Feedback response for a "self-service" First

Old Feb 7, 19, 5:43 am
  #16  
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Originally Posted by Tobias-UK View Post
Why did she sit there and miss out on breakfast? Surely if she wanted breakfast she'd alert the crew if she had somehow been missed?? I appreciate the crew should have asked her, but why sit there and say nothing if she wanted to eat?
Not making any assumption on the poster's wife here as it might not apply at all but more of a general point. In my experience things are not that simple and a lot of less frequent flyers simply do not know what to expect and thus get very shy/worried about asking things, especially when they see the crew looking busy and a be restless and expect that there is an order in their process and that they will be offered things in due time.

You and I fly those all the time, sometimes several times in a week. Whether we realise it or not, we know almost exactly what to expect or not, when, what request would be unreasonable or not etc. In a way, however, we represent a small minority of passengers. I still remember the first time my partner flew with me on BA F. We were sat on opposite windows and somehow, her crew member forgot to offer her pyjamas and toiletry bag. I offered to go and ask but she almost strangled me on the spot (not for the first or last time ) thinking that I would make a nuisance of myself and of her and that the crew would bring it anyway. It is only much later into the flight, after the meal, that she dared to mention that she had not been offered either thing despite seeing half the cabin wearing theirs. I did not dare to tell her that she could also ask for slippers. Similarly, one of my friends on his first LH F did not realise that he could ask for a car transfer to his gate that had not been pro-actively offered despite being well versed into premium cabin flying in many other airlines including BA.

In a way, this is not unlike the comment some people made in the drunk passenger in exit row thread where they effectively expect that crew know better than them and that even if they feel that something might not look right to them, the crew probably know what they are doing. I'm not saying that this is right - in fact, I explicitly think that it is not, but I think it is quite a natural tendency for many even experienced passengers.

As for the call button, I'm one of those extremely reluctant to use it except in emergencies, so I sort of sympathise here, but thankfully in F it's not an issue as I can walk to the galley without bothering any other passenger!
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Old Feb 7, 19, 6:41 am
  #17  
 
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Originally Posted by Tobias-UK View Post
Why did she sit there and miss out on breakfast? Surely if she wanted breakfast she'd alert the crew if she had somehow been missed?? I appreciate the crew should have asked her, but why sit there and say nothing if she wanted to eat? I agree there should be no need to use the call bell when travelling in First, but at the same time if the crew have forgotten to do something, use the call bell!
Oh, she ordered it, but she just didnít get it. And when she questioned it she was told ďAh sorry, itís still in the oven, but Iím afraid itís too late now to serve itĒ and with that the unused table setting was whisked away, no hot breakfast no juice, only a tea and a pastry. No excuse really, the 787 only has 8 seats so it canít be that hard to serve all 8 passengers.

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Old Feb 7, 19, 6:44 am
  #18  
 
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Originally Posted by golfmad View Post
That sounds very strange indeed. The crew must have felt justified in informing the CSD otherwise they would have risked exposing their own dereliction of duty.
Perhaps so poorly trained, indifferent or just lacking in awareness they didnít understand how theyíd exposed their own poor service levels.

Originally Posted by Newbtravelle View Post
Personally it kind of annoys me being bothered every 5 minutes by CC. I have to stop and rewind my movie, which is not so easy. This would be my personal dream. Except for the LPGS running out: I would not be having that!

As this was out of LHR, would be interesting to know if LPGS actually ran out and the return flight had no LPGS, or perhaps the crew were saving bottles for the return flight?
A good Customer Service person knows the difference between pestering and ignoring.


I have no idea how BA rota Cabin crew. Whether they work as crews, or whether theyíre individuals brought together as a crew, Iím assuming typically thereís something in between. But with a likely spread of poor to good, itís easy to see how people have flights with poor crews, especially if the onboard managers are less than stellar. What is typical of a company lacking a service ethic to its customers is the way in which the complaint is handled.
What Iíve learnt from FT is if youíre unhappy with something, complain onboard, and make sure if itís not addressed itís on the iPad for any follow up.
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Old Feb 7, 19, 7:53 am
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Originally Posted by orbitmic View Post
Similarly, one of my friends on his first LH F did not realise that he could ask for a car transfer to his gate that had not been pro-actively offered despite being well versed into premium cabin flying in many other airlines including BA.
!
Your wife sounds great, Orbitmic. Your post made me smile as you described the situation in an amusing way. My office is at home and travel is mostly leisure. Please can you explain the above point more fully?
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Old Feb 7, 19, 12:45 pm
  #20  
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Use of the call bell is a failure by tne crew not the passenger. I have no qualms about using it but have had few real issues since I prioritised anyone else over BA for long haul premium flights.

I am currently at 15 months since my last long haul BA flight and havenít missed BA one bit and on some occasions have paid not much more for revenue J with the competition than I would in cash for a BA redemption.
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Old Feb 7, 19, 1:42 pm
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Originally Posted by Land-of-Miles View Post
Use of the call bell is a failure by tne crew not the passenger. I have no qualms about using it but have had few real issues since I prioritised anyone else over BA for long haul premium flights.

I am currently at 15 months since my last long haul BA flight and havenít missed BA one bit and on some occasions have paid not much more for revenue J with the competition than I would in cash for a BA redemption.
Welcome back nonetheless. Long time since weíve seen you in this parish.
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Old Feb 7, 19, 2:00 pm
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
Most of your writing suggests a rather passive approach. If you want something, there is a call button, you may flag CC down in the aisle or use the occasion to walk to the galley.

This sounds as though it was a night time flight in which case most passengers would vastly prefer to be undisturbed unless they seek attention.

If you do send something to BA, keep it to 2-3 short declarative sentences.
Its F, you should not require a non passive approach.

A .... crew simple as that. I hope itís noted on those involved recordís and discussed at their next performance review.

As as to what more BA could do in regards to the complaint. Chuck a few Avios I guess would make some amends I suppose.
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Old Feb 7, 19, 2:34 pm
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Originally Posted by Cap'n Benj View Post

Its F, you should not require a non passive approach.

A .... crew simple as that. I hope itís noted on those involved recordís and discussed at their next performance review.

As as to what more BA could do in regards to the complaint. Chuck a few Avios I guess would make some amends I suppose.
My thoughts exactly. I genuinely donít understand how anything thinks that itís ok for passengers to need to actively seek out service in F.

Can you imagine going to a halfway decent restaurant and being happy at having to flag a waiter/ress down every time you wanted anything at all?
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Old Feb 7, 19, 2:53 pm
  #24  
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Originally Posted by BA235 View Post


Welcome back nonetheless. Long time since we’ve seen you in this parish.
Lol cheers it is becoming far less relevant to me with even OW earning heading to AA but I did notice the Twickenham sponsorship thread which is far more relevant to me than the quality of BA long haul services
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Old Feb 7, 19, 2:56 pm
  #25  
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Originally Posted by chris87 View Post
Can you imagine going to a halfway decent restaurant and being happy at having to flag a waiter/ress down every time you wanted anything at all?
To be fair that happens to me surprisingly often. I am particularly look8ng at you The Ivy Manchester
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Old Feb 8, 19, 6:06 am
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Originally Posted by Land-of-Miles View Post


To be fair that happens to me surprisingly often. I am particularly look8ng at you The Ivy Manchester
Going a bit off topic, but in that they don't even cook their food there.....
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Old Feb 8, 19, 6:14 am
  #27  
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Originally Posted by toothy View Post
Going a bit off topic, but in that they don't even cook their food there.....
Very much style over substance (as are all these Ivy franchises). All the reviews I've read have been terrible.
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Old Feb 8, 19, 6:22 am
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The thing about First service is that it should be effortless. The British way is to be more passive, not forward in asking for things, certainly not demanding and always reluctant to complain. That is why particularly on BA I find a non-proactive service a very bad thing. The crew should be trained to leave the passengers wanting for nothing and be very proactive in offering everything available to save passengers having to ask. Even more so in the case of more obviously infrequent flyers. On AA for example I would have no qualm asking for what I wanted directly and not expecting any problem with the crew for that either. On BA, I really like the "Britishness" of it, which is almost always present, even from the younger and perhaps less well-trained crew members who must be given a chance to bring their experience up to the levels of their enthusiasm.

The Customer Service issue is one that BA cannot escape from. Here, you cannot rely on "Britishness". You must be hard and direct with complaints and specifically demand whatever recompense you feel worthy of. Otherwise, you will get the same kind of cut&paste response the OP received. I always try a nice Email first but will invariably have to follow it up more forcefully. A sad fact of modern business I am afraid.
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Old Feb 8, 19, 1:06 pm
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Originally Posted by Cap'n Benj View Post

Its F, you should not require a non passive approach.
Or indeed in other classes on many other airlines. I don't want to start the QR Business vs BA First discussion again, but would it be too difficult, or expensive, for BA to send all their crew members on a QR business class flight to show them what customer service should be like.

I've found in most areas, customer service in the UK has improved massively over the past 20 years or so. I'd wondered if that was a result of people travelling more, and learning from other cultures. It seems BA, instead of improving, has gone downhill; they're bucking the trend. Clearly someone at the top has destroyed the service culture of BA.
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Last edited by ttama; Feb 8, 19 at 1:16 pm
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Old Feb 9, 19, 2:20 pm
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it clearly depends on the individual crew. At the risk of unleashing the Long Haul Crews vs Mixed Fleet crews, my last two heathrow to Toronto in First were the most underwhelming ever. Nice staff but totally unaware of the whole cabin, and seemed to focus on the first row. Not walking about checking - it's not like it's a big cabin. My last trip back last March I had a young lady - 21 yo max doing her first day in First - unsupervised, and whilst a great first effort - nowhere near the level required, and totally unsupervised by the CSMs (yes two of them both in club)
Long Haul crew whilst sometimes more cranky or set in their ways - are way better at sussing out each PAX's needs and delivering excellent service tailored to the individual.

I use the call button - it's why they provide it
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