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BA to cut up to 12,000 jobs in "restructuring and redundancy programme"

BA to cut up to 12,000 jobs in "restructuring and redundancy programme"

Old Jun 10, 2020, 3:55 am
  #1561  
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Originally Posted by delores
But not all CEOs are the same. As we are discussing aviation here, you only have to look at what other airlines are doing.
There are ways I just think you are too blind to see the alternatives and are naive about WW intentions.
I am quite accustomed to living in the real world, thank you.
Well, how do you know what WWs intentions are if the CC unions will not sit down and discuss what might be actually be on offer, not just focus on his opening stance which is exactly the same hard-nosed refusal by the unions to even engage unless their demands are met?

That is the real world
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:06 am
  #1562  
 
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Originally Posted by JFX1764
By negotiating, BALPA have managed to at least win and enhanced voluntary redundancy package, preferential terms and arrangements for those who wish to take up the armed forces support scheme and other external job opportunities.
Indeed they did but crucially they did not, at the time, have the dreaded fire and rehire clause hanging over them...but they do now!

My understanding from previous posts is that VR and cushioning pay is now on offer to CC but not sure about other staff groups. If correct then this was done without any negotiation between the 2 parties so not sure if BALPA did better or not. Hopefully, if the above is correct, then its prepared the way for a meaningful discussion between BA and TU.

Finally, as I mentioned before, I worked at BA under many CEOs during some difficult times..Gulf War, 9/11 etc etc. WW really takes the biscuit. Very definitely his way or no way. Autocratic in extreme and holds a grudge..hence his behaviour right now.
Regards staff as assets that you sweat until you can get no more out of them then dispose of them.
I get that CEOs need to be tough and resilient but they need to be ethical too
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:07 am
  #1563  
 
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Originally Posted by BOH
No but I am of the belief that over time, history has shown striking rarely achieves the goal the strikers are aiming for. History is littered with companies where the end game was simply fewer jobs or total closure of their industry because they became uncompetitive and did not react to a changing market and competition.
True. On the other hand, history has shown that companies are becoming ruthless, offering less payment and benefits while they are making huge profits and giving bonuses and dividends. Now back to reality, do you actually believe that BA has decided to remove 2 days of annual leave for CC because it fights to survive?

Do not take me wrong, someone has to do the job (defend the undefendable ie BA current position) but our heads do not zip at the back. BA found the perfect time to smash and grab whatever they can in the name of COVID 19.

So far we had:
A) awfull meal service on all classes
B) anti consumer terms and conditions to US and Canada customers which is btw against DOT
C) smash and grab approach to the staff. You will agree to whatever BA says or you are fired

What we see here is the true colours of BA. As someone perfeclty mentioned above, BA is not really an airline but mostly a money making machine that could not care less about staff or customer.
Extremely sad and worrying.
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:08 am
  #1564  
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Originally Posted by BOH
...the CC unions will not sit down and discuss what might be actually be on offer...
What is the source for this information?
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:11 am
  #1565  
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Originally Posted by secretplantofightinflation
There is a genuine undercurrent of nastiness in this thread, and it is sad to see.
Respectfully I would agree with you, maybe from a number of stances too? I detect a degree of nastiness in the direction of any poster who does not agree that BA are 100% wrong, or that WW is a bully, anyone who suggests that change might just be necessary and pretty much at everyone who does not 100% support the BA staff position.

It really does not seem to be one way, hopefully we can all see that everyone is entitled to an opinion and that this is an internet chat forum specifically related to matters with BA - therefore a healthy debate is to be promoted and that just might mean there are people on here with different views.
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:13 am
  #1566  
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Originally Posted by richardwft
What is the source for this information?
Seriously?
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:15 am
  #1567  
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Originally Posted by BOH
Seriously?
A little bit of description of your sources would be useful.
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:20 am
  #1568  
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Originally Posted by peter h
Do you see teachers striking in the summer holidays, or air traffic controllers choosing a quiet weekend in January to work to rule?
Are there any specific examples you can give though of a recent strike in the UK (say last 10 years) where a concession has actually been extracted from the employer as a result? Where the concession outweighed the loss of employees pay during the strike?

Teachers are really not relevant because it is not in a competitive market and when was the last ATC strike in this country and what did the strikers manage to get?
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:23 am
  #1569  
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Originally Posted by richardwft
A little bit of description of your sources would be useful.
I think the onus is rather on you, given that both commie Len has publicly said they will not sit down and negotiate until S188s are withdrawn and WW stated two days ago in an interview that they are willing so sit down and negotiate but the union is refusing to. McCluskey (or any union rep) has not refuted that...unless you know otherwise?
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:23 am
  #1570  
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Originally Posted by BOH
...Teachers are really not relevant because it is not in a competitive market...
A Maths or Physics teacher may disagree with you there.
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:25 am
  #1571  
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Originally Posted by BOH
... commie Len has publicly said they will not sit down and negotiate until S188s are withdrawn...
Who is commie Len?
When did they publicly say that?
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:26 am
  #1572  
 
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Originally Posted by OhLordy
Indeed they did but crucially they did not, at the time, have the dreaded fire and rehire clause hanging over them...but they do now!
And BALPA (currently, while upset) still negociating and accept that compulsary redundancy will be required.

Originally Posted by OhLordy
My understanding from previous posts is that VR and cushioning pay is now on offer to CC but not sure about other staff groups. If correct then this was done without any negotiation between the 2 parties so not sure if BALPA did better or not. Hopefully, if the above is correct, then it’s prepared the way for a meaningful discussion between BA and TU.
Good point, I'm not caught up on the latest CC discussions, but BA are essentially negotiating with many crew (and staff in other areas) who either aren't in a union or are ignoring the union's stance of don’t get involved.

Last edited by JFX1764; Jun 10, 2020 at 4:32 am
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:34 am
  #1573  
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Originally Posted by richardwft
A Maths or Physics teacher may disagree with you there.
...that would be fine if they did, disagreement is allowed. Primary and secondary education is an essential and state funded (and that funding will never be completely withdrawn) and does not have true competition in the sense that a private businesses does with paying customers who can take their business elsewhere. At the uni level, sure there is competition but again it is a relatively protected market with the fees set by central government. Quite different to an airline model
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:37 am
  #1574  
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Originally Posted by richardwft
Who is commie Len?
When did they publicly say that?
I would respectfully suggest you take a read of the bio of a certain union leader and catch up on some current affairs programs of the last 2-3 weeks. A more healthy and informed debate will undoubtedly result
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Old Jun 10, 2020, 4:38 am
  #1575  
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Originally Posted by richardwft
Who is commie Len?
When did they publicly say that?
have a read of the thread. Unite are refusing to talk until BA stop the clock on the s188 period. Unite have also raised a legal challenge.



https://www.ft.com/content/bfc32ac1-...6-384d881d5b98
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