Why all the hate for BA ?
Aug 14, 2019, 3:30 am
#91
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Vale of Glamorgan
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 2,990
I fly ryanair a lot and low cost airlines. Its not that i dont expect as much. Not at all. But i also pay a fraction of what i am paying to board a BA flight as i said before. i paid £20 for a return to eindhoven (which is where i need to go) whereas a return to amsterdam is £100+.
However, as others have said upthread, BA is a business and there are many other options available. You are free to choose Ryanair if they suit you better, and BA will continue to attract customers who are happy to pay £100. Everybody wins.
The prices charged by BA and the LCCs are often very similar, and in some cases BA comes out cheaper.
Aug 14, 2019, 4:24 am
#92
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Tenerife
Programs: BA Gold, BA AMEX PP, Amex Platinum
Posts: 433
When you also factor in the Avios, free lounge access and exit row seats you get with status, LCCs rarely come up cheaper for our jaunts.
Last edited by The Geek; Aug 14, 2019 at 4:42 am
Aug 14, 2019, 4:39 am
#93
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 610
I am talking about normal economy passengers that dont travel for work like myself. If you are flying ryanair (and how i usually fly as i go away for the weekend), i get a coach in the morning which works out at £4 and then the train back costs £10 to tottenham hale. I could have a coach for £4 each way. if i was really scrimping. There are ways to get the cheap travel. For a 6am flight on a friday morning, i still need to be at heathrow way before the tubes start.
I have NEVER had a problem getting my EU compensation from Ryanair and Easyjet. All i see with BA are people having to use Bott and co to get the compensation.
Lounge access and exit seat rows are not a luxury we get (i have never even set foot into a lounge haha).
Im just saying that BA should advertise themselves to be a a low cost airline for economy passengers then they would not get the complaints that i and many other Y passengers would give them.
I have NEVER had a problem getting my EU compensation from Ryanair and Easyjet. All i see with BA are people having to use Bott and co to get the compensation.
Lounge access and exit seat rows are not a luxury we get (i have never even set foot into a lounge haha).
Im just saying that BA should advertise themselves to be a a low cost airline for economy passengers then they would not get the complaints that i and many other Y passengers would give them.
Last edited by MiraculousM; Aug 14, 2019 at 5:59 am
Aug 14, 2019, 4:46 am
#94
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 5,797
I've mellowed in that i recognise BA are pretty rubbish these days, but they could still be much worse than they are. I would have thought there would be a viable business model that provides for higher levels of J service around Europe but nobody seems willing to take the risk.
Aug 14, 2019, 2:25 pm
#96
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Kyiv, Ukraine
Programs: Mucci, BA Gold, TK Elite, HHonors Lifetime Diamond
Posts: 7,690
BA’s decline in stature is all part of the race to the bottom. For various reasons too numerous to detail here, air travel has become a “product” and referred to as such. This semantic change is indicative of the attitude both of the purveyor and and consumer of the “product.” The product is now mass produced and managed much like the delivery of any other product on any other shelf, continued cost reductions, quality tests to see how much the public will tolerate, and that race to be the cheapest volume competitor. And the traveling public mostly accepts and perhaps even desires it. As soon as an airline pops up from the swamp offering cheap flights from anywhere to anywhere else, they surge to buy the tickets (see WOW et al.) Then the airline collapses or limps along, but people still go for the seats. A carrier looking to offer a better experience must compete in this environment, receiving less support from a paying customer because the cheap seats are many many in the air and using up those gates and filling seats with customers willing to accept what’s offered and pay not one pfennig more.
I don’t have a “solution” because the problem is simply human nature. Been this way forever. Something that must be accepted and managed as best one can, making choices that are best for the individual in each case.
I don’t have a “solution” because the problem is simply human nature. Been this way forever. Something that must be accepted and managed as best one can, making choices that are best for the individual in each case.
Again, the imaginary monopoly... May I ask you where is it that you were trying to get to that you could not escape BA's 'monopoly?'
Last edited by Andriyko; Aug 14, 2019 at 2:39 pm
Aug 14, 2019, 3:26 pm
#97
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: UK
Programs: BA, U2+, SK, AF/KL, IHG, Hilton, others gathering dust...
Posts: 2,552
Aug 14, 2019, 3:30 pm
#98
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Cornwall
Posts: 257
What is the cost of getting to Stansted?
Where can I buy the £3.10 off peak to Heathrow?
I live in Cornwall.
Aug 14, 2019, 3:36 pm
#99
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: LHR/ATH
Programs: Amex Platinum, LH SEN (Gold), BA Bronze
Posts: 4,489
You've got it right that the product has become getting from A to B rather than being wined and dined while you're in the air. As much as some are trying to shove down the people's throat that they absolutely must get some food and a drink as part of the 'service,' it's not what people want to pay for. What if people do not want any service at all? When you think about it, there is probably no other business that will give you food and drinks just because you use their services unless you specifically pay for it (premium classes on airlines). People are not 'willing to accept,' they just want to get to where they want to be for as cheap as possible. The 'willing to accept' part is a cry of the tiny group of people who think that air travel should be as much about experience as about getting to one's destination. At the end of the day, there is nothing to tolerate if all the public want is to get to their destination, for as cheap as possible, no matter how uncomfortable it is.
Again, the imaginary monopoly... May I ask you where is it that you were trying to get to that you could not escape BA's 'monopoly?'
Again, the imaginary monopoly... May I ask you where is it that you were trying to get to that you could not escape BA's 'monopoly?'
And for direct flights, on my route LHR-JMK it has the monopoly, so I fly them. I am doing LHR-IST next month, and obviously i chose TK (you'd have to be mad to choose BA unless they were at least 50 GBP cheaper), TK gives you free seat selection, free food and a free suitcase on this route and a widebody 77W with AVOD.
Since BA don't have the monopoly on this route, they are completely outclassed on it, but still keep 2 flights (does anyone know if this route is profitable or are they just keeping it for prestige)
I am doing LHR-SFO next week, and I chose United, for the same price of BA Y, I got United Y+ (34 inch pitch vs 31 on BA) so again BA is outclassed in this regard.
Again the slot system is a joke, so BA takes advantage, I don't blame them.
In an efficient economy, the airport wouldn't have slots, it would have enough capacity to have flights whichever airline chooses to fly whenever they want!
Aug 14, 2019, 4:07 pm
#100
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Kyiv, Ukraine
Programs: Mucci, BA Gold, TK Elite, HHonors Lifetime Diamond
Posts: 7,690
Andriyko, my issue is not paying for the meal, my issue is you cannot pay for a hot meal if you want to! I want some food over a 4 hour flight, and a Sandwich that's hardly fresh (expiry date same day as the time I ate it), is not going to cut it. Every LCC I know has hot options, so BA is even worse than Ryanair in this regard.
Aug 14, 2019, 4:21 pm
#101
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: LHR, LGW
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 3,418
Are you sure you’re not working for Sam?
Aug 14, 2019, 4:26 pm
#102
Join Date: Nov 2004
Programs: BA GGL, LH FTL
Posts: 3,578
I have no idea why people would fly BA to SIN if SQ tends to have better schedule (more rotations), almost consistently lower fares, and a soft and hard product way ahead of BA. Yet BA fill two long haul aircraft a day (fair enough, SQ has more, but still...)
Aug 14, 2019, 4:28 pm
#103
Moderator: British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jan 2009
Programs: Battleaxe Alliance
Posts: 22,127
I have a little theory that those who feel trapped with an airline or an alliance, whether by corporate policy, personal budget, or frequent flyer benefit, feel more grumpy about whichever airline it might be, than those who can make an entirely or effectively free choice, stemming from the resentment of feeling trapped, although in reality, if it is the frequent flyer benefits that are leaving them feeling trapped, there are in fact choices...
Aug 14, 2019, 5:07 pm
#104
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: LHR, LGW
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 3,418
You've got it right that the product has become getting from A to B rather than being wined and dined while you're in the air. As much as some are trying to shove down the people's throat that they absolutely must get some food and a drink as part of the 'service,' it's not what people want to pay for. What if people do not want any service at all? When you think about it, there is probably no other business that will give you food and drinks just because you use their services unless you specifically pay for it (premium classes on airlines). People are not 'willing to accept,' they just want to get to where they want to be for as cheap as possible. The 'willing to accept' part is a cry of the tiny group of people who think that air travel should be as much about experience as about getting to one's destination. At the end of the day, there is nothing to tolerate if all the public want is to get to their destination, for as cheap as possible, no matter how uncomfortable it is'
I guess if you shake up the market and offer £0.99p flights, people are driven to believe that flying is so bloody cheap, so why can’t all airlines give me a seat at 99p?! Well done O’Leary. You changed the market and now we ultimately have hundreds of threads on why BA isn’t them or is. Or why can’t we have better food or why aren’t fares cheaper. Etc etc etc
But I still want my G&T and sandwich, because surely 99p is just for the plane. Nothing to do with anything else?! People don’t care about what costs what or how much profit or cost that or this is. You put out a price and make it competitive enough people will be attracted, regardless of the small print.
Unfortunately BA didn’t wake up to O’Leary or Mr EasyJet. So now they have to compete, not because people want low quality, non-existent service but because people don’t want to pay more than what EasyJet or Ryanair are advertising. The nuance is something people will stomach but only for so long.
The whole argument of getting you from A to B, just like a bus is also BS!! Can you name me a bus service where you have to be there 2 hours before and go through various security checks, taking off your belt or jewellery and, in some cases having to reveal your private underwear/garments in hand baggage to some stiff uniformed security personnel? I’m happy to be checked or for security to be strict if it protects us but you certainly don’t get this on a bus.
I’d also like to know that if people just want to get to where they are going as cheaply and in as little comfort as possible then why are many CE cabins expanded to the 8+ rows or even 12 rows that we do often hear about on here?
So I’d disagree that people just want to get to where they want to be. People get to where they want to be with (sadly) very little differential choice now. The only very different choice now is price. Airlines have all lowered their tones, not because people said please lower your tone directly but because companies (airlines) dictated it to the people based on the reactions of ooooo you can charge me 99p? (not that I have a clue what’s included but yes please! 99p sounds amazing!’)
As for paying for a hot meal or a meal you want, I find that extraordinary request, because if they tried to cover every base that people would be willing to buy as food then it would out the weigh the reason for charging for food in the first place. The more products you offer, the more costs you bare. Hence why BoB runs out, BA don’t want too much BoB stock on their books. They would rather run it as light as possible and keep the costs low, whilst making a bit of extra cash from the small amount they do load, which used to be included in the pre-BoB or HBO fares anyway.