Fatdickie

Was on a full flight back from AGP to LGW yesterday afternoon at 15.55.

Almost all of the over wing exit row seats were booked by elderly people on a SAGA holiday. Several had mobility problems, at least 3 hard of hearing and oblivious to the extra safety talk directed to them by cabin crew prior to take off.

They were happily discussing the £30 extra they had paid the SAGA booking agent for the premium seats, but moaning that they didn't get premium check in and boarding 😂

Do they not have to ensure that those seated in exit rows are fit and able to receive instructions from cabin crew and assist in case of an emergecy.

Is this something that travel agents like SAGA manage to bypass?

bavarian1992

Without wanting to stir anything up and without commenting on the individuals mentioned in Post 1:

In order to sit in an exit row, you have to be able to assist in emergency situations, ie. lift an emergency door that weighs approximately 20kg. Not everyone can do that, and ergo, not everyone can/should sit in an emergency exit row.

To look at both sides of the argument: Overwhelming chances are nothing will happen, so who cares.

Fatdickie

I too was in an exit row seat and assisted one of the gentlemen to put his cases in the overhead locker. He was going to wait for the cabin crew to put it up for him.
When I offered to assist him (as he was standing In the aisle blocking the other passengers from boarding with his cases on the seat) , he totally misheard and at first was slightly aggressive until I explained for the third time that I was offering to assist him.
Then throughout the safety demonstation his head was buried in his newspaper totally oblivious that the cabin crew were addressing the 12 passengers seated in over wing exit seating

I wrongly or rightly made the assumption that he would not be much help in a smoke filled cabin, should the situation emerge.
​​​

Dave Noble

If concerned, did you raise this with the cabin crew at time of flight?

dougzz

Has anyone ever had CC intervene if they have raised concerns about passengers in EE rows? Not that I’m on a plane every week but it seems to me CC don’t care who sits there. I gauge how much the airline cares by whether the EE row is 2mm or 3mm wider than the other rows.

Sam Bee

Sadly in the rush to profit from emergency exit seats it falls on the cabin crew to ensure that people sitting there can operate the seats and I fear they may not be as rigid as they should be (or have the time to be).

Obviously before they could be 'sold' check in staff would allocate the seats after giving punters the one over to check they at least look physically able and are not drunk..

Wouldn't put this on Saga. Also I suspect those doors are bloody heavy, and a lot of people who assume they could open them couldn't....

Vinotraveller

I witnessed an incident on a GLA-LCY last year where a guy in crutches had booked himself into 2C on an Embraer 190 which is an exit row. He was almost offloaded as he became aggressive and refused to comply with the CC request for him to move to empty 2B due to safety regulations (the usual "I always sit here when I fly" line from him). The Pilot backed up the CC and the guy moved seats (which had the bonus of meaning I had an empty seat beside me as I was in 2D). So it does go to show that some CC do try and enforce the rules.

lhrsfo

On several other airlines, the briefing by the CC is much more intensive and personal. Pretty well all other airlines brief each row individually, and require all seated in that row to put down whatever they are reading and pay attention. One recently (I can't remember which) then concluded by asking each passenger individually if they had understood (the answer had to be "yes") and if they had any further questions ("no"). Without the answers, it was clear we would be going nowhere. Of course, just like all security questions, many people will simply say what they need to say without taking it in, but that sort of procedure would at least have stopped the SAGA crowd.

Separately, I understand that the SAGA age limit is now 50 and I would hope that nearly all 50 year olds, and indeed 60 year olds, would be capable of operating the emergency exits. Each year, the old seem to be getting younger.

RollAnotherFatOne

We live in a society and corporate world where confrontation and conflict are seen in a dramatically negative context.
But this should not be a problem in all scenarios. This is not meant on a slight at BA, but many companies talk the talk and just don't act.
It falls upon responsibly minded individuals to put forward their ideas against this background of negativity and poor support (where they are seen as the bad guys), when 80% of people know 'what makes sense'. Unfortunately, we are governed by a moronic 20%, including at my company where if you speak out you are seen as the problem. Such irony.

GateLouse2

Last week on a domestic Brazilian LATAM flight, the CC stopped me from sitting in my allocated exit row seat - even though I am physically fit and only marginally over 60, it appears LATAM rigidly enforce a "no over 60" policy for exit row seats.

Globaliser

And all at awkward heights and angles that would give the HSE a fit if manual handling rules had to be applied. I suspect that the best thing that can be said for the exercise is that when it's needed, it's powered by adrenalin.

Often1

As usual on FT, these things devolve into a debate about whether there ought to be a law (rule) rather than what the law is. The law is quite clear and it is that BA provides that information prominently and in plain English:

In the unlikely event of an evacuation we will expect you to assist in the opening of the emergency door. For this reason you must be a non-disabled person (12 years and over) in full fitness and able to understand printed or verbal instructions given in English. You must be willing, as well as able, to assist in the case of an emergency evacuation. When requesting an exit row seat we will ask you to verify you meet these requirements.

It is for BA staff to determine whether a passenger may not fit the criteria and that should be done, in the first instance at check-in or the gate and, in the final instance, by cabin crew. If you as another passenger have reason to believe that an exit row passenger does not meet the safety criteria, you should report that concern immediately to the cabin crew and, if necessary ask that the Captain become involved.

While one could certainly report all of this to BA after the fact, it was OP's own safety which was compromised and the time to act was during the boarding process. Remember that age is not the determinant. Rather it is physical capability to manipulate the heavy exit door, physical capability to hear, and the ability to communicate in English.

The suggestion that things rarely go wrong is absurd. Safety is about zero tolerance for deviation from safety standards. It is why there are so few fatal accidents these days. Cabin pressurization failures are rare too. Should BA then get rid of the backup emergency oxygen system?

T8191

May one chip in from the older (75-yo) end of this debate?

* My travel insurance comes bundled with my premium bank account. I have never been asked medical questions, although I think I’m supposed to tell them if anything significant has changed.
* I have what is known in medical circles as a ‘dodgy back’. I’m quite sure that manipulating the over-wing exit would regenerate my ‘issue’ and have me hobbling for a few days.
* My hearing is not what it used to be, with sibilants and the awful ‘loud-distorted’ cabin announcements being particularly troublesome [usually worst from the flight deck].

Over the years I have evolved several solutions to these problems.

* I do not travel with heavy carry-on luggage, as that is what the aircraft hold is provided for.
* I avoid over-wing exit rows by only travelling in CE/CW.
* I always travel with my wife, who acts as my hearing-support person.

One hopes that contributes something, although one is not sure what, as one has forgotten the question.

Uncle T

A P Yu

The crew would normally intervene if they were NEXT to the Exit - but often if they are in the middle or aisle seats of an EXIT ROW then they'd be allowed to stay there, so long as the person at the Exit was clearly fit and able.

By the time the AGP pax had got to the Seats both the Check in agents and the Gate Staff have confirmed they are fit and able to it there, the cabin crew would be a third line of defence.

Trident 3B

As quoted " After all, we are only talking about "opening a door", not bench-pressing 100 kilos." End quote.

"We are only talking about opening a door" is complete nonsense. You do not "open" the exit hatch, you physically remove it and then place it such that it does not impede egress through said emergency exit. If the pax in question cannot lift a 10kg bag into the overhead locker without assistance then that alone is sufficient grounds for them to be removed from the exit row. Secondly if said pax cannot hear and/or understand someone who is standing next to him when the cabin is relatively quiet (IE during boarding) what chance would they have of understanding, comprehending and acting descisively on crew instructions in the chaos, bedlam and volume of noise during a genuine emergency with a smoke filled cabin.