When does EF info become irrelevant?

Old Jan 21, 20, 5:10 pm
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When does EF info become irrelevant?

Hi there,

I'm on a 241 from LHR to JFK next Tues (16.20 flight). At present EF is showing F2, A1 and the seat map is showing 3 seats unallocated and 1 seat in row 1 blocked rather than occupied.

My Q is - sorry if this is stupid! - at what point with EF info not be as up to date as the final sales for the flight? If, for example, me or my companion were to get bumped at check-in, what EF info offer me an insight into true loads there and then on my mobile phone? Or, if the worst happen, help me out in asking to get moved to the 5.05pm flight of EF shows F avails?

Thanks in advance for your help. I've made the leap to an EF yearly subscription but I'm still learning how to use it and how 'realtime' the data is.

Maggie
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Old Jan 21, 20, 6:34 pm
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as far as i know the info in EF is always "current", Certainly in terms of the seat map if i change seat 55 minutes before departure the change shows in EF immediately. There is no direct link between the number of seats BA is willing to sell to the number of seats actually available.
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Old Jan 21, 20, 7:14 pm
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Originally Posted by scottishpoet View Post
as far as i know the info in EF is always "current", Certainly in terms of the seat map if i change seat 55 minutes before departure the change shows in EF immediately. There is no direct link between the number of seats BA is willing to sell to the number of seats actually available.
I would refine this as "there IS a strong correlation between number of seats BA is willing to sell, but it is NOT an accurate representation of how many seats are still available".

tb
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Old Jan 21, 20, 8:18 pm
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When we've made seat changes it's always real-time. Very useful in blocked seats senario 72 hours out.

Edit . The number of seats they are willing to sell does help give an indication in the load, but its also complicated by the point of sale issue I believe
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Last edited by crazyarmadillo; Jan 21, 20 at 8:47 pm
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Old Jan 22, 20, 6:24 am
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Originally Posted by maggieholls View Post
I'm on a 241 from LHR to JFK next Tues (16.20 flight). At present EF is showing F2, A1 and the seat map is showing 3 seats unallocated and 1 seat in row 1 blocked rather than occupied.

My Q is - sorry if this is stupid! - at what point with EF info not be as up to date as the final sales for the flight? If, for example, me or my companion were to get bumped at check-in, what EF info offer me an insight into true loads there and then on my mobile phone? Or, if the worst happen, help me out in asking to get moved to the 5.05pm flight of EF shows F avails?
If you get bumped at 1600 (gate closing time), then EF's published availability information for the 1705 flight will still be accurate. Your problem is that published F cabin availability does not necessarily equate to space that can be used for you, or or to space that will be made available to you. In theory, published F cabin availability does not necessarily even equate to there being any space in the F cabin at all (although the FT view is that BA will usually only overbook the F cabin by one). So don't regard EF numbers as gospel, only as a rough guide.
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Old Jan 22, 20, 7:22 am
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however if at 1600 the seat map on EF for the 17:05 shows seats available in F then there a strong possibility nobody booked on the 17:05 will check in and take them by the time check in closes...

Bumped at check in is, fortunately, very rare. In over 30 years of flying it has not, yet. happened to me.

More chance of a flight being cancelled!!
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Old Jan 22, 20, 7:56 am
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1. I'm assuming you're not BA Gold or OneWorld Emerald - row 1 seat that's blocked is probably available to golds - or to anyone at check-in.

2. EF info is always up-to-date but it's almost meaningless in isolation.

3. F passengers don't have to pay for seat selecction so tend to choose in advance, although that is not universal.

4. With four seats not currently allocated, and F2 then all we can say is:
- BA is willing to sell at least two F seats;
- BA rarely if ever overbooks by 2 or more;
- BA therefore presumably has at least one unsold, unallocated seat on that flight.

5. As an F passenger, I guess you've chosen your seats already so those are in addition to the ones you have. (Although with a discrepancy of 4 seats unassigned and at only 2 available to buy, there must be someone who hasn't chosen — unless BA has deliberately heavily oversold the business cabin and is expecting to upgrade 2 travellers to First, which seems less likely).

6. If you are downgraded, BA will be delighted to reaccommodate you on the 1705 if there is any space. ExpertFlyer or none, they would do that for you anyway.

7. I'd echo the extreme rarity of involuntary downgrades in addition.

In other words, right now, there is nothing you can or should do, nor would I expect anything to change between now and your flight. The only thing I would do in your situation is choose a seat if you haven't already, and then enjoy the anticipation.
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Old Jan 23, 20, 1:22 am
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Originally Posted by Cymro View Post
1. I'm assuming you're not BA Gold or OneWorld Emerald - row 1 seat that's blocked is probably available to golds - or to anyone at check-in.

2. EF info is always up-to-date but it's almost meaningless in isolation.

3. F passengers don't have to pay for seat selecction so tend to choose in advance, although that is not universal.

4. With four seats not currently allocated, and F2 then all we can say is:
- BA is willing to sell at least two F seats;
- BA rarely if ever overbooks by 2 or more;
- BA therefore presumably has at least one unsold, unallocated seat on that flight.

5. As an F passenger, I guess you've chosen your seats already so those are in addition to the ones you have. (Although with a discrepancy of 4 seats unassigned and at only 2 available to buy, there must be someone who hasn't chosen — unless BA has deliberately heavily oversold the business cabin and is expecting to upgrade 2 travellers to First, which seems less likely).

6. If you are downgraded, BA will be delighted to reaccommodate you on the 1705 if there is any space. ExpertFlyer or none, they would do that for you anyway.

7. I'd echo the extreme rarity of involuntary downgrades in addition.

In other words, right now, there is nothing you can or should do, nor would I expect anything to change between now and your flight. The only thing I would do in your situation is choose a seat if you haven't already, and then enjoy the anticipation.
Thanks Cymro. I'm a lowly Silver. I'm using an Amex 241 voucher (my voucher, my husband as my companion). My paranoia stems for reading all the horror stories about 241s (at the very least the companion) being first on the hit list should bumping be required.

We've chosen our seats, will check-in online ASAP once open and be at the airport early. Crossing my fingers we make it to the lounge and will then be crossing everything we don't hear our names/get separated/bumped at the gate.

When I first got my black AMEX I was thrilled at the idea of the companion voucher 'benefit'. Now I'm not so sure! Will report back on my fate once sealed.
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Old Jan 23, 20, 2:00 am
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If it helps, We have used four or five 241 vouchers with absolutely no problem so hopefully your trip is the same. In the grand scheme of things this kind of thing seems to be extremely rare.
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Old Jan 23, 20, 2:24 am
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Originally Posted by maggieholls View Post
Thanks Cymro. I'm a lowly Silver. I'm using an Amex 241 voucher (my voucher, my husband as my companion). My paranoia stems for reading all the horror stories about 241s ......
Read this one instead:

No problems with a 2-4-1

It's far far more likely to represent what will actually happen.
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Old Jan 23, 20, 2:37 am
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Originally Posted by maggieholls View Post
When I first got my black AMEX I was thrilled at the idea of the companion voucher 'benefit'.
For a moment I was thinking you're refering to having an AMEX Centurion card, but quickly remembered the BA AMEX is also black. You see, usually the expression "black AMEX" is used specifically for the Centurion.
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Old Jan 23, 20, 3:02 am
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Originally Posted by LBA_flyer View Post
If it helps, We have used four or five 241 vouchers with absolutely no problem so hopefully your trip is the same. In the grand scheme of things this kind of thing seems to be extremely rare.
Hope so!
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Old Jan 23, 20, 3:03 am
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Originally Posted by Flying Yazata View Post
For a moment I was thinking you're refering to having an AMEX Centurion card, but quickly remembered the BA AMEX is also black. You see, usually the expression "black AMEX" is used specifically for the Centurion.
HaHa - wish I was special enough for that card!
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Old Jan 23, 20, 3:13 am
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Originally Posted by maggieholls View Post
HaHa - wish I was special enough for that card!
No need to be special (as with all these various shiny cards)...just need cash to burn.

tb
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Old Jan 23, 20, 4:09 am
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Originally Posted by maggieholls View Post
My paranoia stems for reading all the horror stories about 241s (at the very least the companion) being first on the hit list should bumping be required.
That sort of thing isn't going to be solved by EF, and it's a disproportionate since you are vastly more likely to miss your flight due to problems getting to the airport. Looking at the numbers you are as good as zero chance of being downgraded, about 1 or 2 lucky CW passengers will be upgraded to First (if they can't be persuaded to pay for it). What you could do is arrive at T5 around 12:45 hrs since the 13:55 is wide open at the moment despite being G-RAES (presumably), the 8 seater First 777. Just 2 seats taken at the moment. But even that is an excess of caution.

The shroud waving by some entities about downgrading 2-4-1 is frankly a disgrace.
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