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LHR/LGW pilots (BALPA) industrial action 9 Sep, 10 Sep, and 27 Sep

LHR/LGW pilots (BALPA) industrial action 9 Sep, 10 Sep, and 27 Sep

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Old Aug 23, 19, 8:25 pm   -   Wikipost
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been on FT for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Quick answers to FAQ:

Help! What do I do now?
Most importantly, don't panic and don't do anything in haste. Read these FAQ. Read the thread, particularly the posts starting from the time that the strike dates were announced. Identify your options. Think about what works for you. Then take action. If you do anything in haste, you may have thrown away good options, or you may have thrown away money that you needn't have spent.

NOTE: Some emails have been sent out by mistake notifying the cancellation of flights on 8 September and other dates. If your booking still looks OK in MMB then you don't need to take further action. A cancelled flight should be shown in MMB with struck-through text. If your flight details are not struck through, then it probably hasn't actually been cancelled. You could check ba.com to see whether BA is still taking reservations for the flight in question. If so, then the flight has not been cancelled. You may also try checking on ExpertFlyer, if you have access, to see whether your flight appears still to be operating and whether BA is still taking reservations. However, some afternoon/evening flights on 8 September have genuinely been cancelled. See main thread for details.

Has a strike been called yet?
Yes. BALPA, the pilots' union, has voted in favour of strike action, and the Court of Appeal has rejected BA's submission to have the poll set aside, so the legal process is now over. The two parties went back into talks after the legal proceedings and those talks were expected to continue into the week of 5 August.

BALPA on 23 Aug announced strikes on Monday 9 September Tuesday 10 September and Friday 27 September.

Any further strikes normally require 2 weeks notice under UK legislation.

What flights may be affected?
LHR and LGW based flights. Not LCY or STN flights. Both cabin and flight crew are in dispute with BA, but the pilots (captains, senior first officers, first officers) are closest to strike action.

How long would a strike last?
The initial strikes are for two days the a single day, with normal working in between. Any other strikes could be of any length. It would be rare in the UK for there to be a full time strike.

What would happen to my flights if it is a strike day?
A range of options have been announced, see post 1551 below for more information: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...l#post31451055

and BA Trade Site guidance here: https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...kba?faqid=7594

Rebooking is now allowed on Iberia, AA, Finnair, JAL and Qatar. Within Europe EI and Vueling are also allowed. This is for both revenue and redemption flights.

and the FAQ on BA.com here (this includes information on BA Holidays bookings which are substantially different): https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...st-information

Can I do anything with an existing booking now?
Yes. Your options are different depending on whether your flights are currently showing as cancelled or not. See the links above.

What about Heathrow staff - aren't their strikes planned there too?
Yes there is a separate dispute at the moment between Heathrow Airport (HAL) and their staff such as those who operate the security checkpoints. See the separate thread on the issue.

Am I protected by EC261 if there is a problem?
You are always covered by the Right to Care provisions of Regulation EC261. You could potentially be able to claim compensation for delays, cancellations and downgrades caused by BA staff action too, but not for HAL strikes (for cancellations only if there is flight is less than 14 dayís notice). See the main EC261 thread in the BA Forum Dashboard.
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Old Jun 28, 19, 2:02 am
  #181  
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
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Originally Posted by MFCC View Post


Completely agree. LAS is my second least favourite destination only after BKK
I would imagine DXB is also up there for similar reasons. But I had always assumed LAS took the biscuit - 10.5h stag do sector. Yuk.

Also, it's a sub optimal city to go to for a short length of time as everything is so vast. And I also assume it's not like the crew hotel is some nice mega resort on the strip.... So I would actually have thought that there might be some novelty the first time you nightstop there but that as a destination you want to spend time in repeatedly, maybe less so.

I have been twice. First time as an actual destination, second time as a jump off point for exploring Utah national parks.

The first time round I ended up feeling I'd spent waay too much time there in the end.
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Old Jun 28, 19, 2:34 am
  #182  
dsf
 
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Originally Posted by Kevlondon View Post
As safety continues to improve, the role of cabin crew becomes even more skewed towards onboard waiter/ess. They are frontloaded with skills and knowledge that many of them may go an entire career without ever using.
When the frequency of a skill's application reduces, it doesn't have an effect on that skill's utility or value. If anything the job gets harder, since without regularly exercising these skills in the normal course of duty there's an increased requirement for practice drills etc to keep sharp. Would you pay firefighters less when the number of fires to attend reduces?
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Old Jun 28, 19, 6:27 am
  #183  
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
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If you have a BA holiday booked but the flight cant operate would BA just cancel the holiday or (try to) rebook you onto another carrier?
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Old Jun 28, 19, 9:06 am
  #184  
 
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Originally Posted by Kevlondon View Post
Surely one of the reasons why industrial relations will always be difficult for BA is that staff are essentially split into 2 camps - those with 20 years of service, hired on ridiculously generous terms and with more downtime than work time, and those hired more recently on conditions that are more in line with how the global aviation industry looks now. The unions played a major part over the years in ensuring the old guard benefited from pay and conditions that were generous, to say the least, and now they seem to be constantly stoking tensions because their new breed of members were hired on hopelessly different contracts.

The only solution is to pension off the last of the old guard so that the entire company are on similar contracts. I remember reading a few years ago about a British cabin crew member who lived in the US and somehow managed to hold down a job on an airline based out of London. Back in the good old days I'm sure this worked. But the industry has changed beyond all recognition since 2001, and for some it's time to get off the gravy train.

Unfortunately, being anything other than a pilot is destined to be a low-level, low-paid role with few perks in this new era where the low cost model of operation is now the norm. As safety continues to improve, the role of cabin crew becomes even more skewed towards onboard waiter/ess. They are frontloaded with skills and knowledge that many of them may go an entire career without ever using. It's increasingly hard to find arguments as to why these people warrant the kind of perks that cash-strapped employers have to cover, such as an extra night in Vegas, or a few days on a Caribbean beach. Sad to say, but it barely looks like an attractive way to see the world any more, and over time it seems destined to be a low-paid job option that will only appeal to people without a degree.

Do cabin crew deserve a return to the old days of higher pay, more paid time overseas, abundant free travel and so on? Sure, subject to the same criteria the rest of us live by: if their employers are doing well and the margins make it work.
Is BA 'cash-strapped'? Or did I miss something?
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Old Jun 28, 19, 9:26 am
  #185  
 
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Originally Posted by Swissroll View Post
If you have a BA holiday booked but the flight cant operate would BA just cancel the holiday or (try to) rebook you onto another carrier?
The BA Holidays team are some of the best in my opinion. Make sure you save their 24hour emergency number to your phone itís on the hotel vouchers. They are a small dedicated team of people empowered to sort virtually any issue out. I was in Cancun when hurricane Matthew appeared and my flights home were cancelled. Was given the option of staying 3 nights extra in the resort for no extra cost and direct flight home or rerouted via Philadelphia and or New York. Proactively monitored and made sure I was aware that my stand by flight had been confirmed.
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Old Jun 28, 19, 9:38 am
  #186  
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
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Maybe I’m a bit dumb and I should say that I’ve skimmed this thread a bit, but will the strikes coincide with BA100-day?

It would be kinda embarrassing for BA if no planes were flying on the anniversary! Presumably they would be eager to avoid that.
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Old Jun 28, 19, 10:48 am
  #187  
 
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Originally Posted by Davidjonesk View Post
Maybe Iím a bit dumb and I should say that Iíve skimmed this thread a bit, but will the strikes coincide with BA100-day?

It would be kinda embarrassing for BA if no planes were flying on the anniversary! Presumably they would be eager to avoid that.
I'd imagine this is at the forefront of the Unions minds in coinciding strikes over the 100yr weekend in order to get resolution in their members favour. Some might call that convenience, others blackmail. I'll let you decide what you'd call it.
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Old Jun 28, 19, 11:22 am
  #188  
 
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Oh, the irony.



BA's best asset is its staff and yet here we are, with ballot voting going on.
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Old Jun 28, 19, 11:52 am
  #189  
 
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Stock Market version of this forum reports that UNITE has accepted the deal
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Old Jun 28, 19, 12:51 pm
  #190  
 
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Originally Posted by Mikey Mike Mike View Post
All of the three disputes IMHO are worthy and have validity. As the ex COO of a transit organisation in Canada - I have learnt that the vast majority of crew, pilots (operators) or whoever are real people with real lives and family and care about doing a good job. (despite some of my reviews!!)
I can't comment on the pilot's cause, but Gatwick crew have been left behind for years in terms of T&Cs under the guise of competing with Norwegian. Speaking of which the same argument has been used for mixed fleet. I have to say, I am not a fan of the MF quality of service in business / first class, but they work hard, are pleasant and work under way worse conditions. I know they choose to do this, but that doesn't give BA licence to take the p**s. Worst salary, more days at work, different hotels, stricter standards on appearance and performance, airport standby, few rest days after long flights, and more nimble rostering doing the mix of SH / LH which must mean they can be pushed closed to the limits of any agreement.
The fact these disputes have been grumbling away in the background shows arrogance and a lack of humility by the BA Management negotiating team. Removing perks were merely petty, and showed such a bad misuse of power in a punitive way. That doesn't mean that crew or pilots should get everything, but some tacit acknowledgement and movement towards the middle ground is a win / win situation and shows a mature and ethical HR team and policy. . Ignoring employees who are not happy does not end well for anyone - management or staff. Unhappy staff will often reflect this in the service they offer. (I can remember the many comments during the cuts of - "Sir - I agree these cuts have gone too far but they won't listen to us?")

A progressive BA in it's 100th year should listen to employees and reward them for their performance over the years. BA100 is meant to be positive year for the company, customers and staff. It also makes good business sense to retain, motivate and incentivise staff (I wonder what the turnover is on mixed fleet) with some concessions traded off against items on the company shopping list. If BA end up in a strike situation, it will be a failure of BA to manage employees and deal with long term issues. Sure, the unions and employees have a role to play but it takes two to tango.

PS - out here in Toronto, BA100 is a damp squib. No marmite, no IPA in the lounge, no livered 747s - just an Air Belgium A340 operating one of the heathrow flights, an outsourced lounge and a reduction in seat numbers and reward flights. Bah humbug!
A350 coming if that helps..... No, didn't think so, lol
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Old Jun 28, 19, 1:03 pm
  #191  
 
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Originally Posted by richardwft View Post


Theyíve densified the aircraft, revenues are up, plenty of scope for pay increases.
Buy on board alone should cover it if you believe what BA say about how successful its been......
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Old Jun 28, 19, 1:07 pm
  #192  
 
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Originally Posted by ShuttleRunner View Post
Asked my pilot friend to get some Hotline tickets for Aug bank holiday weekend and he told us not to bother...
Okay, now I am a bit concerned as I'm due to go away that weekend on 2 weeks holiday. Is there anything I can do to protect myself against this? I have Amex Plat travel insurance. Should I be buying flexible tickets on another airline just in case?
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Old Jun 28, 19, 1:18 pm
  #193  
 
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Originally Posted by jp-mco View Post
I appreciate your position. That said it's hard for a passenger to support industrial action which has been orchestrated to inflict maximum disruption when it might affect them. I am one of the people in that position. I suspect that many families (who already have to pay a premium to travel during school holidays) will not be so supportive of this industrial action especially when they find out that an 11.5% increase over the next 3 years has already been offered. In the wider private sector context 11.5% is generous - maybe not for a job with unsociable hours but that is the nature of the industry.
No issue with the strike or the claim for what those paid it see as fair pay increases, but the timing sucks and will define the view the public have.

Strike outside school holidays and disrupt my flights for work, no issue, no big deal, meetings can be re-arranged, alternate routes found etc, good lick with it. However strike during the school holidays, which happen to be the only time I can use my Avios to spend time with my family (the Avios I earn helping keep BA profitable) does feel like a kick in the teeth.

Options for refunds etc don't really help when you've booked with Avios and are kind of stuck. Here's hoping it's sorted by late August.

​​
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Old Jun 28, 19, 1:24 pm
  #194  
 
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Originally Posted by 13901 View Post
Just for the purpose of putting things into perspective I've decided to do a very un-English thing to do, i.e. talk about personal pay.

Let's assume there's 5,000 Mixed Fleet crews (over a total of 14,000 crews).

Let's assume that all MF crews are paid the highest amount mentioned by the airline, i.e. £28,000 p.a (amount I don't believe in the slightest, being married to a MF main crew member and having seen her P60s for the past four years). A 4% increase for next year would cost the airline £5.6m for MF. Please somebody let me know if my mental maths are correct. Arguably it'd be more expensive for WW and Flight crews, but to put things into perspective the combined pay of the CEO and CFO of IAG was, for 2018, £4.6m. And we haven't even added the other MC members, the non exec Board members, Alex and his MC...

Now, I don't mean to say that equal pay should be given to everyone; I'm not an idiot. But there is a very large divide between those at the coal face and those who aren't, and it's truly evident even in mid-to-high managerial positions (Band 1 and 2). This ought to be addressed, it hasn't, and it's at the root of a lot of the angst that is leading to a strike on the 'centenary'. Once again, well done Mr Cruz.
​​​​​​
FWIW I'd be happy for them to sack off Cruz and use his salary to part fund a pay offer for crews.
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Old Jun 28, 19, 1:34 pm
  #195  
 
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Originally Posted by Porky Speedpig View Post
Stock Market version of this forum reports that UNITE has accepted the deal
You have a source?
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