Passengers and security. Not always the best combination
Aug 20, 2018, 2:21 am
#31
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2018
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 117
At LHR you are allowed to keep shoes on with 3 exceptions: if they are boots style or seem to have high metal content; if there is a particular high status of alert (I don't think there has been one this year) and very occasionally one individual line has a training exercise on (e.g. new member of staff). I reckon on coming across this once a year, bearing in mind I use LHR security several hundred times a year. What may explain this is if your shoes are on the cusp of the first group, such as some Doc Martens (most of them through the WTMD fine).
I don't entirely recognise some of the descriptions above. I invite people on their next visit to Flight Connection security to have a look around them and watch traveller behaviour in a detached way. You will firstly notice a large quantity of pictograms and signs clearly stating what needs to be removed, notably liquids. When you see those going through Secondary they are invariably those with at least some liquid item they have left in the bag, despite all the signs, the warnings in Highlife, the messages on the transfer buses, the let-us-say assertive advice by HAL agents. I appreciate that in other airports there is a laissez-faire approach, but what happens at LHR is pretty much mirrored in CDG, BRU, AMS, FRA, Then watch the reaction of those who have lost items to security despite the rules not having changed significantly in 11 years. One gender tends to overdo the liquids, the other gender tends to kick off about their treatment. The HAL security team is huge, and there are one or two bad eggs in there. But generally they are more sinned against than sinners, some of the reaction from passengers is quite unacceptable. And I know that a lot of people simply try it on: they just don't expect to be caught.
Help is at hand, HAL is in trials of the AMS scanning equipment and software, which allows everything, including PCs and liquids, to stay in the bags. I don't think the trial has got to the passenger area of T5 yet, but apparently it will soon.
I don't entirely recognise some of the descriptions above. I invite people on their next visit to Flight Connection security to have a look around them and watch traveller behaviour in a detached way. You will firstly notice a large quantity of pictograms and signs clearly stating what needs to be removed, notably liquids. When you see those going through Secondary they are invariably those with at least some liquid item they have left in the bag, despite all the signs, the warnings in Highlife, the messages on the transfer buses, the let-us-say assertive advice by HAL agents. I appreciate that in other airports there is a laissez-faire approach, but what happens at LHR is pretty much mirrored in CDG, BRU, AMS, FRA, Then watch the reaction of those who have lost items to security despite the rules not having changed significantly in 11 years. One gender tends to overdo the liquids, the other gender tends to kick off about their treatment. The HAL security team is huge, and there are one or two bad eggs in there. But generally they are more sinned against than sinners, some of the reaction from passengers is quite unacceptable. And I know that a lot of people simply try it on: they just don't expect to be caught.
Help is at hand, HAL is in trials of the AMS scanning equipment and software, which allows everything, including PCs and liquids, to stay in the bags. I don't think the trial has got to the passenger area of T5 yet, but apparently it will soon.
Stress might be a huge factor at security lines. And some passengers really make a big issue about everything.
Aug 20, 2018, 3:06 am
#33
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Brighton UK
Programs: BAEC-Silver, AMEX-BA Prem' Plus & Standard, Accor Gold, HH-Silver, IHG,IBIS On Business
Posts: 955
At LGW staff risk getting a strike if they consistently fail screening ( if they do it's all logged along with why). The number needed is quite high and strikes fairly rare but they do get issued from time to time & you can't have too many strikes against your name at any given time or you risk your airside pass. I dont know if HAL operate the same system but it might make staff more proactive in trying not to be some of the worst offenders as per previous comments.
Out of interest does anyone know if LTN still has the audacity to charge pax for their liquids bags? We try to avoid the place if at all possible but I remember flying out of there once several years ago and we used LGW bags ( which are also great as sandwich bags btw) and were told they weren't acceptable as they didn't meet DfT compliance. One of LTN's team leaders and the OH had a very interesting chat about that off in a corner when the chat was opened with "I dont think YOU know what you are talking about LOVE" by the LTN staff member. Suffice to say he returned looking quite sheepish & we were allowed to use the bags we'd brought with us. They must've made a fortune ripping pax off like that.
Out of interest does anyone know if LTN still has the audacity to charge pax for their liquids bags? We try to avoid the place if at all possible but I remember flying out of there once several years ago and we used LGW bags ( which are also great as sandwich bags btw) and were told they weren't acceptable as they didn't meet DfT compliance. One of LTN's team leaders and the OH had a very interesting chat about that off in a corner when the chat was opened with "I dont think YOU know what you are talking about LOVE" by the LTN staff member. Suffice to say he returned looking quite sheepish & we were allowed to use the bags we'd brought with us. They must've made a fortune ripping pax off like that.
Aug 20, 2018, 3:32 am
#34
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: UK
Programs: BA, U2+, SK, AF/KL, IHG, Hilton, others gathering dust...
Posts: 2,552
My entirely non-scientific observation is that LCY appears to send a greater share of bags for secondary screening than any other airport I use regularly.
Aug 20, 2018, 3:50 am
#35
Join Date: Jul 2012
Programs: BA Gold (OWE), SAS Diamond (*G)
Posts: 584
Just to add, I am at LHR about every week and have no issues passing security at all. I actually find the staff (fasttrack) always very kind and helpfull. But do not forget. travelers are already in a bit of stress and outside their comfort zone. The signs are very clear and in such way that everybody understands them. But that does not take away that people in their stress simply forget that they have a water bottle or other liquids in their bags.
Stress might be a huge factor at security lines. And some passengers really make a big issue about everything.
Stress might be a huge factor at security lines. And some passengers really make a big issue about everything.
Aug 20, 2018, 4:09 am
#36
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: BAEC GGL
Posts: 261
It has always struck me as slightly surprising, given most airports' touchiness about photos around the security areas etc that south security is in such full view of the Galleries South lounge.
Like others, I've found the first wing staff to be generally excellent and pleasant, on the occasion I've had something pulled for secondary screening they've been efficient and pleasant and generally willing to chat. I've always thought it must be fairly extreme variation of traveller profile there between 'frequent traveller who knows the drill give or take country specifics' and 'DYKWIA the rules don't apply to me because I have an expensive ticket'
Like others, I've found the first wing staff to be generally excellent and pleasant, on the occasion I've had something pulled for secondary screening they've been efficient and pleasant and generally willing to chat. I've always thought it must be fairly extreme variation of traveller profile there between 'frequent traveller who knows the drill give or take country specifics' and 'DYKWIA the rules don't apply to me because I have an expensive ticket'
Aug 20, 2018, 4:20 am
#37
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: All over the place often South Wales and Lake District
Programs: BA Gold for Life Accor Platinum
Posts: 4,552
Theoretically so can they stay in the bags at LHR. HAL brought in scanners that could do so some years ago but Department of Transport ruled that laptops/ipads/tablets still had to come out. For teh short period it was unnecessary, it did speed things up.
Aug 20, 2018, 4:21 am
#38
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: BAEC GGL
Posts: 261
Last time I made the mistake of, in frustration at waiting 20 minutes for my bag, pointing out that the exact same bag has been through JFK and LHR security within the last 24 hours, response: 'that's not Manchester though is it' and my entire bag being decanted for re-scanning. Managed to bite my tongue rather than agreeing it wasn't as they clearly had some idea how to do their job. I generally try to have some sympathy for the people doing what can't be an easy job and following rules set by others but MAN is the exception in my book, they seem to make the same rules more onerous than anywhere else in the UK and they're actively unpleasant about it too. /rant over
Aug 20, 2018, 4:47 am
#39
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Brighton UK
Programs: BAEC-Silver, AMEX-BA Prem' Plus & Standard, Accor Gold, HH-Silver, IHG,IBIS On Business
Posts: 955
Is now the time to make those unaware that powders are being considered for additional screening UK wide? IF, and I stress that discussion is ongoing, it is introduced there's a further debate on how to handle them. The liquids bags can be pretty much any shape/ configuration of dimensions you like but they have to stick to a specific volume so do you allow pax to place both powders & liquids in one bag ( can or can't this be done is argued) and would the bags be big enough if so( more a problem for the ladies but not one that can be ignored). Or are pax allowed one bag for liquids & one for powders with the inevitable confusion this will throw at pax some of whom after all these years still seem to struggle with exactly what is & isn't a "gel, liquid or paste"
Aug 20, 2018, 6:41 pm
#40
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: London
Posts: 17,007
A bit unfair to enjoy a laugh at a stranger’s expense. Outside of the frequent traveller context, a lot of people, particularly women unfortunately, may have good reason to find a hand search to be an unpleasant prospect.
Aug 20, 2018, 7:16 pm
#41
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: IAD
Programs: BAEC Gold, Hilton Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 348
Last week in T5 first wing had to be the worst passenger ever in front of me. On her phone the whole time, had her liquids in a bag that had split open so wouldn't pass. Grunted when the screener pointed this out, so the screener went to get a new bag, then couldn't fit everything in it. Pax completely oblivious to holding up the queue, being rude to the screener trying to help. Eventually the screener was able to get her to pay some attention, she discarded a vial and moved on. Meanwhile, I was suggesting to people joining the queue on my side that they should use the other side... myself being captive of the tray having been sent forward. What a mess. Staff 10 points. Passenger 0 - definite DYKWIA nominee.
Aug 20, 2018, 7:59 pm
#42
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Somewhere between SFO and LAX...FYI aka FAT
Programs: BAEC - back to lowly blue. Marriott - Lifetime Platinum
Posts: 466
Funny, last June in T5 I sent my liquid bag through with items sticking out of it (would not close) and it passed through. Guess I was lucky.
As far as the pat down goes, it's like those procedures you have to endure at the annual physical -- don't chat with me about it, just get it over, please.
It does seem that the secondary search people glory in going slowly, excruciatingly unwinding each cord, announcing that passengers will miss their flights if they leave anything unauthorized in their bags - there being a 45 minute wait, etc. I try hard to get through without a secondary search.
As far as the pat down goes, it's like those procedures you have to endure at the annual physical -- don't chat with me about it, just get it over, please.
It does seem that the secondary search people glory in going slowly, excruciatingly unwinding each cord, announcing that passengers will miss their flights if they leave anything unauthorized in their bags - there being a 45 minute wait, etc. I try hard to get through without a secondary search.
Aug 20, 2018, 9:57 pm
#44
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: SYD
Programs: BAEC GGL, HH D, QFF, EB
Posts: 404
Last week in T5 first wing had to be the worst passenger ever in front of me. On her phone the whole time, had her liquids in a bag that had split open so wouldn't pass. Grunted when the screener pointed this out, so the screener went to get a new bag, then couldn't fit everything in it. Pax completely oblivious to holding up the queue, being rude to the screener trying to help. Eventually the screener was able to get her to pay some attention, she discarded a vial and moved on. Meanwhile, I was suggesting to people joining the queue on my side that they should use the other side... myself being captive of the tray having been sent forward. What a mess. Staff 10 points. Passenger 0 - definite DYKWIA nominee.
At that point security took pity on me and let me through so I don't know what else they still had stashed in their pockets.