Finding seats in P (or any other class)

Old Yesterday, 12:02 pm
  #1  
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Finding seats in P (or any other class)

Hi everyone,

Over the past 6 months I've started flying for work, and have heavily geeked out on flyertalk to try and become a 'master of points(..)'!

I've amassed quite a few avios now, and given I'm useless with scheduling planned personal trips, I instead fancied making my work trips a little more enjoyable by changing a few JFK > LHR red-eyes to Biz from Prem. However, my current ticket is seat type T, and I need to cash-upgrade it to P in order to upgrade with Avios.

Everything I can see when looking manually on the BA site and calling up is W (Fully Flex), resulting in an excess of £1500 - obviously not worth it. However, I've been told that if I can change the seat to a P, on a plane with a Biz redemption, I can switch, pay for the P upgrade, then do a biz redemption, then switch it back to the date I desire, with it keeping the biz redemption (assuming the flight has a biz redemption seat available).

So. My challenge now is finding a P seat on a flight with Biz Redemption. I have ExpertFlyer, but although it's giving me supposed flights with P seats open, when I call to check with BA they aren't seeing those seats so I'm not sure EF is accurate.

Has anyone done something similar, or can suggest a route to identify P seats?

Thanks in advance!
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Old Yesterday, 12:06 pm
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Originally Posted by jjLDNY View Post
However, my current ticket is seat type T, and I need to cash-upgrade it to P in order to upgrade with Avios.
P class is mostly used by BA for award seats in World Traveller Plus (premium economy). The only way of which I have heard for cash upgrading into P class is if you take a special offer upgrade (Proactive Online Upgrade or POUG) to upgrade from economy to WT+. That puts you into P class. And AIUI once you have done that, you cannot upgrade using Avios from P class into Club World (business class).

There are no cash fares filed for P class, so you cannot change from T class to P class using cash. P class is generally regarded as "below" T class in the hierarchy anyway because it is an award class.

In other words, I suspect that you may have been misinformed.
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Old Yesterday, 12:08 pm
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T, like all publicly available WTP tickets, is upgradeable; P is an AA fare class for cash tickets and a BA fare class for award tickets in the premium economy cabin. Are you on a BA or an AA booking?
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Old Yesterday, 12:11 pm
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Originally Posted by Cymro View Post
T, like all publicly available WTP tickets, is upgradeable; P is an AA fare class for cash tickets and a BA fare class for award tickets in the premium economy cabin. Are you on a BA or an AA booking?
BA. And yes that what I thought, as far as I was aware only the lower Econ tickets required a paid upgrade to use avios redemption upgrades. However I spoke to 2 people on BA G line today, both telling me I needed a P class to upgrade. Were both incorrect?
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Old Yesterday, 12:12 pm
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Originally Posted by Globaliser View Post
P class is mostly used by BA for award seats in World Traveller Plus (premium economy). The only way of which I have heard for cash upgrading into P class is if you take a special offer upgrade (Proactive Online Upgrade or POUG) to upgrade from economy to WT+. That puts you into P class. And AIUI once you have done that, you cannot upgrade using Avios from P class into Club World (business class).

There are no cash fares filed for P class, so you cannot change from T class to P class using cash. P class is generally regarded as "below" T class in the hierarchy anyway because it is an award class.

In other words, I suspect that you may have been misinformed.
Yes I read this, and I don't understand how it could be a requirement to be in P class to use an avios redemption if you can only end up in it AFTER using one from Econ, meaning you can't go any higher anyway. Very confused really.
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Old Yesterday, 12:14 pm
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Originally Posted by jjLDNY View Post
BA. And yes that what I thought, as far as I was aware only the lower Econ tickets required a paid upgrade to use avios redemption upgrades. However I spoke to 2 people on BA G line today, both telling me I needed a P class to upgrade. Were both incorrect?
That sounds like a misunderstanding, them thinking you wanted to upgrade into WTP, and there needing to be P availability.
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Old Yesterday, 12:14 pm
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Originally Posted by jjLDNY View Post
BA. And yes that what I thought, as far as I was aware only the lower Econ tickets required a paid upgrade to use avios redemption upgrades. However I spoke to 2 people on BA G line today, both telling me I needed a P class to upgrade. Were both incorrect?
Do you have a BA-issued (125-) ticket for a BA code on a BA aircraft?

Something must have gone wrong in communication somewhere, because you can upgrade pretty much all T class cash tickets to CW, so long as there is award availability in CW (U class).
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Old Yesterday, 12:16 pm
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Originally Posted by jjLDNY View Post
BA. And yes that what I thought, as far as I was aware only the lower Econ tickets required a paid upgrade to use avios redemption upgrades. However I spoke to 2 people on BA G line today, both telling me I needed a P class to upgrade. Were both incorrect?
Yes I think so.

If you have a BA ticket booked into World Traveller Plus and you want to upgrade to Club World with Avios you need redemption availability in Club World (this is U class).
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Old Yesterday, 12:22 pm
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I've even checked to see if BA has somehow started selling P class as a revenue bucket, and they're not.
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Old Yesterday, 3:46 pm
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P class the redemption class of wtp any wtp class can be upgraded with avios to upgrade with avios to club you need U availability the class that is sold of avios redemptions
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Old Yesterday, 6:32 pm
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Update for everyone who was following. This was indeed possible, the gentleman I spoke to who's name began with R was very good, and instead of dismissing me this time noted the series of steps I needed him to perform, rather than repeating "not possible".

So, background again for those curious.
  1. Current flight on Friday in a T seat (WTP) - let's call it flight 1
  2. Want to change to Saturday flight U seat (CW) - let's call this flight 3
  3. No T seats available on flight 3, meaning I have do find ANOTHER flight with T (WTP) seats, and U (CW) seats available - let's call this flight 2
So, I had to change to flight 2, to avoid moving into a W (fully flex) seat on flight 3 that I actually wanted which would have cost ALOT
Then, I had to upgrade to a CW U seat on that same flight
Then, I could change it back to the Saturday flight that I wanted

Total cost, £500 & 24k avios
Total cost if I would have moved direct to W on flight 3, then upgraded, £1500 for W seat + then £200 or so tax & 24k avios

And now, I am in the new CWS
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Old Today, 3:21 am
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Originally Posted by jjLDNY View Post
Over the past 6 months I've started flying for work, and have heavily geeked out on flyertalk to try and become a 'master of points(..)'!

I've amassed quite a few avios now, and given I'm useless with scheduling planned personal trips, I instead fancied making my work trips a little more enjoyable by changing a few JFK > LHR red-eyes to Biz from Prem. However, my current ticket is seat type T, and I need to cash-upgrade it to P in order to upgrade with Avios.

Everything I can see when looking manually on the BA site and calling up is W (Fully Flex), resulting in an excess of £1500 - obviously not worth it. However, I've been told that if I can change the seat to a P, on a plane with a Biz redemption, I can switch, pay for the P upgrade, then do a biz redemption, then switch it back to the date I desire, with it keeping the biz redemption (assuming the flight has a biz redemption seat available).

So. My challenge now is finding a P seat on a flight with Biz Redemption. I have ExpertFlyer, but although it's giving me supposed flights with P seats open, when I call to check with BA they aren't seeing those seats so I'm not sure EF is accurate.

Has anyone done something similar, or can suggest a route to identify P seats?
Originally Posted by jjLDNY View Post
Update for everyone who was following. This was indeed possible, the gentleman I spoke to who's name began with R was very good, and instead of dismissing me this time noted the series of steps I needed him to perform, rather than repeating "not possible".

So, background again for those curious.
  1. Current flight on Friday in a T seat (WTP) - let's call it flight 1
  2. Want to change to Saturday flight U seat (CW) - let's call this flight 3
  3. No T seats available on flight 3, meaning I have do find ANOTHER flight with T (WTP) seats, and U (CW) seats available - let's call this flight 2
So, I had to change to flight 2, to avoid moving into a W (fully flex) seat on flight 3 that I actually wanted which would have cost ALOT
Then, I had to upgrade to a CW U seat on that same flight
Then, I could change it back to the Saturday flight that I wanted

Total cost, £500 & 24k avios
Total cost if I would have moved direct to W on flight 3, then upgraded, £1500 for W seat + then £200 or so tax & 24k avios
What's missing from your update is any mention of a P class seat.

If you'd asked about this sequence of events, we could have told you yesterday that it was possible.
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Old Today, 3:38 am
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Originally Posted by Globaliser View Post
What's missing from your update is any mention of a P class seat.

If you'd asked about this sequence of events, we could have told you yesterday that it was possible.
Yes, but the OP didn't invent the P class seat - he was given very strange information from the Gold line. Either way, it's confirmed that our understanding of how these things work continues to be valid!
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Old Today, 3:45 am
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Originally Posted by Cymro View Post
Yes, but the OP didn't invent the P class seat - he was given very strange information from the Gold line.
I stand by my suspicion that "Something must have gone wrong in communication somewhere".
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Old Today, 3:52 am
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For clarification on a commercial ticket you can only upgrade one cabin with Avios. In WTP the commercial booking class would be W E or T and to upgrade with Avios to Club you would need U.

Further to this P class is either Avios booking class for full redemption, Avios upgrade or POU.

However if you did a POU you cant then do an Avios upgrade (ie cant go POU to P then to U with Avios) because Avios upgrades cant be used in connection with other discounts.
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