Not using outbound flight even if checked in?
Jan 31, 2019, 9:00 am
#18
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,395
I was going to suggest that if the flight is cancelled or badly delayed, that would be a reason to try to get a refund, but since the OP's friend has alrready flown on the Avios ticket, BA could argue that there was no intent to take the delayed/cancelled outbound flight.
Jan 31, 2019, 11:21 am
#19
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,657
A BA agent certainly can, with trivial keystrokes, restore the return segment after it is auto-cancelled.
The issue is how to convince the agent to do so.
After it auto-cancels, send BA a DM via Twitter vaguely saying you can’t see your flight home in Manage My Booking, ask if it is related to changing my outbound, attach your flown boarding pass to the tweet, and close with “just want to make sure i’m ready to fly on Sunday.”
The issue is how to convince the agent to do so.
After it auto-cancels, send BA a DM via Twitter vaguely saying you can’t see your flight home in Manage My Booking, ask if it is related to changing my outbound, attach your flown boarding pass to the tweet, and close with “just want to make sure i’m ready to fly on Sunday.”
Jan 31, 2019, 11:43 am
#20
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: London, UK and Southern France
Posts: 18,364
If a company like BA or any other did the same to you, you would no doubt be raging on about it on forums like this and complaining to BA like there was no tomorrow...
Jan 31, 2019, 12:06 pm
#22
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Cumbria
Programs: BAEC GGL/CCR, Hilton Diamond, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 4,510
I think I know the answer to this, but since this has been in the news recently wanted clarification!
My partner is booked on a BA flight tomorrow LHR - BCN, returning on Sunday. She decided to come out to BCN early so I booked her a reward tickets on Avios travelling this afternoon as the change fee was quite expensive. As such, she wouldn't use the outbound tomorrow. I'm pretty sure that means the return would be automatically cancelled, but can this be clarified?
Thanks!
My partner is booked on a BA flight tomorrow LHR - BCN, returning on Sunday. She decided to come out to BCN early so I booked her a reward tickets on Avios travelling this afternoon as the change fee was quite expensive. As such, she wouldn't use the outbound tomorrow. I'm pretty sure that means the return would be automatically cancelled, but can this be clarified?
Thanks!
Jan 31, 2019, 7:15 pm
#23
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BKK
Programs: Mucci Chevalier de la Brosse a Cheveux Dore, SK *GfL, BA Gold, WY G, HH DIA, IC Plat Amb., Hertz PC
Posts: 3,698
Well, let me know next time that you approach BA and they agree to modify their terms and conditions to offer you a bespoke transportation contract. You are comparing apples and oranges. Consumers have no choice but to accept the terms unilaterally imposed on them by airlines. If those terms are unfair, it is entirely appropriate to question them.
Feb 1, 2019, 2:19 am
#24
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,838
I have always wondered why it is that people cannot just accept the terms and conditions of the ticket they bought (and accepted when doing the transaction).
If a company like BA or any other did the same to you, you would no doubt be raging on about it on forums like this and complaining to BA like there was no tomorrow...
If a company like BA or any other did the same to you, you would no doubt be raging on about it on forums like this and complaining to BA like there was no tomorrow...
Hope that helps answer your question.
Feb 1, 2019, 2:36 am
#25
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 324
Glad this has lead to an interesting discussion. In the end, she called BA and they cancelled the outbound, keeping the inbound intact and flew on the avios booking.
Thanks again for all the information.
Thanks again for all the information.
Feb 1, 2019, 11:39 am
#26
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: London, UK and Southern France
Posts: 18,364
because your comparison assumes that the airline and the consumer are on an equal footing. They are not. Let us say that you do not like clause X in the contract of transportation. So, what happens if you want to negotiate a change to it? Well, nothing happens because you simply can't. If you try to phone BA and argue that you want to buy a ticket to Paris, but you would want to slightly change clause 3c2) of your contract of carriage with BA, the agent won't laugh at you or put the phone down because they have been trained to be polite but they will tell you that it is not possible and they will undoubtedly think that you are a complete nutter because the very notion that a consumer might want to change the terms of a contract of carriage with an airline is utterly ridiculous. By contrast, if BA is unhappy with clause X in the contract of carriage, well they will just go ahead and change it and if you don't like the change, well tough: you will have no choice if you want to buy a ticket from the airline.
There is simply no equality between consumers and airlines: the power is one side and the other side has to accept more or less what the other side dictates and that is that.
That was more or less how we understood "freedom of contract" in the 19th century, with the abuses that it led to, particularly in the field of employment.
Nowadays, that vision of things is universally rejected throughout European legal systems (and, dare I say, any civilised legal system), which all see a point for protective legislation such as consumer protection legislation to partially redress imbalances of power detrimental to the weaker party in certain types of contracts. Now, one can discuss how far it should reach, which clauses should be regarded as fair or unfair, but I do not think that there is much disagreement on the notion that one cannot, in consumer transactions, regard a clause as automatically fair merely it is in a contract that the consumer has agreed to. If you look at the consumer rights act 2015, for instance, or the law of other EU jurisdictions, a clause will normally be regarded as unfair and unenforceable in consumer contracts if it is causes a significant imbalance in the rights and obligations of the parties to the detriment of the consumer. Whether that is the case here can be debated but there is at least an arguable case.
There is simply no equality between consumers and airlines: the power is one side and the other side has to accept more or less what the other side dictates and that is that.
I fail to see why you are treated unfairly when the airline enforce the rules to which you agreed upon purchase.
Nowadays, that vision of things is universally rejected throughout European legal systems (and, dare I say, any civilised legal system), which all see a point for protective legislation such as consumer protection legislation to partially redress imbalances of power detrimental to the weaker party in certain types of contracts. Now, one can discuss how far it should reach, which clauses should be regarded as fair or unfair, but I do not think that there is much disagreement on the notion that one cannot, in consumer transactions, regard a clause as automatically fair merely it is in a contract that the consumer has agreed to. If you look at the consumer rights act 2015, for instance, or the law of other EU jurisdictions, a clause will normally be regarded as unfair and unenforceable in consumer contracts if it is causes a significant imbalance in the rights and obligations of the parties to the detriment of the consumer. Whether that is the case here can be debated but there is at least an arguable case.
Feb 2, 2019, 2:24 am
#28
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 6,544
I have always wondered why it is that people cannot just accept the terms and conditions of the ticket they bought (and accepted when doing the transaction).
If a company like BA or any other did the same to you, you would no doubt be raging on about it on forums like this and complaining to BA like there was no tomorrow...
If a company like BA or any other did the same to you, you would no doubt be raging on about it on forums like this and complaining to BA like there was no tomorrow...