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BA's move from Ataturk to the new Istanbul airport

BA's move from Ataturk to the new Istanbul airport

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Old Apr 14, 19, 3:29 pm
  #181  
 
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Originally Posted by hfly View Post
I suppose you haven't spent much time in China though, where the buildings always look impressive and the insides are garbage and falling apart .
It's mostly the opposite in China, actually. Especially for slightly older houses that don't look appealing from the outside, inside the flats they're usually well-kept.

Also, building quality in China has taken a MASSIVE improvement in the last 20 years.

And just like other countries in the region, most houses aren't built to last forever/100 years like they're in the western world. Average "life expectancy" of a house in Japan is 30 years, for example.

But back to IST.. assuming the airport should be the "jewel of the Sultan", I'm also a bit surprised by the sheer amount of stuff they've taken over from old IST.

Suppose money isn't that abundant anymore. Old IST had crazy prices for food and drinks (and I mean even compared to other airport prices!) and I suppose it didn't really became more sane in the new airport.
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Old Apr 14, 19, 3:44 pm
  #182  
 
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Originally Posted by YuropFlyer View Post
It's mostly the opposite in China, actually. Especially for slightly older houses that don't look appealing from the outside, inside the flats they're usually well-kept.

Also, building quality in China has taken a MASSIVE improvement in the last 20 years.

And just like other countries in the region, most houses aren't built to last forever/100 years like they're in the western world. Average "life expectancy" of a house in Japan is 30 years, for example.

But back to IST.. assuming the airport should be the "jewel of the Sultan", I'm also a bit surprised by the sheer amount of stuff they've taken over from old IST.

Suppose money isn't that abundant anymore. Old IST had crazy prices for food and drinks (and I mean even compared to other airport prices!) and I suppose it didn't really became more sane in the new airport.
No, it's part of Turkey, Turks avoid buying at the airport. Last time I was there Burger King was like double the price of the streets, 60 TL for a Big King XXL, thats ridiculous for Turkish standards but not that bad if you convert it to GBP so they get away with it. Or bottled water is 5 x the price of the high street. Even that Yodel airport hotel, what 140 EUR a night? That's madness, you can do a 5 star hotel in IST for like 50 EUR these days last time i checked!
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Old Apr 14, 19, 4:28 pm
  #183  
 
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Originally Posted by ahmetdouas View Post
No, it's part of Turkey, Turks avoid buying at the airport. Last time I was there Burger King was like double the price of the streets, 60 TL for a Big King XXL, thats ridiculous for Turkish standards but not that bad if you convert it to GBP so they get away with it. Or bottled water is 5 x the price of the high street. Even that Yodel airport hotel, what 140 EUR a night? That's madness, you can do a 5 star hotel in IST for like 50 EUR these days last time i checked!
It true that we 'Turkish' avoid buying food and drinks at the airport ( unless airport staff which has discount ). All fast food brands have double ( or even x3 ) prices than their city branches and no promotions ( coupons sent via e-mail etc... ) at airport branches. Bottled water is not x5 ( more than x7.5 in most places within IST ), however, in most other Turkish airports there are stores that you could buy water for supermarket prices but not in IST. Yes, it's true that it's high for Turkish standards but foreigners does not care as the prices are similar to their country. Also foreigners prefer paying €210 for the airside YOTEL for a night to avoid the stress of buying a visa and waiting for immigration at both at arrival and departure when the Four Seasons at Bosphorus is €100 per night. ( €140 is for the landside YOTEL ).
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Old Apr 14, 19, 5:53 pm
  #184  
 
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Originally Posted by IAN-UK View Post
Be interested to hear what upset you about TK service.

If it's the airline's customer service via email or phone, I understand completely!
But for the rest, it's Just Another Airline - but with some nice extra touches
It was just my expectations. I did 4 TK sectors this week and firmly expected them to be one notch below the ME3, however they came out way lower than the European legacy carriers. The cherry on top was IST-LHR in 777 biz - I wanted a drink after the service and the crew was nowhere to be seen. I resorted to pressing the call button which I normally avoid - no response despite repeated calls by me and my seat neighbour for an hour. Ultimately I found them all congregated in the front galley. They wanted my seat number and I did ask why the calls have been ignored. The attendant just laughed...so I left it. Either way, the said drink was abruptly taken away 40min prior to landing. Hate to give the impression that I’m judging an airline based on one flight, however it was in line with the other 3 sectors - incredibly rude crew, seated 30-35min prior to landing, broken IFE, broken WiFi and whatnot.
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Old Apr 15, 19, 4:28 am
  #185  
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Originally Posted by dubistokay View Post


It was just my expectations. I did 4 TK sectors this week and firmly expected them to be one notch below the ME3, however they came out way lower than the European legacy carriers. The cherry on top was IST-LHR in 777 biz - I wanted a drink after the service and the crew was nowhere to be seen. I resorted to pressing the call button which I normally avoid - no response despite repeated calls by me and my seat neighbour for an hour. Ultimately I found them all congregated in the front galley. They wanted my seat number and I did ask why the calls have been ignored. The attendant just laughed...so I left it. Either way, the said drink was abruptly taken away 40min prior to landing. Hate to give the impression that I’m judging an airline based on one flight, however it was in line with the other 3 sectors - incredibly rude crew, seated 30-35min prior to landing, broken IFE, broken WiFi and whatnot.
Then we are flying on a different TK. I have seen many rude BA/IB/AA/LH/LO F/A's. I am yet to see even a single rude TK F/A. You can complain about ground handling or call center quality, but rude F/A's - really?

Personal vendetta against TK or something?
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Old Apr 15, 19, 4:31 am
  #186  
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Huh who is talking about Chinese houses I am taking about Chinese airports, but what do I know I have only been to/through Beijing, Shanghai (both airports), chengdu, Changsha, Guangzhou, Hangzhou, Tianjin, Xiamen, Nanjing, shenzhen, Sanya, Haikou, Wuhan, and another dozen (some as many as 100 times) and find the buildings to look often awesome from the outside but decor cheap and terrible and everything falling apart after a few years, but if you have a deeper or different experience of other Chinese airports, please let me /us know!?
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Old Apr 15, 19, 5:10 am
  #187  
 
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About half of the airports you're listing are definitely not "in shambles" inside - NKG for example is definitely a nice building both inside and outside. PEK (T3!) clearly isn't "falling apart", neither is Shenzhen.

Besides that, taste might differenciate, but personally I am much more depressed from airports like VIE or FRA then from PVG, CAN or NKG. And don't get me started with airports like TXL, FCO, MAD, HAJ..

Atatürk was NEVER designed for this amount of pax, and managed to job reasonably well. The new airport was built in an extremely hurry (but so was PEK T3 or the new NKG terminal) - not going to talk about the bad side effects, and obviously they were hell-bent on opening it.

But they managed it, with a reasonable delay for such a huge project, and while most will agree that they should have taken 1-2 years longer, finished the subway link, and basically just managed everything a bit better, the result is still a functional airport.

LHR had the baggage-gate when it opened. BER isn't even open yet, and probably never will.

China opened probably more than 20 new airports of larger size than BER in the time the Germans didn't even finish one..

Just like with jobs. Sometimes you're overqualified. An airport doesn't have to withstand 100 years of time. Who knows what transportation methods will then be used?

Plus there can be lots of unforeseen changes. Schengen changed a lot for all European airports within it's area. Including having to re-build large areas.

Airports that were seen as the nonplusultra in the 80s are now - despite good maintenance - not seen as practical anymore.

Would Changi with it's gate security still be built like this today? Despite it being a great airport, it has it's downfalls. It's size is rather crazy for the amount of pax it does handle (approx 65mil at record) - old IST handled more than that with what, a 1/10th of its size? (Obviously old Atatürk was too small, but you get the dimensions from Changi..)

The A380 seemed a great airplane at it's time - now it's a dinosaur already.

Building a "perfect airport" isn't something that's really possible due to continual shifting of what's actually needed.

If oil goes to 150$ again and fares raise accordingly, we might see 20% less air traffic, since all shorter trips will be made by rail again.

In short, new IST was definitely needed, and it's design - currently designed to easily hold current's TK operations and being able to expand it to anything that could be foreseen - makes sense. Some of the areas still needs to be finished, including the metro link, and I personally would have given the whole thing 1-2yrs more to finish properly, but then it was a political decision. However, building a new airport outside the city does make sense. As convenient a "city airport" is, when the airport is properly finished and a quick rail link serving it, it won't take much more time to head there than to old Atatürk. It's not like NRT which is so far away it can hardly be called Tokyo..

Aiming to be "perfect" often creates the exact opposite. Airports are meant to be practical, not perfect.
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Old Apr 15, 19, 8:45 am
  #188  
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Yurop, I was at PEK T3 the week it opened, and I was there last week. In between I would say that I have been there at least once every 6 weeks. The floors are cheap and grimy, the escalators and travelators tired, the train to the satellite terminal is broken at least one in three times that I take it (and has been this way for years) often making it necessary to make every one take shuttle buses. The passport control area (outbound) is a shambles. All furniture is pretty cheap and most lounges are threadbare. Yes the building looks impressive from the outside, and while it has impressive ceilings, it has always been a junky interior that has not aged well. Shenzhen? You must be solely referring to what Terminal 3? Which opened a few years ago, not all the other terminals, right? Again the furnishing etc even at the new terminal are not that great. uhhh PVG is also "pretty new" and looks impressive from the outside, but is garbage. In any case, your throwing in TXL and FCO into the mix, so now am not even sure what you are trying to say, as it has nothing to do with the point I was making??!!
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Old Apr 15, 19, 9:02 am
  #189  
 
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Originally Posted by dubistokay View Post


It was just my expectations. I did 4 TK sectors this week and firmly expected them to be one notch below the ME3, however they came out way lower than the European legacy carriers. The cherry on top was IST-LHR in 777 biz - I wanted a drink after the service and the crew was nowhere to be seen. I resorted to pressing the call button which I normally avoid - no response despite repeated calls by me and my seat neighbour for an hour. Ultimately I found them all congregated in the front galley. They wanted my seat number and I did ask why the calls have been ignored. The attendant just laughed...so I left it. Either way, the said drink was abruptly taken away 40min prior to landing. Hate to give the impression that I’m judging an airline based on one flight, however it was in line with the other 3 sectors - incredibly rude crew, seated 30-35min prior to landing, broken IFE, broken WiFi and whatnot.
Sounds very similar to my experience flying with them LHR-IST. Except my drink never turned up.
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Old Apr 15, 19, 1:55 pm
  #190  
 
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Originally Posted by ahmetdouas View Post
No, it's part of Turkey, Turks avoid buying at the airport. Last time I was there Burger King was like double the price of the streets, 60 TL for a Big King XXL, thats ridiculous for Turkish standards but not that bad if you convert it to GBP so they get away with it. Or bottled water is 5 x the price of the high street. Even that Yodel airport hotel, what 140 EUR a night? That's madness, you can do a 5 star hotel in IST for like 50 EUR these days last time i checked!
Yotelair is too much expesnive, but when You travel with family and You don't have aleredy visa you don't have much choice, I will need acomondation next year at IST beetween flights (14H) and I will not go autside airport hotel becouse I would have to pay visa charge for 4pax....
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Old Apr 15, 19, 7:52 pm
  #191  
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Originally Posted by TPJ View Post
Then we are flying on a different TK. I have seen many rude BA/IB/AA/LH/LO F/A's. I am yet to see even a single rude TK F/A. You can complain about ground handling or call center quality, but rude F/A's - really?
I reckon the perceived rudeness is a manifestation of cabin crew members' (generally) low levels of proficiency in English, exacerbated by cultural differences.

Couple that with a British delight in an easy flow of drinks, with constant top-ups, not always fully congruent with the Turkish approach to alcohol consumption.
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Old Apr 16, 19, 12:10 am
  #192  
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So, going back to topic, has anyone been to the lounge that BA use at new Istanbul airport yet?
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Old Apr 16, 19, 4:54 am
  #193  
 
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Originally Posted by LTN Phobia View Post
So, going back to topic, has anyone been to the lounge that BA use at new Istanbul airport yet?
Not yet but it's definitely better than the Millennium Lounge. For those who missed the old lounge, some nostalgia;

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Old Apr 16, 19, 5:01 am
  #194  
 
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Originally Posted by IAN-UK View Post
I reckon the perceived rudeness is a manifestation of cabin crew members' (generally) low levels of proficiency in English, exacerbated by cultural differences.

Couple that with a British delight in an easy flow of drinks, with constant top-ups, not always fully congruent with the Turkish approach to alcohol consumption.
Yes was a slight culture drink for me when going out for a drink meant literally “a” drink.
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Old Apr 16, 19, 5:16 am
  #195  
 
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Originally Posted by LTN Phobia View Post
So, going back to topic, has anyone been to the lounge that BA use at new Istanbul airport yet?
Not seen any pics or reviews of the native lounge that BA is supposedly using. Reviews of the TK lounge seem to suggest evolution rather than revolution so I won't be expecting much.
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