Jul 20, 2019, 3:27 am
Last edit by: corporate-wage-slave
Quick answers to FAQ:
Help! What do I do now?
Most importantly, don't panic and don't do anything in haste. Read these FAQ. Read the thread, particularly the posts starting from the time that the strike dates were announced. Identify your options. Think about what works for you. Then take action. If you do anything in haste, you may have thrown away good options, or you may have thrown away money that you needn't have spent.
NOTE: Some emails have been sent out by mistake notifying the cancellation of flights on 8 September and other dates. If your booking still looks OK in MMB then you don't need to take further action. A cancelled flight should be shown in MMB with struck-through text. If your flight details are not struck through, then it probably hasn't actually been cancelled. You could check ba.com to see whether BA is still taking reservations for the flight in question. If so, then the flight has not been cancelled. You may also try checking on ExpertFlyer, if you have access, to see whether your flight appears still to be operating and whether BA is still taking reservations. However, some afternoon/evening flights on 8 September have genuinely been cancelled. See main thread for details.
Has a strike been called yet?
Yes. BALPA, the pilots' union, has voted in favour of strike action, and the Court of Appeal has rejected BA's submission to have the poll set aside, so the legal process is now over. The two parties went back into talks after the legal proceedings and those talks were expected to continue into the week of 5 August.
BALPA on 23 Aug announced strikes on Monday 9 September Tuesday 10 September and Friday 27 September.
Any further strikes normally require 2 weeks notice under UK legislation.
What flights may be affected?
LHR and LGW based flights. Not LCY or STN flights. Both cabin and flight crew are in dispute with BA, but the pilots (captains, senior first officers, first officers) are closest to strike action.
How long would a strike last?
The initial strikes are for two days the a single day, with normal working in between. Any other strikes could be of any length. It would be rare in the UK for there to be a full time strike.
What would happen to my flights if it is a strike day?
A range of options have been announced, see post 1551 below for more information: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...l#post31451055
and BA Trade Site guidance here: https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...kba?faqid=7594
Rebooking is now allowed on Iberia, AA, Finnair, JAL and Qatar. Within Europe EI and Vueling are also allowed. This is for both revenue and redemption flights.
and the FAQ on BA.com here (this includes information on BA Holidays bookings which are substantially different): https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...st-information
Can I do anything with an existing booking now?
Yes. Your options are different depending on whether your flights are currently showing as cancelled or not. See the links above.
What about Heathrow staff - aren't their strikes planned there too?
Yes there is a separate dispute at the moment between Heathrow Airport (HAL) and their staff such as those who operate the security checkpoints. See the separate thread on the issue.
Am I protected by EC261 if there is a problem?
You are always covered by the Right to Care provisions of Regulation EC261. You could potentially be able to claim compensation for delays, cancellations and downgrades caused by BA staff action too, but not for HAL strikes (for cancellations only if there is flight is less than 14 day’s notice). See the main EC261 thread in the BA Forum Dashboard.
Help! What do I do now?
Most importantly, don't panic and don't do anything in haste. Read these FAQ. Read the thread, particularly the posts starting from the time that the strike dates were announced. Identify your options. Think about what works for you. Then take action. If you do anything in haste, you may have thrown away good options, or you may have thrown away money that you needn't have spent.
NOTE: Some emails have been sent out by mistake notifying the cancellation of flights on 8 September and other dates. If your booking still looks OK in MMB then you don't need to take further action. A cancelled flight should be shown in MMB with struck-through text. If your flight details are not struck through, then it probably hasn't actually been cancelled. You could check ba.com to see whether BA is still taking reservations for the flight in question. If so, then the flight has not been cancelled. You may also try checking on ExpertFlyer, if you have access, to see whether your flight appears still to be operating and whether BA is still taking reservations. However, some afternoon/evening flights on 8 September have genuinely been cancelled. See main thread for details.
Has a strike been called yet?
Yes. BALPA, the pilots' union, has voted in favour of strike action, and the Court of Appeal has rejected BA's submission to have the poll set aside, so the legal process is now over. The two parties went back into talks after the legal proceedings and those talks were expected to continue into the week of 5 August.
BALPA on 23 Aug announced strikes on Monday 9 September Tuesday 10 September and Friday 27 September.
Any further strikes normally require 2 weeks notice under UK legislation.
What flights may be affected?
LHR and LGW based flights. Not LCY or STN flights. Both cabin and flight crew are in dispute with BA, but the pilots (captains, senior first officers, first officers) are closest to strike action.
How long would a strike last?
The initial strikes are for two days the a single day, with normal working in between. Any other strikes could be of any length. It would be rare in the UK for there to be a full time strike.
What would happen to my flights if it is a strike day?
A range of options have been announced, see post 1551 below for more information: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...l#post31451055
and BA Trade Site guidance here: https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...kba?faqid=7594
Rebooking is now allowed on Iberia, AA, Finnair, JAL and Qatar. Within Europe EI and Vueling are also allowed. This is for both revenue and redemption flights.
and the FAQ on BA.com here (this includes information on BA Holidays bookings which are substantially different): https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...st-information
Can I do anything with an existing booking now?
Yes. Your options are different depending on whether your flights are currently showing as cancelled or not. See the links above.
What about Heathrow staff - aren't their strikes planned there too?
Yes there is a separate dispute at the moment between Heathrow Airport (HAL) and their staff such as those who operate the security checkpoints. See the separate thread on the issue.
Am I protected by EC261 if there is a problem?
You are always covered by the Right to Care provisions of Regulation EC261. You could potentially be able to claim compensation for delays, cancellations and downgrades caused by BA staff action too, but not for HAL strikes (for cancellations only if there is flight is less than 14 day’s notice). See the main EC261 thread in the BA Forum Dashboard.
LHR/LGW pilots (BALPA) industrial action 9 Sep, 10 Sep, and 27 Sep
Sep 14, 2019, 3:04 am
#2057
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Berkshire
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold, GGL/CCR, Hilton Diamond, Accor Plat, Pucci Fan Club
Posts: 1,778
Fortunately i’m not impacted by this strike action yet, but I don’t believe either side is winning or covering themselves in glory. It appears the action is currently lose-lose for all affected and that includes other staff.
I also hold my hands up and accept I don’t have the answer either. But what I’m observing so far is corrosive from both sides. It’s not quite as black and white as ‘BA should just cave in because it’s all their fault’.
Compromise.
Sep 14, 2019, 3:12 am
#2058
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,596
If all the captains resign, are there enough vacancies with other employers where they would get similar salary and benefits and home location? Same for the rest of the workforce that would then need to find an alternative employer.
Fortunately i’m not impacted by this strike action yet, but I don’t believe either side is winning or covering themselves in glory. It appears the action is currently lose-lose for all affected and that includes other staff.
I also hold my hands up and accept I don’t have the answer either. But what I’m observing so far is corrosive from both sides. It’s not quite as black and white as ‘BA should just cave in because it’s all their fault’.
Compromise.
Fortunately i’m not impacted by this strike action yet, but I don’t believe either side is winning or covering themselves in glory. It appears the action is currently lose-lose for all affected and that includes other staff.
I also hold my hands up and accept I don’t have the answer either. But what I’m observing so far is corrosive from both sides. It’s not quite as black and white as ‘BA should just cave in because it’s all their fault’.
Compromise.
Sep 14, 2019, 3:27 am
#2059
Ambassador: Emirates Airlines
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 18,600
Sep 14, 2019, 3:58 am
#2061
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,345
Also if it is 9th and 10th it would be exactly the same dates as the last ones, would they do that in case people always travel on the same day every month or would they want to target a different group of people? Thanks
Sep 14, 2019, 4:10 am
#2062
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,596
You sound like you have some knowledge of what might be going on at BALPA so can I ask your opinion about this? The next mid week dates after 27th Sept would be 1st and 2nd Oct, do you think these would be targeted or is it too close to the previous strike and knock on effects? My flight I am concerned about is on 2nd Oct.
Also if it is 9th and 10th it would be exactly the same dates as the last ones, would they do that in case people always travel on the same day every month or would they want to target a different group of people? Thanks
Also if it is 9th and 10th it would be exactly the same dates as the last ones, would they do that in case people always travel on the same day every month or would they want to target a different group of people? Thanks
Sep 14, 2019, 4:16 am
#2063
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,059
SOP in big corporate pay negotiations - the CEO has too much else to do to keep a company running and being at the beck and call of a union would interfere with many other projects he'll be involved in. So he delegated to two of his direct reports, the Head of People and Head of Engineering (the latter deliberately someone who can be slightly more objective as a bit removed from HR/pilot ops), who can have more time free to focus where needed. As long as he's being kept informed regularly and providing input where required, this is a very sensible move.
Sep 14, 2019, 4:17 am
#2064
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,596
If all the captains resign, are there enough vacancies with other employers where they would get similar salary and benefits and home location? Same for the rest of the workforce that would then need to find an alternative employer.
Fortunately i’m not impacted by this strike action yet, but I don’t believe either side is winning or covering themselves in glory. It appears the action is currently lose-lose for all affected and that includes other staff.
I also hold my hands up and accept I don’t have the answer either. But what I’m observing so far is corrosive from both sides. It’s not quite as black and white as ‘BA should just cave in because it’s all their fault’.
Compromise.
Fortunately i’m not impacted by this strike action yet, but I don’t believe either side is winning or covering themselves in glory. It appears the action is currently lose-lose for all affected and that includes other staff.
I also hold my hands up and accept I don’t have the answer either. But what I’m observing so far is corrosive from both sides. It’s not quite as black and white as ‘BA should just cave in because it’s all their fault’.
Compromise.
Sep 14, 2019, 4:37 am
#2065
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL (for now) and Lifetime Gold, Marriott fan thanks to Bonvoy Moments
Posts: 5,114
You sound like you have some knowledge of what might be going on at BALPA so can I ask your opinion about this? The next mid week dates after 27th Sept would be 1st and 2nd Oct, do you think these would be targeted or is it too close to the previous strike and knock on effects? My flight I am concerned about is on 2nd Oct.
Also if it is 9th and 10th it would be exactly the same dates as the last ones, would they do that in case people always travel on the same day every month or would they want to target a different group of people? Thanks
Also if it is 9th and 10th it would be exactly the same dates as the last ones, would they do that in case people always travel on the same day every month or would they want to target a different group of people? Thanks
Sep 14, 2019, 4:58 am
#2066
Join Date: Oct 2013
Programs: BA Gold, VS Gold, IHG Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hertz Presidents Circle.
Posts: 1,446
But it’s replaced by “right to work in the UK”, which I would suggest statistically will leave QR pilots in a worse position with regard to legal right to work for BA
QR pilots operating BA planes really is a non-starter. Some other process will have been put in place to stop the strikes before that is even an option for serious consideration
QR pilots operating BA planes really is a non-starter. Some other process will have been put in place to stop the strikes before that is even an option for serious consideration
The other point above about public perception is fare, while I think BALPA have done a rubbish job at making people realise its not all about pay, its also fair to say that 95% of the UK population don't care.
I'm pretty much on the fence, leaning towards the pilots to be honest. The pay offer seems reasonable, however it seems certain promises were broken and that's not on, also the ask for some kind of profit share scheme seems reasonable.
I'm also in an industry where if you don't like your pay and conditions you go find another job, however I also understand the seniority 'problem' makes that less than easy in pilot land. I don't really like the way BA have treated passengers over the last few years and the cost cutting etc, so can only imagine how they treat their staff and that's probably what's swinging it.
If be happy to see Cruz in particular but Walsh as well, send down the river by the shareholders, hopefully that would benefit staff and passengers.
Sep 14, 2019, 5:02 am
#2067
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,596
Do they need right to work etc if brought in on a wet lease or to run 'charter flights' on behalf of BA that happen to go to the same places at the same time as a BA scheduled flight.
The other point above about public perception is fare, while I think BALPA have done a rubbish job at making people realise its not all about pay, its also fair to say that 95% of the UK population don't care.
I'm pretty much on the fence, leaning towards the pilots to be honest. The pay offer seems reasonable, however it seems certain promises were broken and that's not on, also the ask for some kind of profit share scheme seems reasonable.
I'm also in an industry where if you don't like your pay and conditions you go find another job, however I also understand the seniority 'problem' makes that less than easy in pilot land. I don't really like the way BA have treated passengers over the last few years and the cost cutting etc, so can only imagine how they treat their staff and that's probably what's swinging it.
If be happy to see Cruz in particular but Walsh as well, send down the river by the shareholders, hopefully that would benefit staff and passengers.
The other point above about public perception is fare, while I think BALPA have done a rubbish job at making people realise its not all about pay, its also fair to say that 95% of the UK population don't care.
I'm pretty much on the fence, leaning towards the pilots to be honest. The pay offer seems reasonable, however it seems certain promises were broken and that's not on, also the ask for some kind of profit share scheme seems reasonable.
I'm also in an industry where if you don't like your pay and conditions you go find another job, however I also understand the seniority 'problem' makes that less than easy in pilot land. I don't really like the way BA have treated passengers over the last few years and the cost cutting etc, so can only imagine how they treat their staff and that's probably what's swinging it.
If be happy to see Cruz in particular but Walsh as well, send down the river by the shareholders, hopefully that would benefit staff and passengers.
Sep 14, 2019, 5:04 am
#2068
Join Date: Oct 2013
Programs: BA Gold, VS Gold, IHG Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hertz Presidents Circle.
Posts: 1,446
You would presume BAs head of HR was in the room for a start, I'm not sure I'd expect Cruz there or not tbh, but engineering director seems an odd choice....
Sep 14, 2019, 5:07 am
#2069
Join Date: Oct 2013
Programs: BA Gold, VS Gold, IHG Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hertz Presidents Circle.
Posts: 1,446
I think since the whole Dubai thing kicked off QR do have quite a bit of spare capacity.... But that's only the start of it, there's also an assumption with drafting them in that they would do so, while not BALPA members they may still not want to get involved in strike breaking.
Sep 14, 2019, 5:20 am
#2070
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL (for now) and Lifetime Gold, Marriott fan thanks to Bonvoy Moments
Posts: 5,114
I think since the whole Dubai thing kicked off QR do have quite a bit of spare capacity.... But that's only the start of it, there's also an assumption with drafting them in that they would do so, while not BALPA members they may still not want to get involved in strike breaking.
Agree that pilots may be uncomfortable “strikebreaking” when it’s pilots on strike
