geerat

s0ssos

I don't know if you have actually been at HND. For those who have flown, it is well-known that business class doesn't get priority security lanes. But if you are there you can see many people arguing.
I have never seen (and doubt I will ever) see a Japanese person arguing with the person, because that is just not in their culture.
I have seen some people get through, who shouldn't have, and those have all been white. Many people (including white people) argue and do not get through. They are actually quite strict about enforcing those requirements, as compared to other things (like hotels are better nowadays about letting you check-in at 2:45pm, even though check-in technically starts at 3pm).

LTN Phobia

It's simply down to clarity. It's better for employees (who get questions bordering on interrogations). And it's an international airport so some considerations of different cultures would be warranted, especially from their 'omotenashi' perspective. It's not a competition on whose culture is more important. They have respect for yours, you have respect for theirs.

In any case, culturally, it's much easier to say 'no' when it is directed at the masses on a sign, even if it's hard/harder person-to-person. In this particular case, it actually saves employees having to say no, because the sign already says so. It's more suited to the culture if anything.

Oh I have seen Japanese people questioning it plenty of times, but it's more of a question about whether business class qualifies, to which they get an answer, and then that's understood. In foreigners cases, it's more down to the language issues. The staff often can't explain it in a coherent manner in English, so foreigners try to understand what's going on.

Of course there is an aspect of seeing fewer of instances of Japanese people needing to question the policy in the first place by virtue of even fairly low status of the home carrier FFPs being granted access when flying Y, thus reducing the number/% of rejectees.

s0ssos

But "international" doesn't mean "not in a particular country."
I think the Japanese way is to not ask for something you don't think you will get. Definitely not if you don't deserve it. Better to err on the side of not asking, if you aren't sure.

Is this similar to saying that one has to queue? Isn't it understood in London? Or, if you propose a similar state, "DO NOT CUT THE QUEUE". Would that be appropriate? And definitely write it in Chinese?

There are definitely signs that are only in English, directed at foreigners. I'm not sure how I view that. Like at onsens, because Japanese people would understand all the rules. But it also lumps all English-speakers into the category of "culturally ignorant". Just because I am a foreigner doesn't mean I am culturally ignorant.

s0ssos

Not that I was there, but the question "I qualify, why aren't you letting me through?" versus "Can you explain to me the qualifications for this lane?" would definitely provoke different answers, say, in an airport in the USA.

stevie

Same thing happened to me and two other people befind me...odd rule. Was J class on JL and refused. probably cost me 90 seconds more of my life. My favourite airport HND - so efficient

CPH-Flyer

Which is way longer than anyone is ever going to read. The problem is really the size of the sign, where ever you put the notice it can be argued that the text is out of the way. Some of the signs do have the notice at the top, but that is also not really an ideal position when you try to understand the sign. The sign is too tall for people to be looking at the top anyway.

The thing they could do, is literally call it first class security lane, then it might be obvious.
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The rule itself is a bit odd, but I assume it was driven by the original single lane only and therfore lack of capacity With priority lanes at both sides of the main security facility, and one at the south end security lanes, they should have the capacity to expand the access rules.

LTN Phobia

I've never seen anyone knowingly trying it on. The OP certainly didn't. He was caught surprised because it was rather unexpected. I have seen a lot of passengers caught out but every single one I saw was due to misunderstanding. Yes, Japanese business class passengers included. It has nothing to do with culture, it's an unusual policy and poor signage.

It's so easy to make excuses for shortcomings on the basis of culture but it's actually quite insulting to that culture...

Putting a cultural interpretation here is simply complicating the matter, No matter what the culture may be like, a poor signage is just that, poor signage. The poor sign is causing a misunderstanding and confusion, not helped by the unusual policy which it needs to represent, not helped by the lack of Japanese language skills on the passengers' side and the lack of English language skills on the staff's side (neither of which is really 'faults' as such).

It's a simple, practical problem to be solved, not something that requires deep analysis of culture and what not.

Completely different. Airport-imposed rules need to be clearly stated for people to understand, which they currently don't.

"Do not cut the queue" is etiquette based on a certain cultural norm, not a rule of a specific location like a priority lane at a specific airport.

geerat

LTN Phobia

The point isn't about what you see initially and quickly. It's about anyone who tries to ask why they aren't allowed after being rejected.
It could even be written on a separate card in multiple languages.

They can just point at it. The current sentence is also poorly-written and unclear (in English, that is - Japanese seems OK), so pointing at it doesn't really work, and besides, pointing at something written near the floor level isn't really going to work so well.

(Besides, the sign has far too many things on it and highly cluttered, which doesn't help.)

LTN Phobia

"Don't I qualify? I am in business class..." was invariably the comment from those in J but rejected, both Japanese and foreigners.
In foreigners' cases, then often their frequent flyer card comes out, asking if that qualifies them, because that's on the board. (The proviso on the sign is not clear enough and most likely it hadn't even been seen in any case.)

I don't really understand why there is a focus on holding passengers responsible for the issues here?

If you are focusing on the culture, some in Japan would argue it's bad service that the airline caused passengers embarrassment by failing to gently point out that business class passengers did not qualify to use the priority lane, and that their non-operating carrier frequent flyer card did not qualify them either (e.g. by asking them to use the normal security, and then providing them with an explanation if asked why).

CPH-Flyer

In my experience, they do just point to the sign, and say you need to have one of these cards. For a JAL flight, they would point you to having a JMB Diamond, JGP, or JMB Sapphire to be eligible. When I experienced it the first time myself, I was politely told I needed a Qatar Airways card to be able to use the priority lane.

I was probably a bit of a DYKWIA when it happened to me. As I went back to the check in desk to confirm that the lady manning the priority line was indeed correct in her assertion. It is a bit funny how most people here, myself included, starts by assuming we know better than the staff.

LTN Phobia

I don't think that is DYKWIA.

A better sign removes the need for passengers to go back to check with check-in staff because it'd simply make sense by looking at it and puts the matter beyond doubt, even if it's a weird policy.

orbitmic

nk15

Emeralds at NRT check in at the First class counters and they whisk you through special security line with no wait time at all. That was my experience in November flying JL Y as AA EXP. I was impressed...