When did the demise of BA start?
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: MAN DXB ✈️
Programs: Skywards Gold
Posts: 6,825
When did the demise of BA start?
We all know the hard product is behind the ME3 and others but between data leaks, IT system failures and flight cancellations/delays handled badly with terrible press surely heads must roll in senior management? When did the rot set in? It seems to be one bad news day after another with no real management change - perhaps brexit will put BA out of its misery once and for all and open the doors for Qatar to buy them out...
#2
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London
Programs: Mucci. Nothing else matters.
Posts: 38,642
#3
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Provincie Antwerpen, Vlaanderen, Belgi
Programs: MUCCI Gold
Posts: 2,511
"Demise" implies that they don't exist any more. If this has happened I must have missed it.
You call it rot, but we could also call it responding to changing market conditions and this has probably been going on since the start. I do think that some of it is being handled badly, and even if the overall strategy is right BA does have a systemic problem on being execute these plans effectively. But nonetheless, talk of demise is premature.
You call it rot, but we could also call it responding to changing market conditions and this has probably been going on since the start. I do think that some of it is being handled badly, and even if the overall strategy is right BA does have a systemic problem on being execute these plans effectively. But nonetheless, talk of demise is premature.
#4
Join Date: Dec 2016
Programs: BAEC GGL/CR; Hilton Diamond; Mucci des Puccis
Posts: 5,526
Unlikely. BA are increasing revenue and profit YoY for some time. I'll dig out the charts if I have a moment.
Meanwhile Qatar (and Emirates for that matter) are heavily state subsidised. BA seems to be in good shape from the point of view of the financials and passenger numbers, which is what counts. Obviously, if you don't like BA, there are alternatives, but plenty of passengers are happy with the service.
Meanwhile Qatar (and Emirates for that matter) are heavily state subsidised. BA seems to be in good shape from the point of view of the financials and passenger numbers, which is what counts. Obviously, if you don't like BA, there are alternatives, but plenty of passengers are happy with the service.
#5
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Manchester but from Yorkshire better known as Gods country
Programs: BA Gold, , Sandals plat
Posts: 839
We all know the hard product is behind the ME3 and others but between data leaks, IT system failures and flight cancellations/delays handled badly with terrible press surely heads must roll in senior management? When did the rot set in? It seems to be one bad news day after another with no real management change - perhaps brexit will put BA out of its misery once and for all and open the doors for Qatar to buy them out...
#6
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Economy, mostly :(
Programs: Skywards Gold
Posts: 7,801
And the ME3 are perfect? Qatar’s Akbar Al Baker never gets any bad press! Ethiad is is financial trouble and as for Emirates, everyone I know has a story about them, including myself who only ever flew with them once in F and was you get past being blinded by the bling realise it’s a very ordinary airline. Add into the mix the three can’t get on with each other with no fly state bans and the changing patterns in air travel, I’d wager my money that BA will be around long after the demise of these 3
Both have similarly sized fleets, yet EK has just three types of aircraft, A380-800, B777-300-ER and B777-200LR (10 of the latter, ~150 of the 77W and ~105 of the A380). Thus EK is an arguably much larger airline operating a fleet with over 110,000 seats, in a much more efficient route network, better employee contracts and less legacy rot. And they serve real French champagne and every single business class seat in their fleet is lie-flat, even on 40-minute flights... Try CE to IST on BA...lol
Oh and then don't forgot this peach of an example of what a deplorable airline BA is... Involuntary denial of boarding, please help
#7
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: HKG
Programs: BA GGL & CCR
Posts: 600
The day Wee Willy Walsh opened a letter that began Were delighted to extend the offer to join BA as CEO...
#8
Join Date: Jun 2016
Programs: BA
Posts: 102
I'm not sure what this thread is trying to contribute? BA is very profitable. For all it's faults (and I'm the first to tell you there are some) it's not the demonised basket case that many suggest it is. Look at the numbers... or indeed the facts. And not those alternative ones either. Passenger numbers up, profits up. Gatwick, once a financial basket case, has been turned around. Indeed, the new catering has been gathering generally positive comments on here (who would have thought?!) and we'll be seeing more soft product and hard product improvements next year. I suspect that much of this vitriol is one based upon perception.
Brexit putting BA "out of it's misery" so that QR can come in a buy it? Give me a break. Next you'll be calling Club World a premium economy product.
Brexit putting BA "out of it's misery" so that QR can come in a buy it? Give me a break. Next you'll be calling Club World a premium economy product.
#9
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London
Programs: Mucci. Nothing else matters.
Posts: 38,642
#10
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: North of Watford Gap
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 602
We all know the hard product is behind the ME3 and others but between data leaks, IT system failures and flight cancellations/delays handled badly with terrible press surely heads must roll in senior management? When did the rot set in? It seems to be one bad news day after another with no real management change - perhaps brexit will put BA out of its misery once and for all and open the doors for Qatar to buy them out...
Last edited by babats; Nov 7, 2018 at 3:34 am Reason: Typo
#12
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: MAN DXB ✈️
Programs: Skywards Gold
Posts: 6,825
This is very real and the management isn't great at EK. The perception of BA is at an all time low and I don't understand how there hasn't been a senior management change in a while...
#13
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Manchester but from Yorkshire better known as Gods country
Programs: BA Gold, , Sandals plat
Posts: 839
Qatar, yes absolutely, though they are now going to supposedly publish financials. Emirates have always published full financials, and are not that heavily subsidised, good thing BA never gets subsidies
EY is probably going to be gone or massively restructured quite soon, yes. Qatar will continue to exist with heavy state support as long as they have oil revenue. EK is quite stable and self sufficient, and an extremely well-run and professional operation. Where BA operates 30 year old aircraft and has a fleet with dozens of different aircraft types, FAs on all kinda of different contracts (MF vs WW?) and clearly struggling to maintain the airworthiness of their aircraft, I don't see how you could think BA would survive EK.
Both have similarly sized fleets, yet EK has just three types of aircraft, A380-800, B777-300-ER and B777-200LR (10 of the latter, ~150 of the 77W and ~105 of the A380). Thus EK is an arguably much larger airline operating a fleet with over 110,000 seats, in a much more efficient route network, better employee contracts and less legacy rot. And they serve real French champagne and every single business class seat in their fleet is lie-flat, even on 40-minute flights... Try CE to IST on BA...lol
EY is probably going to be gone or massively restructured quite soon, yes. Qatar will continue to exist with heavy state support as long as they have oil revenue. EK is quite stable and self sufficient, and an extremely well-run and professional operation. Where BA operates 30 year old aircraft and has a fleet with dozens of different aircraft types, FAs on all kinda of different contracts (MF vs WW?) and clearly struggling to maintain the airworthiness of their aircraft, I don't see how you could think BA would survive EK.
Both have similarly sized fleets, yet EK has just three types of aircraft, A380-800, B777-300-ER and B777-200LR (10 of the latter, ~150 of the 77W and ~105 of the A380). Thus EK is an arguably much larger airline operating a fleet with over 110,000 seats, in a much more efficient route network, better employee contracts and less legacy rot. And they serve real French champagne and every single business class seat in their fleet is lie-flat, even on 40-minute flights... Try CE to IST on BA...lol
Last edited by Prospero; Nov 7, 2018 at 4:26 am Reason: repair quotation frame
#14
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 85
Not quite... They have angled seats without all aisle access on the 777s. That's one thing BA does do better than most, consistency in the hard product.
#15
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Economy, mostly :(
Programs: Skywards Gold
Posts: 7,801
Qatar, yes absolutely, though they are now going to supposedly publish financials. Emirates have always published full financials, and are not that heavily subsidised, good thing BA never gets subsidies
EY is probably going to be gone or massively restructured quite soon, yes. Qatar will continue to exist with heavy state support as long as they have oil revenue. EK is quite stable and self sufficient, and an extremely well-run and professional operation. Where BA operates 30 year old aircraft and has a fleet with dozens of different aircraft types, FAs on all kinda of different contracts (MF vs WW?) and clearly struggling to maintain the airworthiness of their aircraft, I don't see how you could think BA would survive EK.
Both have similarly sized fleets, yet EK has just three types of aircraft, A380-800, B777-300-ER and B777-200LR (10 of the latter, ~150 of the 77W and ~105 of the A380). Thus EK is an arguably much larger airline operating a fleet with over 110,000 seats, in a much more efficient route network, better employee contracts and less legacy rot. And they serve real French champagne and every single business class seat in their fleet is lie-flat, even on 40-minute flights... Try CE to IST on BA...lol
EY is probably going to be gone or massively restructured quite soon, yes. Qatar will continue to exist with heavy state support as long as they have oil revenue. EK is quite stable and self sufficient, and an extremely well-run and professional operation. Where BA operates 30 year old aircraft and has a fleet with dozens of different aircraft types, FAs on all kinda of different contracts (MF vs WW?) and clearly struggling to maintain the airworthiness of their aircraft, I don't see how you could think BA would survive EK.
Both have similarly sized fleets, yet EK has just three types of aircraft, A380-800, B777-300-ER and B777-200LR (10 of the latter, ~150 of the 77W and ~105 of the A380). Thus EK is an arguably much larger airline operating a fleet with over 110,000 seats, in a much more efficient route network, better employee contracts and less legacy rot. And they serve real French champagne and every single business class seat in their fleet is lie-flat, even on 40-minute flights... Try CE to IST on BA...lol
Last edited by Prospero; Nov 7, 2018 at 4:39 am Reason: repair quotations/attribution