Jul 20, 2019, 3:27 am
Last edit by: corporate-wage-slave
Quick answers to FAQ:
Help! What do I do now?
Most importantly, don't panic and don't do anything in haste. Read these FAQ. Read the thread, particularly the posts starting from the time that the strike dates were announced. Identify your options. Think about what works for you. Then take action. If you do anything in haste, you may have thrown away good options, or you may have thrown away money that you needn't have spent.
NOTE: Some emails have been sent out by mistake notifying the cancellation of flights on 8 September and other dates. If your booking still looks OK in MMB then you don't need to take further action. A cancelled flight should be shown in MMB with struck-through text. If your flight details are not struck through, then it probably hasn't actually been cancelled. You could check ba.com to see whether BA is still taking reservations for the flight in question. If so, then the flight has not been cancelled. You may also try checking on ExpertFlyer, if you have access, to see whether your flight appears still to be operating and whether BA is still taking reservations. However, some afternoon/evening flights on 8 September have genuinely been cancelled. See main thread for details.
Has a strike been called yet?
Yes. BALPA, the pilots' union, has voted in favour of strike action, and the Court of Appeal has rejected BA's submission to have the poll set aside, so the legal process is now over. The two parties went back into talks after the legal proceedings and those talks were expected to continue into the week of 5 August.
BALPA on 23 Aug announced strikes on Monday 9 September Tuesday 10 September and Friday 27 September.
Any further strikes normally require 2 weeks notice under UK legislation.
What flights may be affected?
LHR and LGW based flights. Not LCY or STN flights. Both cabin and flight crew are in dispute with BA, but the pilots (captains, senior first officers, first officers) are closest to strike action.
How long would a strike last?
The initial strikes are for two days the a single day, with normal working in between. Any other strikes could be of any length. It would be rare in the UK for there to be a full time strike.
What would happen to my flights if it is a strike day?
A range of options have been announced, see post 1551 below for more information: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...l#post31451055
and BA Trade Site guidance here: https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...kba?faqid=7594
Rebooking is now allowed on Iberia, AA, Finnair, JAL and Qatar. Within Europe EI and Vueling are also allowed. This is for both revenue and redemption flights.
and the FAQ on BA.com here (this includes information on BA Holidays bookings which are substantially different): https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...st-information
Can I do anything with an existing booking now?
Yes. Your options are different depending on whether your flights are currently showing as cancelled or not. See the links above.
What about Heathrow staff - aren't their strikes planned there too?
Yes there is a separate dispute at the moment between Heathrow Airport (HAL) and their staff such as those who operate the security checkpoints. See the separate thread on the issue.
Am I protected by EC261 if there is a problem?
You are always covered by the Right to Care provisions of Regulation EC261. You could potentially be able to claim compensation for delays, cancellations and downgrades caused by BA staff action too, but not for HAL strikes (for cancellations only if there is flight is less than 14 day’s notice). See the main EC261 thread in the BA Forum Dashboard.
Help! What do I do now?
Most importantly, don't panic and don't do anything in haste. Read these FAQ. Read the thread, particularly the posts starting from the time that the strike dates were announced. Identify your options. Think about what works for you. Then take action. If you do anything in haste, you may have thrown away good options, or you may have thrown away money that you needn't have spent.
NOTE: Some emails have been sent out by mistake notifying the cancellation of flights on 8 September and other dates. If your booking still looks OK in MMB then you don't need to take further action. A cancelled flight should be shown in MMB with struck-through text. If your flight details are not struck through, then it probably hasn't actually been cancelled. You could check ba.com to see whether BA is still taking reservations for the flight in question. If so, then the flight has not been cancelled. You may also try checking on ExpertFlyer, if you have access, to see whether your flight appears still to be operating and whether BA is still taking reservations. However, some afternoon/evening flights on 8 September have genuinely been cancelled. See main thread for details.
Has a strike been called yet?
Yes. BALPA, the pilots' union, has voted in favour of strike action, and the Court of Appeal has rejected BA's submission to have the poll set aside, so the legal process is now over. The two parties went back into talks after the legal proceedings and those talks were expected to continue into the week of 5 August.
BALPA on 23 Aug announced strikes on Monday 9 September Tuesday 10 September and Friday 27 September.
Any further strikes normally require 2 weeks notice under UK legislation.
What flights may be affected?
LHR and LGW based flights. Not LCY or STN flights. Both cabin and flight crew are in dispute with BA, but the pilots (captains, senior first officers, first officers) are closest to strike action.
How long would a strike last?
The initial strikes are for two days the a single day, with normal working in between. Any other strikes could be of any length. It would be rare in the UK for there to be a full time strike.
What would happen to my flights if it is a strike day?
A range of options have been announced, see post 1551 below for more information: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...l#post31451055
and BA Trade Site guidance here: https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...kba?faqid=7594
Rebooking is now allowed on Iberia, AA, Finnair, JAL and Qatar. Within Europe EI and Vueling are also allowed. This is for both revenue and redemption flights.
and the FAQ on BA.com here (this includes information on BA Holidays bookings which are substantially different): https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...st-information
Can I do anything with an existing booking now?
Yes. Your options are different depending on whether your flights are currently showing as cancelled or not. See the links above.
What about Heathrow staff - aren't their strikes planned there too?
Yes there is a separate dispute at the moment between Heathrow Airport (HAL) and their staff such as those who operate the security checkpoints. See the separate thread on the issue.
Am I protected by EC261 if there is a problem?
You are always covered by the Right to Care provisions of Regulation EC261. You could potentially be able to claim compensation for delays, cancellations and downgrades caused by BA staff action too, but not for HAL strikes (for cancellations only if there is flight is less than 14 day’s notice). See the main EC261 thread in the BA Forum Dashboard.
LHR/LGW pilots (BALPA) industrial action 9 Sep, 10 Sep, and 27 Sep
Sep 13, 2019, 10:22 am
#2026
Join Date: Oct 2013
Programs: BA Gold, VS Gold, IHG Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hertz Presidents Circle.
Posts: 1,448
My LH trips are usually planned a couple of months ahead, SH maybe a couple of weeks... Thats for about 80% of my bookings I'd estimate.
Sep 13, 2019, 11:01 am
#2027
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 73
I think it does have negative effect on future bookings but not that much. Most of the business travellers are buying tickets within the 14 days period so they know will be any impact or not on that route. Leisure travellers looking to book their next year summer holiday (or spring break, etc) and I don’t think that is effected by much. Mid term bookings can be impacted but winter season is coming where is less people travelling. I don’t believe that negative impact would be so great the BA will suddenly change its mind. I’m not sure what BALPA will do next but BA is already used most of it’s punishment cards so I doubt that would now change any striking pilot mind. Quite possible BALPA could announce a 1 day strike 1 day not strike for let say 7 days long. That would guarantee a whole week and bit total chaos but limited financial impact on the pilots. But again this just a speculation from my end...
Sep 13, 2019, 11:10 am
#2028
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Far, Far North
Programs: Alaskans fly everywhere on any aircraft going there!
Posts: 1,262
You should have a read of the help desk thread as suggested by others.
If strikes are called for your date you will have at least two weeks notice. AS will rebook according to the BA rebooking guidelines, and in your case I suspect the obvious option will be AA to LHR instead. BA will be liable for any duty of care issues.
If strikes are called for your date you will have at least two weeks notice. AS will rebook according to the BA rebooking guidelines, and in your case I suspect the obvious option will be AA to LHR instead. BA will be liable for any duty of care issues.
Sep 13, 2019, 11:38 am
#2029
Ambassador, British Airways; FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Leeds, UK
Programs: BA GGL/CCR, GfL, HH Diamond
Posts: 42,945
But I did and I didn't see anything regarding award tickets using a partner's miles. Hence my concern about who has what responsibility here. It is looking, as I feared, that the two airlines are going to end up sending me back and forth and there will be a fair amount of denial as to responsibility. If someone has experience of an awards ticket issued by AS (AS is a little different in that it isn't a "true" partner) during the strike days earlier this week, maybe they can help. I'm posting on the AS forum as well. Three are differences here and, knowing my circumstances over the next few weeks, am hoping to avoid lots of drama by being prepared early, Karfa.
Last edited by KARFA; Sep 13, 2019 at 1:48 pm
Sep 13, 2019, 12:22 pm
#2030
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 3,440
I completely get why both BALPA and BA are not giving in easily but surely this can’t become a long term battle.
Unlike the Cabin Crew strikes, these strikes cause complete shutdown. Now I’m sure BA can handle 2/3 days a year with no operations, but if this continues can BA afford (financially and for their image) let’s say 10 days a year where there are no flights?
Why aren’t they trying hard to sort this, like they claim to be in their ‘Press Release’.
PS BA don’t seem as keen to publicise their centenary year anymore, I wonder why...
Unlike the Cabin Crew strikes, these strikes cause complete shutdown. Now I’m sure BA can handle 2/3 days a year with no operations, but if this continues can BA afford (financially and for their image) let’s say 10 days a year where there are no flights?
Why aren’t they trying hard to sort this, like they claim to be in their ‘Press Release’.
PS BA don’t seem as keen to publicise their centenary year anymore, I wonder why...
Sep 13, 2019, 12:53 pm
#2031
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,345
I completely get why both BALPA and BA are not giving in easily but surely this can’t become a long term battle.
Unlike the Cabin Crew strikes, these strikes cause complete shutdown. Now I’m sure BA can handle 2/3 days a year with no operations, but if this continues can BA afford (financially and for their image) let’s say 10 days a year where there are no flights?
Why aren’t they trying hard to sort this, like they claim to be in their ‘Press Release’.
PS BA don’t seem as keen to publicise their centenary year anymore, I wonder why...
Unlike the Cabin Crew strikes, these strikes cause complete shutdown. Now I’m sure BA can handle 2/3 days a year with no operations, but if this continues can BA afford (financially and for their image) let’s say 10 days a year where there are no flights?
Why aren’t they trying hard to sort this, like they claim to be in their ‘Press Release’.
PS BA don’t seem as keen to publicise their centenary year anymore, I wonder why...
Sep 13, 2019, 1:10 pm
#2032
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: YYZ
Programs: BA Gold/Marriott Gold/HH Diamond/IC Plat Amba
Posts: 5,989
I completely get why both BALPA and BA are not giving in easily but surely this can’t become a long term battle.
Unlike the Cabin Crew strikes, these strikes cause complete shutdown. Now I’m sure BA can handle 2/3 days a year with no operations, but if this continues can BA afford (financially and for their image) let’s say 10 days a year where there are no flights?
Why aren’t they trying hard to sort this, like they claim to be in their ‘Press Release’.
PS BA don’t seem as keen to publicise their centenary year anymore, I wonder why...
Unlike the Cabin Crew strikes, these strikes cause complete shutdown. Now I’m sure BA can handle 2/3 days a year with no operations, but if this continues can BA afford (financially and for their image) let’s say 10 days a year where there are no flights?
Why aren’t they trying hard to sort this, like they claim to be in their ‘Press Release’.
PS BA don’t seem as keen to publicise their centenary year anymore, I wonder why...
Sep 13, 2019, 3:32 pm
#2033
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Brighton. UK
Programs: BA Gold / VS /IHG Diamond & Ambassador
Posts: 14,194
Sep 13, 2019, 3:45 pm
#2034
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL (for now) and Lifetime Gold, Marriott fan thanks to Bonvoy Moments
Posts: 5,115
Sep 13, 2019, 4:24 pm
#2036
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA, VS, HH, IHG, MB, MR
Posts: 26,871
Having seen the BALPA letter today to members, it is far more likely the next strike comes with 14 days and 5 minutes notice. BALPA has lawyers on BA for various deeds of alleged dubious legality, most of which have been reported above.
Sep 13, 2019, 4:34 pm
#2037
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: LHR/ATH
Programs: Amex Platinum, LH SEN (Gold), BA Bronze
Posts: 4,489
My opinion is based on media and FT posts. I have no insider knowledge!
I think BALPA have played a sensible game so far. They have tried to be fair, giving more than the 14 days notice so that BA can avoid the compensation claims. And how have BA responded? It appears that they are stonewalling and refusing to negotiate any further.
So BALPA now either back down which is unlikely giving BA's intransigence. I also figure that compared to cabin crew, most pilots can accept some extra unpaid leave. So if BA are prepared to accept a speculated £120 million cost to achieve nothing, BALPA need to raise the ante. BA / IAG are not in a weak financial position and they clearly have a "war chest". How investor confidence responds to this may be the golden egg. Share options are a lucrative reward for most executives - knocking the share price will have an immediate impact on the senior team at BA / IAG.
Finally, whatever BALPA decide do after their next announcement is subject to how BA respond. Announce the erroneously reported 10-day mega strike may be the straw that brings BA back to the table with an acceptable offer. Do this with 14 days and 10 minutes notice means BA face a speculated £400 million cost plus EU compensation for almost 1.5 million passengers. That would get their attention and if not the negotiating team, definitely the shareholders. Both sides need to offer the other side an exit that retains a certain level of victory.
But then with WW and AC, who knows what planet they are getting their strategy from. Captain Edward Smith remains the last captain of the Titanic. Is that how WW wants his Wikipedia to page to read - went down with his ship?
As someone with two affected flights in the current strike period, I say power to the pilots!
I think BALPA have played a sensible game so far. They have tried to be fair, giving more than the 14 days notice so that BA can avoid the compensation claims. And how have BA responded? It appears that they are stonewalling and refusing to negotiate any further.
So BALPA now either back down which is unlikely giving BA's intransigence. I also figure that compared to cabin crew, most pilots can accept some extra unpaid leave. So if BA are prepared to accept a speculated £120 million cost to achieve nothing, BALPA need to raise the ante. BA / IAG are not in a weak financial position and they clearly have a "war chest". How investor confidence responds to this may be the golden egg. Share options are a lucrative reward for most executives - knocking the share price will have an immediate impact on the senior team at BA / IAG.
Finally, whatever BALPA decide do after their next announcement is subject to how BA respond. Announce the erroneously reported 10-day mega strike may be the straw that brings BA back to the table with an acceptable offer. Do this with 14 days and 10 minutes notice means BA face a speculated £400 million cost plus EU compensation for almost 1.5 million passengers. That would get their attention and if not the negotiating team, definitely the shareholders. Both sides need to offer the other side an exit that retains a certain level of victory.
But then with WW and AC, who knows what planet they are getting their strategy from. Captain Edward Smith remains the last captain of the Titanic. Is that how WW wants his Wikipedia to page to read - went down with his ship?
As someone with two affected flights in the current strike period, I say power to the pilots!
ba is the party with the advantage, worst case I can see them drafting in some Qatar airways pilots !
Sep 13, 2019, 5:03 pm
#2038
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,596
there is no way pilots will strike for 10 days, BA is far richer than the individual pilot and public opinion will turn against ba pilots. It’s harder for the public to feel sorry for people on up to 200k than if they were cabin crew on 20k.
ba is the party with the advantage, worst case I can see them drafting in some Qatar airways pilots !
ba is the party with the advantage, worst case I can see them drafting in some Qatar airways pilots !
Sep 13, 2019, 6:06 pm
#2039
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: LHR/ATH
Programs: Amex Platinum, LH SEN (Gold), BA Bronze
Posts: 4,489
you guys have to understand something, when an employee signs a contract to work for a company they agree to work for that money, if they want a raise and are not given it then the best option is to look for a better job with more money then! We are not talking about minimum wage workers here who can’t pay the rent !
unions are pretty much finished; they certainly don’t exist in my line of work !
Sep 13, 2019, 6:11 pm
#2040
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: NT Australia
Programs: QF WP
Posts: 4,160
any employment contract is also beholden to UK employment law- you can’t sign a contract saying you won’t strike* anymore than you can sign a contract agreeing to be paid 1p an hour
the insurmountable difficulty for most qatar airways pilots will be work permits (even accepting there are likely a few who have UK work rights already), and given the UK is due to leave the EU soon the potential pool of people who have the right to work in the UK is not as vast as employers are perhaps accustomed to
*not getting into the few professions prohibited by law from striking