No nuts please!
Apr 11, 2019, 9:36 am
#166
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 388
I don’t mean to sound inconsiderate of your very real health concern.
Bur we are balancing a certain inconvenience to many, with potential health implications to a few of them, versus the possibility of a more severe event occurring to one that will certainly inconvenience all.
You presume that the other pax not eating is just an inconvenience, not that it may impact their own health. (yes, fasting is contra-indicated for some conditions and behavioral issues may exist with others who eat regimented diets which are disrupted)
I find it hard to take serious your request to put my health at risk to accommodate your medical needs when your consideration includes not wanting to use up parental leave time to bring home an adopted child from overseas because a boat trip would take too long. Again, many people survive never having set foot on a plane.
It sounds as though you are willing to inconvenience others to support your desire to travel, but not willing to take on the inconvenience of not traveling upon yourself.
Apr 11, 2019, 10:25 am
#167
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: BAEC Silver
Posts: 190
From an earlier post, I'm guessing the context here is a hypothetical scenario where (say) half the main meals on a long flight are chicken with cashew, rather than just about whether it's essential to serve a packet of KP nuts with the pre-departure champagne (clearly it isn't).
Apr 11, 2019, 10:28 am
#168
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: BAEC Silver
Posts: 190
A plane is different because if I'm on the ground and have an allergic reaction, medical care is usually only moments away. One of the other things that my allergist emphasized was that, if I need to use my Epi-Pen, I need to call or have someone call for EMS immediately. The Epi-Pen will not reverse the reaction and make it stop permanently. It will buy me some time, but that's it. IIRC, at most, it buys about 10-20 minutes, which, when on land, usually gives you enough time to at least get EMS there.
Cross-contamination is a concern. If someone near me is eating nuts, I likely will get nauseous from the smell. If they happen to drop a nut, and I touch it accidentally, or don't notice that I touch it, and then I eat or drink something, I can have an allergic reaction.
Since the smell makes me nauseous, and I occasionally vomit from it, would you rather have me vomiting while you are eating nuts, or would you rather refrain from eating nuts?
If I eat nuts, I also sometimes vomit. I've always assumed that's my body's way of trying to rid itself of the allergen.
Cross-contamination is a concern. If someone near me is eating nuts, I likely will get nauseous from the smell. If they happen to drop a nut, and I touch it accidentally, or don't notice that I touch it, and then I eat or drink something, I can have an allergic reaction.
Since the smell makes me nauseous, and I occasionally vomit from it, would you rather have me vomiting while you are eating nuts, or would you rather refrain from eating nuts?
If I eat nuts, I also sometimes vomit. I've always assumed that's my body's way of trying to rid itself of the allergen.
Apr 11, 2019, 10:56 am
#169
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Either at the shooting range or anywhere good beer can be found...
Posts: 51,048
Thank you for the information and insight. As reassurance and repeating what I said earlier, I'm more than happy to refrain from eating nuts. However, and I appreciate this is very personal for you so not just some kind of debating contest, it's just trying to understand the wider context and facts. Thank you for your replies on this.
'm pretty confident that if I eat almonds accidentally while at work, at home, or a nearby restaurant, I'll survive. Access to medical treatment is likely nearby, and EMS would likely respond within 5-10 minutes, so an Epi-Pen would probably serve its purpose. That's not saying that I'll test that theory, just that I likely would make it to medical treatment in enough time, given prior reaction times.
I'm not so confident that if I eat almonds on a long-haul flight, I'll survive. It likely would depend on how many almonds I ate, how much Benadryl and how many Epi-Pens I have, how close we are to an airport and how quickly they can land the plane, the first aid kit on the plane and if there is a medical professional on the flight. Again, not something I would like to test.
This thread reminded me. I need to obtain a refill of my Epi-Pens, because the generic version doesn't have an expiration date on the injector, just the box apparently.
Apr 11, 2019, 11:02 am
#170
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: HEL/TMP
Programs: BAEC Silver, HH Gold, IHG Plat Amb
Posts: 24
If someone near me is eating nuts, I likely will get nauseous from the smell. If they happen to drop a nut, and I touch it accidentally, or don't notice that I touch it, and then I eat or drink something, I can have an allergic reaction.
Since the smell makes me nauseous, and I occasionally vomit from it, would you rather have me vomiting while you are eating nuts, or would you rather refrain from eating nuts?
If I eat nuts, I also sometimes vomit. I've always assumed that's my body's way of trying to rid itself of the allergen.
Since the smell makes me nauseous, and I occasionally vomit from it, would you rather have me vomiting while you are eating nuts, or would you rather refrain from eating nuts?
If I eat nuts, I also sometimes vomit. I've always assumed that's my body's way of trying to rid itself of the allergen.
Vomiting and nausea can also be a part of allergic reaction. This is not triggered by smell, it is only triggered by ingesting the allergens.
Some other symptoms of allergic and anaphylactic reactions are very similar to panic attacks - tingling, itchy eyes, red patches on skin, difficulty breathing, feeling of lump in throat, dizzyness, heart pounding. Only one actually dangerous is anaphylactic shock, all of them are unpleasant and inconvenient. Avoiding your inconvenience is not worth causing inconvenience to others. Avoiding danger (=anaphylactic shock) is, and that is avoided by you eating a specially prepared (and served) food and by not sticking your fingers in your mouth after touching surfaces on the airplane (or elsewhere for that matter).
Apr 11, 2019, 11:09 am
#171
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: London
Programs: Ba Silver ( for now!)
Posts: 775
Do BA ( or any airline ) actually serve meals with nuts in ( someone mentioned chicken with cashew ). I know they serve them by the packet.
My my daughters school is nut free. It causes nil issue. Kid know no nut snacks and if you do birthday donuts you avoid the nut ones. They are not a loony left school ( west London independent ) and I just assumed all schools were now like that.
Given that for whatever reason lots of people seem to have nut allergies and airlines business is putting 3-400 odd of the general public in a tube for up to 12 ish hours I can’t really see why they would want the hassle of serving nut dishes at all. I like nuts but they are not central to many dishes and half a day without them is unlikely to cause anyone issues.
My my daughters school is nut free. It causes nil issue. Kid know no nut snacks and if you do birthday donuts you avoid the nut ones. They are not a loony left school ( west London independent ) and I just assumed all schools were now like that.
Given that for whatever reason lots of people seem to have nut allergies and airlines business is putting 3-400 odd of the general public in a tube for up to 12 ish hours I can’t really see why they would want the hassle of serving nut dishes at all. I like nuts but they are not central to many dishes and half a day without them is unlikely to cause anyone issues.
Apr 11, 2019, 11:25 am
#172
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,596
Do BA ( or any airline ) actually serve meals with nuts in ( someone mentioned chicken with cashew ). I know they serve them by the packet.
My my daughters school is nut free. It causes nil issue. Kid know no nut snacks and if you do birthday donuts you avoid the nut ones. They are not a loony left school ( west London independent ) and I just assumed all schools were now like that.
Given that for whatever reason lots of people seem to have nut allergies and airlines business is putting 3-400 odd of the general public in a tube for up to 12 ish hours I can’t really see why they would want the hassle of serving nut dishes at all. I like nuts but they are not central to many dishes and half a day without them is unlikely to cause anyone issues.
My my daughters school is nut free. It causes nil issue. Kid know no nut snacks and if you do birthday donuts you avoid the nut ones. They are not a loony left school ( west London independent ) and I just assumed all schools were now like that.
Given that for whatever reason lots of people seem to have nut allergies and airlines business is putting 3-400 odd of the general public in a tube for up to 12 ish hours I can’t really see why they would want the hassle of serving nut dishes at all. I like nuts but they are not central to many dishes and half a day without them is unlikely to cause anyone issues.
Apr 11, 2019, 12:23 pm
#173
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Either at the shooting range or anywhere good beer can be found...
Posts: 51,048
It sounds like you are confusing allergic reaction, anaphylactic reaction and aversive reaction. I have an aversive reaction to blueberries. The smell (and god forbid taste) of blueberries causes nausea and I feel I'm really close to vomiting (and have vomited in my childhood). I am not allergic or intolerant of blueberries, I just have a strong aversive reaction. It could be trained away if I felt it is bothering me enough. I would definitely do that if the alternative would be asking people to refrain from consuming blueberries on flights I take.
Vomiting and nausea can also be a part of allergic reaction. This is not triggered by smell, it is only triggered by ingesting the allergens.
Some other symptoms of allergic and anaphylactic reactions are very similar to panic attacks - tingling, itchy eyes, red patches on skin, difficulty breathing, feeling of lump in throat, dizzyness, heart pounding. Only one actually dangerous is anaphylactic shock, all of them are unpleasant and inconvenient. Avoiding your inconvenience is not worth causing inconvenience to others. Avoiding danger (=anaphylactic shock) is, and that is avoided by you eating a specially prepared (and served) food and by not sticking your fingers in your mouth after touching surfaces on the airplane (or elsewhere for that matter).
Vomiting and nausea can also be a part of allergic reaction. This is not triggered by smell, it is only triggered by ingesting the allergens.
Some other symptoms of allergic and anaphylactic reactions are very similar to panic attacks - tingling, itchy eyes, red patches on skin, difficulty breathing, feeling of lump in throat, dizzyness, heart pounding. Only one actually dangerous is anaphylactic shock, all of them are unpleasant and inconvenient. Avoiding your inconvenience is not worth causing inconvenience to others. Avoiding danger (=anaphylactic shock) is, and that is avoided by you eating a specially prepared (and served) food and by not sticking your fingers in your mouth after touching surfaces on the airplane (or elsewhere for that matter).
That said, if you don't mind the passenger next to you vomiting from the smell of the nuts you insist on eating, then by all means, let's not cause inconvenience to others. I would prefer the passenger next to me not vomit, but not everyone has issues with that, and not everyone is a projectile vomiter like me.
Yes, and it is why those of us with nut allergies must be extremely cautious with many Asian foods.
Apr 11, 2019, 1:25 pm
#174
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Flatland
Programs: AA Lifetime Gold 1MM, BA Gold, UA Peon
Posts: 6,110
From
Bartnikas, L. M., et al. Impact of school peanut-free policies on epinephrine administration. Journal of Allergy and Clinical Immunology, 140(2), 465–473.doi:10.1016/j.jaci.2017.01.040
Sci-Hub Impact of school peanut-free policies on epinephrine administration. Journal of Allergy and Clinical Immunology, 140(2), 465?473 10.1016/j.jaci.2017.01.040
Results: The percentage of schools with peanut restrictive policies did not change significantly
in the study timeframe. There was variability in policies used by schools self-designated as
peanut-free. No policy was associated with complete absence of allergic reactions. Both self-
designated peanut-free schools and schools banning peanuts from being served in school or
brought from home had allergic reactions to nuts. Policies restricting peanuts from home, served
in schools or having peanut-free classrooms did not affect epinephrine administration rates.
Schools with peanut-free tables, compared to without, had lower rates of epinephrine
administration (IR per 10,000 students 0.2 and 0.6, respectively, P=0.009).
in the study timeframe. There was variability in policies used by schools self-designated as
peanut-free. No policy was associated with complete absence of allergic reactions. Both self-
designated peanut-free schools and schools banning peanuts from being served in school or
brought from home had allergic reactions to nuts. Policies restricting peanuts from home, served
in schools or having peanut-free classrooms did not affect epinephrine administration rates.
Schools with peanut-free tables, compared to without, had lower rates of epinephrine
administration (IR per 10,000 students 0.2 and 0.6, respectively, P=0.009).
Apr 11, 2019, 2:11 pm
#175
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Cumbria
Programs: BAEC GGL/CCR, Hilton Diamond, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 4,510
Because not flying isn't a good option for some people. Adopting a kid with a nut allergy from overseas? How else are you to get the child home? Boat? Sure, let's eat into the parental leave that one might be able to take. Need to get a child to another country for medical treatment? Boat may take way too long.
This. People have somehow survived without smoking on a plane for years.
A no nut airline doesn't mean other passengers can't bring on nuts, it just means the airline won't actively serve them.
My nut allergy isn't about inconveniencing others and getting attention. Notifying the airline about it is about helping to ensure that we don't get diverted to another airport, inconveniencing passengers, because someone couldn't go a few hours without eating nuts and I ended up having an allergic reaction to them. Would you rather go without nuts for 6-8 hours or would you rather, 2-3 hours into a flight, be diverted to a nearby airport, forced to wait on the plane while a passenger having an allergic reaction is offloaded, and then have to wait for hours until the flight is cleared for take-off again so you can continue your journey?
Some airlines want you to tell them at the airport. As far as an Epi-Pen, I didn't have one until I was 17. While my nut allergies were pretty bad, I figured I would be fine with just asking about ingredients, carrying Benadryl, etc. When I was 17, I had a very severe allergic reaction to almonds (shortness of breath, face swelling, etc.), and only managed to avoid the hospital by taking liquid prescription antihistamines. After mentioning that experience to my allergist, he insisted I needed to carry an Epi-Pen, and showed me a video that had me seriously scared. It's not exactly easy to scare a 17-year-old, but he managed to scare me enough to cause me to really take it seriously.
He also emphasized that, when explaining my allergy or asking about if items contain nuts, I should never just say "I'm allergic," but I need to emphasize that I am DEATHLY allergic to nuts. Even with that, I've had times where people haven't taken it seriously and it's caused me to have reactions. The most recent was almost two years ago, when at a chain restaurant, I told the server I was deathly allergic to nuts, and asked to substitute a different side for their sweet potato casserole that included pecans. She said it wouldn't be a problem, and when delivered, my meal didn't look like it had sweet potato casserole on the plate. I started eating it, and after a few bites, bit into something crunchy. I moved the piece of meat and saw remnants of sweet potato casserole on the plate. I popped a bunch of Benadryl immediately, my friends dealt with the restaurant and eventually drove me home, once we determined I didn't need to go to the ER. Thankfully, while I'm allergic to pecans, that allergy isn't as severe as my almond allergy. We later found out that the server did not follow the restaurant's procedure in dealing with allergies, as she didn't tell the manager, the manager didn't confirm my allergy, and the manager did not prepare my food. Her laziness, while a hefty inconvenience for me, could have easily killed someone else.
Vegan cheese, sunbutter, sunflower seeds.
This. People have somehow survived without smoking on a plane for years.
A no nut airline doesn't mean other passengers can't bring on nuts, it just means the airline won't actively serve them.
My nut allergy isn't about inconveniencing others and getting attention. Notifying the airline about it is about helping to ensure that we don't get diverted to another airport, inconveniencing passengers, because someone couldn't go a few hours without eating nuts and I ended up having an allergic reaction to them. Would you rather go without nuts for 6-8 hours or would you rather, 2-3 hours into a flight, be diverted to a nearby airport, forced to wait on the plane while a passenger having an allergic reaction is offloaded, and then have to wait for hours until the flight is cleared for take-off again so you can continue your journey?
Some airlines want you to tell them at the airport. As far as an Epi-Pen, I didn't have one until I was 17. While my nut allergies were pretty bad, I figured I would be fine with just asking about ingredients, carrying Benadryl, etc. When I was 17, I had a very severe allergic reaction to almonds (shortness of breath, face swelling, etc.), and only managed to avoid the hospital by taking liquid prescription antihistamines. After mentioning that experience to my allergist, he insisted I needed to carry an Epi-Pen, and showed me a video that had me seriously scared. It's not exactly easy to scare a 17-year-old, but he managed to scare me enough to cause me to really take it seriously.
He also emphasized that, when explaining my allergy or asking about if items contain nuts, I should never just say "I'm allergic," but I need to emphasize that I am DEATHLY allergic to nuts. Even with that, I've had times where people haven't taken it seriously and it's caused me to have reactions. The most recent was almost two years ago, when at a chain restaurant, I told the server I was deathly allergic to nuts, and asked to substitute a different side for their sweet potato casserole that included pecans. She said it wouldn't be a problem, and when delivered, my meal didn't look like it had sweet potato casserole on the plate. I started eating it, and after a few bites, bit into something crunchy. I moved the piece of meat and saw remnants of sweet potato casserole on the plate. I popped a bunch of Benadryl immediately, my friends dealt with the restaurant and eventually drove me home, once we determined I didn't need to go to the ER. Thankfully, while I'm allergic to pecans, that allergy isn't as severe as my almond allergy. We later found out that the server did not follow the restaurant's procedure in dealing with allergies, as she didn't tell the manager, the manager didn't confirm my allergy, and the manager did not prepare my food. Her laziness, while a hefty inconvenience for me, could have easily killed someone else.
Vegan cheese, sunbutter, sunflower seeds.
Apr 11, 2019, 2:22 pm
#176
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Either at the shooting range or anywhere good beer can be found...
Posts: 51,048
I like wagamamas approach. As soon as you mention an allergy (not sure of just restricted to peanuts) the server is not able to serve you and the duty manager is called to serve you. I suppose it is a way of helping to ensure correct procedures are followed and that they have more clout with the kitchen.
Apr 12, 2019, 1:48 am
#177
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: London
Programs: Ba Silver ( for now!)
Posts: 775
https://www.marmite.co.uk/marmite-peanut-butter
marmite peanut butter anyone?
I am sure the reviews will be just as diverse as on this thread !
marmite peanut butter anyone?
I am sure the reviews will be just as diverse as on this thread !
Apr 12, 2019, 7:07 am
#179
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: HEL/TMP
Programs: BAEC Silver, HH Gold, IHG Plat Amb
Posts: 24
Trust me, mine is not simply an adverse reaction when eaten. When smelled, yes. When eaten, mine is an allergic reaction, which, depending on nut, if not immediately treated, turns into anaphylaxis. While I can reduce the risk of eating contaminated food or drinking something contaminated with nut residue, it can be reduced even further by others avoiding nuts on the flight as well.
That said, if you don't mind the passenger next to you vomiting from the smell of the nuts you insist on eating, then by all means, let's not cause inconvenience to others. I would prefer the passenger next to me not vomit, but not everyone has issues with that, and not everyone is a projectile vomiter like me.
That said, if you don't mind the passenger next to you vomiting from the smell of the nuts you insist on eating, then by all means, let's not cause inconvenience to others. I would prefer the passenger next to me not vomit, but not everyone has issues with that, and not everyone is a projectile vomiter like me.
Your vomiting (and worse symptoms) because of ingestion of nuts is the problem of those preparing and serving you food, you should demand they take your allergy into account. It is not the problem of fellow passengers, because they are not putting things into your mouth, and there is no medical reason for banning them from eating nuts. Smell is not dangerous!
Apr 12, 2019, 9:11 am
#180
Join Date: Mar 2016
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 60
There seems to be some miscommunication here. I'll try again. Your vomiting because of smell of peanuts is your problem and a treatable problem. So you should take care of that and not inconvenience others by vomiting or demanding banning nuts.
Your vomiting (and worse symptoms) because of ingestion of nuts is the problem of those preparing and serving you food, you should demand they take your allergy into account. It is not the problem of fellow passengers, because they are not putting things into your mouth, and there is no medical reason for banning them from eating nuts. Smell is not dangerous!
Your vomiting (and worse symptoms) because of ingestion of nuts is the problem of those preparing and serving you food, you should demand they take your allergy into account. It is not the problem of fellow passengers, because they are not putting things into your mouth, and there is no medical reason for banning them from eating nuts. Smell is not dangerous!