with Japan who have largely got it under control. Sad, as the 14 hour flight is a huge part of our holiday for an aviation fanatic and a scared flier.
Jun 4, 2020, 10:32 pm
#34
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Tokyo
Programs: Bonvoy LT Titanium ANA Diamond
Posts: 763
Jun 5, 2020, 12:35 am
#35
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UK
Programs: Tufty Club (Gold), BAGA Gymnastics level 4, 440yds swimming certificate
Posts: 2,533
I think it’s already covered by that universal get out clause of “operational reasons” they rely on so heavily
Jun 5, 2020, 1:32 am
#36
Join Date: Sep 2019
Programs: Finnair
Posts: 1
Sure, I appreciate anything subjective couldn't be argued, but even today their description of First says it includes all of the following, none of which is being provided:
(can't post URL as I'm too new, but it's britishairways -dot - com/en-gb/information/travel-classes/first/first)
This isn't some disagreement about a quality of wine, it's fundamental parts of their offering and the experience I purchased not being delivered.
I'm not really keen to accept a downgrade, because I'm not desparate to take the vacation right now and would prefer to do it when more normality returns - this applies to both the travel and destination aspects.
(can't post URL as I'm too new, but it's britishairways -dot - com/en-gb/information/travel-classes/first/first)
- From your own stylish suite, to exclusive access to spa treatments, fast-track security, and excellent service, it’s the finest way to travel.
- Delicious, indulgent fine dining with exclusively designed crockery, cutlery and glassware from the finest British designers, William Edwards, Studio William and Dartington
- Access to luxurious lounges and spa treatments
- Priority boarding, straight from an exclusive First lounge
- We've worked with some of the world's top chefs and British designers to bring you the full restaurant experience at 35,000 feet.
- Luxury meals including a new delicious ŕ la carte menu, plus a range of lighter options that focus on fresh seasonal ingredients of British provenance
- New signature afternoon tea service, showcasing the great British tradition of high tea. The menu will include a selection of sandwiches, delicate pastries and scones, as well as a wide range of tea infusions
- A wide selection of Champagnes, wines, spirits, and non-alcoholic drinks
- Flexibility to order whenever suits you best
- Indulge in a luxury complimentary massage or facial treatment, with acclaimed British spa and skincare brand Elemis
This isn't some disagreement about a quality of wine, it's fundamental parts of their offering and the experience I purchased not being delivered.
I'm not really keen to accept a downgrade, because I'm not desparate to take the vacation right now and would prefer to do it when more normality returns - this applies to both the travel and destination aspects.
I wish you the best in navigating this. Regardless of what BA says, I maintain that a court of law may side with you as a fundamental breach. Paying economy and not getting a service I paid for is one thing ie not fundamental. Paying a fare that is significantly higher for the benefits you are not receiving (other than a seat etc and use of a washroom) is in my opinion. As stressful as this is, hang in there.
But what does it really mean if you are "downgraded"? Just the seat/cabin or the whole experience incl. all the meals, drinks, lounges + all other First class services? Obviously, if you paid forFirst, you must get everything promised by BA at the moment of the payment. Does somebody know, if there is any previous legal case available?
Jun 5, 2020, 3:23 am
#37
Join Date: Jan 2018
Programs: BA Silver
Posts: 439
I’d be surprised if there wasn’t a good chunk of the J/F service back by August/September. If we continue the path we’re on with this virus, we’re winning the fight and US airlines are already providing full service to my knowledge.
BA will have to simply from a competition standpoint. As being predicted far more optimistically now, there is the case for summer travel, particularly in the later summer months.
BA will have to simply from a competition standpoint. As being predicted far more optimistically now, there is the case for summer travel, particularly in the later summer months.
Jun 5, 2020, 3:46 am
#38
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rhineland-Palatinate
Programs: *A Gold (A3), HHonor Gold
Posts: 5,693
If BA were threatened with court would they refund just to avoid setting losing and setting a precedent?
From a moral and non legal view, it seems very fair to be able to demand a refund for anything above WTP, especially when airlines such as QR keep things as normal for the most part. This isn’t just a small adjustment, they have taken a wrecking ball to the everything they boat of providing.
From a moral and non legal view, it seems very fair to be able to demand a refund for anything above WTP, especially when airlines such as QR keep things as normal for the most part. This isn’t just a small adjustment, they have taken a wrecking ball to the everything they boat of providing.
Jun 5, 2020, 4:57 am
#40
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rhineland-Palatinate
Programs: *A Gold (A3), HHonor Gold
Posts: 5,693
Exactly my point, how does the service impact the contamination chain ? The remaining passengers testing negative are in quarantine for 7 days. If a significant amount get positive at the end of the period, then there is something to look at.
Jun 5, 2020, 5:50 am
#41
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Vancouver
Programs: AB BA Waterloo Mama Mia
Posts: 1,147
Downgraded flights - new rules on reimbursement. cws but update as this is 2016
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/26864509-post636.html
have a look at this. adjust to the current situation, suggest to BA what it owes you and take it from there. One can wait and let others blaze the trail or jump in and see what happens yourself. Always some risk both ways.
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/26864509-post636.html
have a look at this. adjust to the current situation, suggest to BA what it owes you and take it from there. One can wait and let others blaze the trail or jump in and see what happens yourself. Always some risk both ways.
Jun 5, 2020, 7:16 am
#42
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: BAEC Gold, EK Skywards (enhanced Blue !), Oman Air Sindbad Gold
Posts: 6,399
...................
I have been reading the information BA has released around their 'return to the skies'. This outlines significantly restricted service offerings on flights.
I booked my flight outbound in First, returning in Business as much for the flight experience as for the destination. I chose that class of travel based on the advertised amenities and benefits in that class of travel - the meal service, the alcohol served, the on-board service, the lounge experience, etc.
With the COVID-19 restrictions almost all my reasons for booking that class are no longer being provided (no premium meal, no alcohol, no first lounge, no business lounges, greatly reduced on-board service). As such the flight offered no longer reflects the flight I booked at a significant premium cost.
...........
I have been reading the information BA has released around their 'return to the skies'. This outlines significantly restricted service offerings on flights.
I booked my flight outbound in First, returning in Business as much for the flight experience as for the destination. I chose that class of travel based on the advertised amenities and benefits in that class of travel - the meal service, the alcohol served, the on-board service, the lounge experience, etc.
With the COVID-19 restrictions almost all my reasons for booking that class are no longer being provided (no premium meal, no alcohol, no first lounge, no business lounges, greatly reduced on-board service). As such the flight offered no longer reflects the flight I booked at a significant premium cost.
...........
At the risk of depressing you yet further - but in the interests of quoting some specific precedents, I can reference the reaction by BA to other FT-ers who felt that key elements of the F class product they had paid for were simply not delivered.
In one case, the passenger - FT-er gillestarek - had already travelled, and so subsequently appealed to BA for some form of compensation. He was offered nothing ; and, even after following up twice, the answer was still NO.
Another passenger - drakepassage - requested a partial refund of the ticket cost before the flight, but this was also rejected. drakepassage then reported that s/he had written formally to BA stating that “as the service will not be provided as described, I am cancelling the contract and expect a full refund”. The FT-er went on to say (not as part of that letter, but within the post) that “my preference was for a small (maybe circa 20%) refund of the ticket price and retain my ticket but this was refused”. On this, I cannot seem to find any follow-up info or end result.
Finally - a (ever-so-slightly !) more positive result : this one, from FT-er escape2sun, who travelled to CPT with his wife, and reported as follows : “After the meal on our F-flight from Cape Town, I contacted Customer Service, and uploaded pictures of the meal, today, both Mrs E2S were given 5,000 Avios each for Service Recovery. Not brilliant, but better that the No's reported earlier”
So ... there you go ..... not a very pretty picture but a couple of documented data points which may - or may not !!?? - be of some help / interest to you.
Jun 5, 2020, 7:21 am
#43
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: UK
Posts: 264
I was due to fliy first to Dallas (actually TXL - LHR - DFW). I received an email stating that the flight was cancelled. Further notes within the email stated that I had been rescheduled (to another flight on the same date). Whe I checked the details on BA.com, the return flights DFW - LHR and LHR - TXL were the ones shown as cancelled (but already rescheduled) and the outbound LHR - DFW, although described as cancelled, was shown as a downgrade to Biz class.
After hearing the news of the downgrade in services onboard, we really didn't want to travel anyway, as the only reason for selecting that particular flight combination was to travel and experience First class. So, we just asked for a refund and the returned monies are already credited to my credit card statement. We did consider rebooking for a future date but we couldn't guarantee our availability before April 2021 and so we were better off with a refund.
Others will have to make their own decision but for us, we really don't want to fly a premium cabin with BA in the short or medium terms.
After hearing the news of the downgrade in services onboard, we really didn't want to travel anyway, as the only reason for selecting that particular flight combination was to travel and experience First class. So, we just asked for a refund and the returned monies are already credited to my credit card statement. We did consider rebooking for a future date but we couldn't guarantee our availability before April 2021 and so we were better off with a refund.
Others will have to make their own decision but for us, we really don't want to fly a premium cabin with BA in the short or medium terms.